Sharing full length video online... at DVinfo.net

Lukas Siewior · April 29th, 2010, 07:06 PM

Recently more and more customers are asking me about possibility to share their full-length video online, so their friends and family who lives abroad could watch it online, instead of waiting for dvd's to arrive in mail.

So I was curious if anyone could suggest a good solution - any good hosting service which would be able to handle big files? How would you compress the video? MP4 file format? SD resolution? How much an hour of video can be compressed and still retain good quality?

Thanks,
Lukas

Chris Harding · April 29th, 2010, 08:30 PM

Hi Lukas

I currently don't host a full video but around 10 minutes in FLV format at 512kbs so you get fairly good quality video. My 10 minute files are around the 40mb mark so I guess you are looking at around 250mb - 300mb at that bitrate.

I use my current host powweb as they give me unlimited space and unlimited bandwidth for under $10 a month so hosting on a standard hosting account is quite practical now.

I use the free player from mediacollege in New Zealand and it runs pretty well. I guess the real answer is to go with a dedicated streaming sever host but that will probably cost you an arm and a leg!!!

Places like YouTube do limit your video to 10 minutes so that's not a solution!!

Chris

Raymond Tsang · April 29th, 2010, 11:47 PM

Lukas,

Have you tried Vimeo? A Vimeo Plus account gives you a 1GB limit per week per file (5GB per week total).

We compress 720p files anywhere from 4000 to 5000mbps and it gives excellent results. By using a lower bitrate and/or compressing to SD, you can easily upload an hour-long film that's under 1GB. You can try exporting to h.264 or .mp4. They both work fine.

You can test out the quality on a Vimeo free account as well (allows for 500 MB of storage per week).

ray

Chris Davis · April 30th, 2010, 07:13 AM

Vimeo's TOS clearly states that businesses may not use Vimeo to externalize their hosting costs (even Vimeo Plus subscribers.)

I have a new-found respect for YouTube. Their TOS has changed and it is A-OK to use them as a video hosting service for businesses. Yes, they have a 10 minute limit, but you can upload the video in 10 minute chunks, set them to "private" and create a custom player. It will play those chunks in sequence and you can embed that custom player on a web page.

Another option would be to create smaller chapters as individual flash video files and set up an XML playlist for FLV Player.

Chris Harding · April 30th, 2010, 07:37 AM

Hi Chris

Very good point too!! In fact I have changed from hosting my own samples to using a custom YT player and playlist and I must admit that it loads a lot quicker too!! The custom player is really neat and you get a thumbnail menu on the left.

There would be no problem with doing sequential 10 minute clips and then people could watch all 6 (if it's a one hour video) The YT custom playlist also allow you to decide the sequence of the clips!! Apart from extra long ceremonies and long speeches, most clips of a wedding would be under 10 minutes anyway!!

When I do a wedding onto DVD, my final files are short clips anyway and run sequentially via the DVD menu...sort of bridal prep,arrival, ceremony congratulations etc etc and there is no reason why you couldn't split a long ceremony/speech up for the online stuff!! (one clip for the opening prayers, one for the vows, one for the readings etc etc)

Chris

Gerald Labrador · April 30th, 2010, 09:52 AM

I'm currently trying to share a full length copy also. I used Encore to author the DVD and was going to try the "export to flash" feature. The problem is, I don't have all the files anymore. Is there another option of getting a DVD to Flash, similar to how Encore would have made (full motion menus, etc)?

Peter Ralph · April 30th, 2010, 01:27 PM

Vimeo do have all sorts of clauses limiting "business" use - but search the forums. It seems they are fine with "creatives" using vimeo to promote their work.

Musicians, authors, photographers as well as videographers and film-makers get a break.

Michael Clark · April 30th, 2010, 02:14 PM

The youtube custom player sounds like a workable solution, although I've never been a fan of their conversion. I will look into it though. Does anyone happen to already have a link on how to set one up?

Chris Harding · April 30th, 2010, 05:26 PM

Hi Michael

The link USED to be under your account settings but mine has vanished!!! However, just log into your YT account and then use this link http://www.youtube.com/custom_player

That will enable you to make a custom player and also assign a unique playlist to it (like just your wedding samples or maybe just one wedding for a client)

Works very well actually

Chris

Lukas Siewior · April 30th, 2010, 05:31 PM

Thx guys.

YT 10 min limit is annoying. What about rapidshare or other file sharing sites? I could upload whole video as one file and let the customer download it and play it on his own PC.

Chris Davis · April 30th, 2010, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Clark

The youtube custom player sounds like a workable solution, although I've never been a fan of their conversion.

Give them another try. I think you'll like the improvements they've made.

Mike Harvey · April 30th, 2010, 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Davis

Vimeo's TOS clearly states that businesses may not use Vimeo to externalize their hosting costs (even Vimeo Plus subscribers.)

I've read, re-read, and re-re-read that section. A business may not use Vimeo as a web hosting solution. HOWEVER... the content creator may (unless they've changed this very recently).

In other words, if Joe's Vehicle Repair and Spatula Emporium wants to use Vimeo to host their promotional video, they can't. However, if the person who they hired to create the video wants to host it and embed it into their own website, they may. If you created a wedding film, you can embed it into your own website.

They are pretty specific say that the content creator may do so. The exception is that you can't link to a webpage that you have to pay to see.

So I can embed every video I've created on my business website, because I created them and I'm showcasing them to my potential clients. I just can't embed it onto a page I charge people to get to.

Chris Davis · May 1st, 2010, 07:37 AM

You point out a subtle difference, and I agree that your usage would most likely fall within Vimeo's TOS (showcasing your work as a content creator.) But in the case of the OP, he is clearly looking for a hosting solution to provide a service to clients, not just to showcase random pieces of work.

Don't forget this week at Joe's, buy nine spatulas and get the 10th one free.

Dave Stern · May 5th, 2010, 09:26 AM

I use Vimeo too... like it very much and the new work on stats is great.

In the OP, what's the difference between sharing directly with the customer, and also sharing with their relatives.

My interpretation of the key issues vimeo is dealing with in their TOS is:
1. Must be content creator's work - like in our example their business model isn't to host promo's, advertising, etc. Having the content creator as the owner / poster drives towards their business model, even if that content creator is the sharer - they allow a high number of streams, so the distribution isn't as much of their concern as the business model - they want creative content served where the poster is sharing for creative purposes, not for commercial transactions (e.g. ads served).
2. Can't make money off of the views from their site - I think this is related to copyright ownership and their role, even if they don't receive payment, for potential copyright infringement if they are serving content that someone is charging for.

I would love it if they (or sorenson 360) could enable a payment process for a view view, with some portion for serving the video and the rest to me as the content creator. I could distribute this way rather than DVD. However there are so many complexities here re content ownership that this must be why they stay away.

Comments?

April 29th, 2010, 07:06 PM	#1
Lukas Siewior Major Player Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lyndhurst, NJ, USA Posts: 408	Sharing full length video online... Recently more and more customers are asking me about possibility to share their full-length video online, so their friends and family who lives abroad could watch it online, instead of waiting for dvd's to arrive in mail. So I was curious if anyone could suggest a good solution - any good hosting service which would be able to handle big files? How would you compress the video? MP4 file format? SD resolution? How much an hour of video can be compressed and still retain good quality? Thanks, Lukas

April 30th, 2010, 02:14 PM	#8
Michael Clark Major Player Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Chattanooga, TN Posts: 244	The youtube custom player sounds like a workable solution, although I've never been a fan of their conversion. I will look into it though. Does anyone happen to already have a link on how to set one up? __________________ www.clarkvideoproductions.com

April 29th, 2010, 08:30 PM	#2
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Lukas I currently don't host a full video but around 10 minutes in FLV format at 512kbs so you get fairly good quality video. My 10 minute files are around the 40mb mark so I guess you are looking at around 250mb - 300mb at that bitrate. I use my current host powweb as they give me unlimited space and unlimited bandwidth for under $10 a month so hosting on a standard hosting account is quite practical now. I use the free player from mediacollege in New Zealand and it runs pretty well. I guess the real answer is to go with a dedicated streaming sever host but that will probably cost you an arm and a leg!!! Places like YouTube do limit your video to 10 minutes so that's not a solution!! Chris

April 29th, 2010, 11:47 PM	#3
Raymond Tsang Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: san francisco, ca Posts: 90	Lukas, Have you tried Vimeo? A Vimeo Plus account gives you a 1GB limit per week per file (5GB per week total). We compress 720p files anywhere from 4000 to 5000mbps and it gives excellent results. By using a lower bitrate and/or compressing to SD, you can easily upload an hour-long film that's under 1GB. You can try exporting to h.264 or .mp4. They both work fine. You can test out the quality on a Vimeo free account as well (allows for 500 MB of storage per week). ray

April 30th, 2010, 07:13 AM	#4
Chris Davis Trustee Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Willmar, MN Posts: 1,400	Vimeo's TOS clearly states that businesses may not use Vimeo to externalize their hosting costs (even Vimeo Plus subscribers.) I have a new-found respect for YouTube. Their TOS has changed and it is A-OK to use them as a video hosting service for businesses. Yes, they have a 10 minute limit, but you can upload the video in 10 minute chunks, set them to "private" and create a custom player. It will play those chunks in sequence and you can embed that custom player on a web page. Another option would be to create smaller chapters as individual flash video files and set up an XML playlist for FLV Player.

April 30th, 2010, 07:37 AM	#5
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Chris Very good point too!! In fact I have changed from hosting my own samples to using a custom YT player and playlist and I must admit that it loads a lot quicker too!! The custom player is really neat and you get a thumbnail menu on the left. There would be no problem with doing sequential 10 minute clips and then people could watch all 6 (if it's a one hour video) The YT custom playlist also allow you to decide the sequence of the clips!! Apart from extra long ceremonies and long speeches, most clips of a wedding would be under 10 minutes anyway!! When I do a wedding onto DVD, my final files are short clips anyway and run sequentially via the DVD menu...sort of bridal prep,arrival, ceremony congratulations etc etc and there is no reason why you couldn't split a long ceremony/speech up for the online stuff!! (one clip for the opening prayers, one for the vows, one for the readings etc etc) Chris

April 30th, 2010, 09:52 AM	#6
Gerald Labrador Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 55	I'm currently trying to share a full length copy also. I used Encore to author the DVD and was going to try the "export to flash" feature. The problem is, I don't have all the files anymore. Is there another option of getting a DVD to Flash, similar to how Encore would have made (full motion menus, etc)?

April 30th, 2010, 01:27 PM	#7
Peter Ralph Major Player Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Denver/Vail Colorado Posts: 254	Vimeo do have all sorts of clauses limiting "business" use - but search the forums. It seems they are fine with "creatives" using vimeo to promote their work. Musicians, authors, photographers as well as videographers and film-makers get a break.

April 30th, 2010, 05:26 PM	#9
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Hi Michael The link USED to be under your account settings but mine has vanished!!! However, just log into your YT account and then use this link http://www.youtube.com/custom_player That will enable you to make a custom player and also assign a unique playlist to it (like just your wedding samples or maybe just one wedding for a client) Works very well actually Chris

April 30th, 2010, 05:31 PM	#10
Lukas Siewior Major Player Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lyndhurst, NJ, USA Posts: 408	Thx guys. YT 10 min limit is annoying. What about rapidshare or other file sharing sites? I could upload whole video as one file and let the customer download it and play it on his own PC.

May 1st, 2010, 07:37 AM	#13
Chris Davis Trustee Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Willmar, MN Posts: 1,400	You point out a subtle difference, and I agree that your usage would most likely fall within Vimeo's TOS (showcasing your work as a content creator.) But in the case of the OP, he is clearly looking for a hosting solution to provide a service to clients, not just to showcase random pieces of work. Don't forget this week at Joe's, buy nine spatulas and get the 10th one free.

May 5th, 2010, 09:26 AM	#14
Dave Stern Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Northern New Jersey Posts: 391	I use Vimeo too... like it very much and the new work on stats is great. In the OP, what's the difference between sharing directly with the customer, and also sharing with their relatives. My interpretation of the key issues vimeo is dealing with in their TOS is: 1. Must be content creator's work - like in our example their business model isn't to host promo's, advertising, etc. Having the content creator as the owner / poster drives towards their business model, even if that content creator is the sharer - they allow a high number of streams, so the distribution isn't as much of their concern as the business model - they want creative content served where the poster is sharing for creative purposes, not for commercial transactions (e.g. ads served). 2. Can't make money off of the views from their site - I think this is related to copyright ownership and their role, even if they don't receive payment, for potential copyright infringement if they are serving content that someone is charging for. I would love it if they (or sorenson 360) could enable a payment process for a view view, with some portion for serving the video and the rest to me as the content creator. I could distribute this way rather than DVD. However there are so many complexities here re content ownership that this must be why they stay away. Comments?