Which way do I go? I Need camera help.
 

Ok so I have been shooting as a contractor for a company for a while and this year decided to start on my own. I currently have six jobs booked and talking to a few more. I shoot with a PD-170 but need to get more cameras. I can a) buy another pd-170 (used) and a vx2100 to get me going or b) sell my camera and buy 3 HD cameras. I am a big Sony man so I have been kind of looking at staying with Sony. I love the Z5U, but buying three of them plus other equipment is a little steep. I thought about buying one and then buying some lower priced cameras, maybe even used. Here is a list of cameras I could use some input on, also how will any of these cameras pictures match up.

Z5U, FX1000, V1U, FX7, A1U, Z1U, FX1 also how about the HD1000U?

Thanks in advance for everyone's help and opinions.

Why buy three lower quality cameras when you only need two? So buy two better quality cameras like the EX1 or perhaps Z7U. Or an EX3 and a cheaper TR12 for pickup shots?

Get well away from PD170's or VX2100's. Old hat for people coming into the business.It would be false economy and you would be forever playing catchup.

Hi Adam,

I'd suggest two FX1000 and a smaller camera as a backup - something like the Canon HV20, 30 or 40. There are so many options right now and none of them is perfect for most people like the VX and PD used to be. So many recording format options, chip types and media choices. Its dizzying. Standardization just doesn't seem to be on the horizon.

What about one Z5 + 2 FX1000's - if the budget is there, they are basically the same sensor and optics, just might be confusing with similar feel, but some different features. If the secondary cams are unmanned or by "help", simpler is probably better anyway.

In the Sony nomenclature, Z is the "pro" version of the FX "prosumer" cam, same for the Z1/FX1, not sure why the V1/FX 7 didn't conform to that...

If budget is really tight, might take a look at the new XR500/520 for multi-angle/backups, and one "big" cam.

It'd be worth your time to peruse the dedicated threads/forums on DVi for these cameras to familiarize a bit with what users are reporting - the Z5/FX1000 is getting pretty good reviews, FWIW. It is of course the "newest" offering, with the others you mentioned being several years old now.

I have to agree with Dave, Z5 + FX1000.

Or if budget doesnt permit, i would say Z1 + FX1.

Check out the different Sony section on this forum to get a sense of the camera.

DONT waste your money on the HD1000U. An hv30 would be alot better than that, even though the hd1000u is in the shape of a professional shoulder mount.

If I were you I would get a Z5 plus FX1000 or the FX7 if budget is tight, but definitely the Z5 is a must.

Stelios

I hear all you guys recommending the Z5 for weddings. What about the rolling shutter/during flash issue, or is this really a overstated problem? I too was considering a Z5 but hell everyone has me scared to death about the rolling shutter issue. Im now considering the HMC150. Your knowledge would be helpful.

Thank you

Rolling shutter is affecting at two situations. Flash are just one of them and are totally manageable since majority of the views don't have a clue what's happening - flash is flash for them.

I thing more important draw back of during fast pans - the frames gets jittered (sp?). You have to pan slowly. With weddings it's not a problem since most of the work is based on smooth movement of the camera. But if you plan to shoot action/horror movies then it might be an issue.

I guess you should test it out first before making final decision.

Go HD, go with your budget, buy the best you can afford,
good luck.

Well, it's that or "CCD smear" <wink>. RS is an issue if your camera technique is bad - but HD is just plain less forgiving of "bad operator" issues... CCD OR CMOS aside you can't whip the camera around or bounce it all over the place... good technique takes care of THAT part of the RS issue. You may have some issues with fast motion or fast moving objects, but that's nothing that most ANY camera won't face in some form.

As far as the "flash" problem, the partial exposures are a shock at first, particularly when you're trying to slo mo the footage. BUT as stated, most viewers won't notice (I'm seeing footage with partial frames all the time on TV in news or other footage), and it's a timing issue that determines whether you get partial or full frames and how much is affected... it can vary greatly.

Then again, I've looked back on SD footage with CCD's, and flash didn't treat THOSE frames any too delicately either... just no "partials", instead the whole frame typically looked like poo, pixelization and scrambling galore...

Everyone that complains about rolling shutter are the guys that don't even own one of these cameras. I have been using a Sony Z7 for a while now and not once has anyone said why is the flash like that, it happens so fast it just looks like a normal flash.

Listen to guys that own these cameras not to guys that don't and i but you would get a positive answer every time. Go the Z5 or Z7 or Ex1 make sure your camera has XLR inputs christal clear audio is vital

"Everyone that complains about rolling shutter are the guys that don't even own one of these cameras."

Not so. I own an FX1000 and I despise the rolling shutter. I also own an HMC150. I'll take the HMC150 any day over the FX1000. I'm trying to sell the FX right now and it appears there's not much demand for it. It's a brand new camera and B&H will only pay $1600 for it. That says a lot about how "not so great" these Sony cameras truly are.

How much you want for it? I think with the economy things are really tight, so used gear, particularly high end, isn't moving as well as it used to, but $1600 seems awfully low to me, like at least $1k low... that's 1/2 of list price, isn't it?

I'm sure the HMC150 is a nice camera, and may be better than the FX1000 (which IMO should have ditched the tape...), but the FX1000 isn't THAT bad a camera from what I've seen.

FWIW, I've dealt with RS for a while, and while it's not terrific, it's not a deal breaker for most uses. And I've never had any complaints about it from clients/viewers. (and yes, it does bug me a little!)

Where were you a week ago when I was buying mine????

Why are you selling it and what are you using it for?

Thank you everyone for the comments and please keep them coming. I ordered the Z5U yesterday, so I am hoping it is here by Wednesday. I am still debating on weather to order another Z5U or the FX1000 as a second camera. I also need a third as a back up camera, and was thinking maybe a FX7 or even just the HDR-HC9(for now). I guess everything depends how many more jobs I can book from now till the end of May when I have a three camera shoot booked.

Once again thanks to all that responded and helped steer me in the right direction. I will post my thoughts on the Z5U when it gets in.

dude, send it back. you made a HUGE mistake being a Sony fanboy. I have an EX1,
and I HATE the rolling shutter. Your Z5 doesn't even come with Sony's CF recorder,
which makes the HMC150 that much better of a buy for $3200. the only thing keeping
my EX1 in my bag is i don't want to take a huge loss on it, or it be gone for a 2nd
panasonic. Seriously, the 150 is an outstanding camera for the price, you won't be sorry,
and this is coming from a Sony fanboy himself, but for event work, CMOS sucks.

"Why are you selling it and what are you using it for?"

I shoot weddings. The main reasons I'm selling it:

1) It would be easier in the field to shoot with 2 same model cameras as opposed to 2 cams with totally different controls/menus.

2) I want to be totally tapeless. Mount a light on the cam's shoe and there's nowhere to mount the CF recorder, plus the thought of running a firewire cable from the CF recorder to the rear of the camera is scary. With the connector sticking out the back of the camera, all it takes is a slight bump to break the firewire port.

3) Rolling shutter/CMOS. My typical 1st dance sequence is 80% slomo. This sequence often contains a bazillion camera flashes. I don't like slomo footage with white bands in it. Unlike a full frame flash, it looks like a camera defect (it is!). I refuse to change the style of my finished product to accomodate this camera's flaw.

4) Aweful balance, far too front heavy and just plain heavy.

5) No XLR inputs (this isn't a huge factor).

6) HMC150 is a far better camera for the same price.

To answer the other poster's question... I want $2900 firm for the FX1000 including a 970 battery. If I can't get $2900 for it, I'll keep it and use it exclusively as my rear, unmanned, wide shot camera.

We're wedding professionals so here's our 2p - we use three Z1s working exclusively in HDV. Flash in low light can cause pixelation in the editing image (Liquid 7.2) but these frames are "returned" to flash when converted to DVD or Blu-Ray (TMPGEnc Express 4 and DVD-Lab/TMPGEnc Authoring 4). Just our experience, not a condemnation of anyone else's views.

I'm with Scott and Norman on this one - 'CMOS sucks for wedding and event work', and I've posted my thoughts here a lot. Robert's right in that 'it happens so fast that you don't notice it' but it's slo-mo that CMOS+flash totally destroys.

However, now you're committed to the Z5 the FX1000 is a good second camera in my view. I always say you should have a back-up camera that you'd be perfectly happy to use if your main camera failed for whatever reason, and the FX would anser that call.

But the real reason I say go for that over buying another Z5 is (apart from the cost) the ability to run it in the LP mode. There have been countless times when my FX1 in LP has saved the day - when the bride's been very late, when my main cam has had to have tapes changed and so on.

If you're delivering on DVD rather than Blu-ray then it makes a lot of sense, and the Z1 and FX1 happly pay my wages.

tom.