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Shooting non-repeatable events: weddings, recitals, plays, performances...

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Old March 28th, 2014, 08:02 AM   #16
Inner Circle
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Re: Micing up the father of the bride

Lineal edit? I'd just as soon stick a fork in my eye! Yep one camera, one audio source. You what that did? Taught one how to shoot and not depend on having multiple cams and audio even when you did have it.

As for going back to basics, I'm not advocating going back to 1 camera with an in camera edit. I think a lot of the newer folks around wouldn't be able to do that only because they've become dependent on multiple cameras. OK that's fair, but what I am saying is that when one goes to the other extreme, it can cause as many challenges with the client as only shooting one camera and having to dance around to get a respectable finished product.
I too believe today that 2 or even 3 cameras at a ceremony especially is a good thing to do and 2 audio sources is a good thing to do. I've done that at ceremonies and receptions for a long time but at a point there has to be a line in the sand so to speak. It becomes so redundant that there is no further benefit to more cameras or audio sources, then it becomes more time to load in, edit, match the looks since very few have multiple cameras that are the same, so it's more time that equals more money or actually less money per hour and finally it gives the client more chances to find something wrong.
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Old March 28th, 2014, 08:14 AM   #17
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Re: Micing up the father of the bride

Now that I can agree with, Don.

I do like some 'cinematic' elements when doing establishing shots, for instance, but when it comes to the main event, I'm a bigger fan of simple though effective.
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Old March 28th, 2014, 08:15 AM   #18
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Re: Micing up the father of the bride

Originally Posted by Chris Harding View Post
Hey Dave

and I could also pour boiling water on my hand!! but it's not going to happen... linear editing was a pain but with cards and NLE's things are great now of course. It was just fighting two really bad attitude recorders that used to frustrate me.

Do people seriously give the bride recorded media on the night ?? MiniDV or VHS is obviously out as they couldn't play it ..I guess a DVD camcorder might work IF they are still available ... I haven't seen them here for ages.

I'm with you 100% - there's no way I want to do it - just wondered (for giggles really) how much you thought you'd be charging!

Yes, DVD camcorders are what they are using. No edit capability, just finalise the disc at the end of the day - hopping that it actually recorded and didn't screw up and - oh BTW Mr & Mrs XYZ, did you know I couldn't actually capture everything because I ran out of disc space and didn't notice? Yes, I've heard of that happening!

Getting really tired of these low ball people, but I'm telling myself that the people who booked them wouldn't actually have booked me (at my prices) anyway, so it's not a sale I lost as such, but what is does is two things:

1) The more people have video and show their friends, the more people have video in mind when getting married

but unfortunately.....

2) if the quality is crap then it may put some people off having a video at all

You could argue that having seen how bad the cheap guys are they'd be looking for something higher quality, but if they don't realise how bad it is compared to what 'could' be done, since it's probably as good as they'd get on their iPhone, maybe they'll just keep the cheap guy going with his pocket money. Who knows? I wish I knew the answer.
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Old March 28th, 2014, 08:19 AM   #19
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Re: Micing up the father of the bride

Originally Posted by Robert Benda View Post
Ahh, but that's not entirely true, is it? You put a recorder on the groom so that you could hear the vows, for instance. We've all been in a spot where guests couldn't hear the vows at all, or some baby or coughing uncle was making noise and we'd never actually tolerate that in the video.

So what we're really talking about is degrees of non-reality.

For instance, I'm not a fan of going completely crazy into the cinematics, though I do like having 2nd and 3rd cameras for closeups of the B&G during vows and 1st dance.

Incidentally, I understand keeping it simple, but sorting those multi-cam files into order of events is easy. You just have to make sure the date/time stamp on your cameras is correct. Then, once on your computer (I label them camera A, B, and C), you sort by the time stamp.
Yes you are quite right about the guests not hearing the vows, but then I am not making the video for the guests, I am making it for the couple and they of course heard their vows. As for the sounds of a baby crying, Grandad farting or other noises, unlike you not tolerating them, I find that they are exactly the sort of things that they do want to hear and make them laugh. The baby crying may well be their own that they want to hear.

I also didn't say that sorting multi camera clips isn't easy, I said that it is a logistical nightmare. I do many multi camera shoots with up to 6 cameras and have done for 30 years, so am very aware of the procedures.

When you have one camera filming the ceremony, you edit it by letting it run through, that's it. Basically you film what you want to use. With a second camera locked off, you just simply sync the audio and again let them run, editing from one camera to the other, which ever gives the shot you want. When you are using multi cameras and operators who are taking various shots of different lengths, you then have to log each one to know where they fit into the linear length of the ceremony. It's not difficult, but it is time consuming and time is money!

My concern is less about choice of cinematic style, dof and other trendy effects, but about multi cameras and recorders being more about not missing the shot and having a different angle, rather than the skill and craftsmanship of the cameraman. Lots of cameras don't give the answers, as you well know from one of your other threads, it is the individual's skills that give great results.

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Old March 29th, 2014, 05:48 PM   #20
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Re: Micing up the father of the bride

I was once at a Jewish ceremony, and micing up the groom. The rabbi approaches and says, "Are you sure you want to put a microphone on him? The groom says all of six words." I reply, "But they're important words, right?" The father of the groom chuckles, and the rabbi smiles. "Yes, that's true. They are important words."

Thinking about it afterwards, it seemed to me that, unwittingly, there was some sort of Jewish humour/rabbinical repartee aspect to my reply.

In Catholic ceremonies, well, the father of the bride doesn't say very much either, but maybe the little he does say, all of two words, are important, and likely to be spoken in a natural voice, without any amplification. Priest: "Who gives this woman away?" Father of the bride says, "I do".

In the scheme of things, obviously it doesn't matter so much, but maybe those two words could be used to good effect in a highlights or short film video. So I think I actually will try it on at the next wedding. I've got recorders to spare anyway...
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Old March 29th, 2014, 07:03 PM   #21
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Re: Micing up the father of the bride

In our Catholic ceremonies the father walks right up to the groom with his new bride and the priest will ask the question. The father of course is standing directly opposite the groom who has a mic so no issues there at all.

Yeah Coptic ceremonies have the couple say nothing and our Greek weddings here also have not one word uttered during the ceremony but the priest is always happy to wear the mic that usually goes on the groom.

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