Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

When I can I shoot from a tripod, but for many events it is not practical. If absolutely necessary I'll use digital processing (Mercalli, Warp Stabilizer) to stabilize during post processing, but only in moderation since they can produce some weird effects if overdone.

I have a good shoulder mount rig for my JVC LS-300 which helps a lot. But the OIS in my Panasonic 12-35 f2.8 will only get me so far in capturing acceptably steady video. And even my widest non-stabilized primes are pretty iffy.

It seems that there are shooting techniques that make the camera motion less noticeable, such as:

Using pans and zooms to mask any unintended camera motion;

Using subject movement to draw attention away from unintended camera motion.

Are there others?

Thanks for any suggestions.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Buy a Panasonic gx80 and get tripod like footage with a unstablished 75mm prime lens :)
Besides what you already have mentioned there is not much you can do if you want to shoot handheld.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I shoot all my handheld with a gimbal now and it works wonders. Guests arrivals for the Ceremony then post Ceremony to Speeches, nearly all shot on a gimbal. It has taken my run n gun work too new level and liberated me.

I use the GH4 with the 12-35 and just love filming with them both.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I don't find that my gimbal or steadicam replaces my handheld work, there is a difference between handholding a camera from a stationary position and having full control over it compared to moving on a gimbal having no controll over it and either have to trust on auto functionality or preset before you shoot. Gimbals are an addition to handheld shooting but no replacement.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I've never got shoulder rigs. Buy a third party eyecup and shove your eyeball in the evf. You don't see much wobble with your eyes do you? Similarly, if your camera is glued to it. Your head is the next best thing to a gimbal.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Seriously Noa, you've clearly got the wrong gimbal. I use mine for all handheld work. I've seen my handheld work for personal use when out walking. Okay to a point, but no comparison. I use a monopod for some run n gun work, but it's very limited.

My gimbal is all in the wrist movement. No presets or controls. I just turn my wrist to get the right angle and shot. If you're keeping movement steady then you may as well use a monopod; I find it gets great stable footage with any lens and more reliable than internal stabilisation. Sure you have an extra weight to move around and an incumbrance, but a useful tool if you can adapt to shooting that way.

The gimbal gives me movement; to change and alter angle of shot without having to cut in edit. I once used it for handheld in a Ceremony. I was able to zoom in and keep it steady at 35mm (70mm full frame equivalent). I never use handheld except for dance footage as even with the most stable of hand, the footage can suffer. That's why I prefer the monopod for static shots and a gimbal for movement.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Not sure if you understood me, there is a difference between a steadicam shot and a handheld shot, one is intended to move during a shot and the other not, one is having control over your camera during a shot, the other is having no or very limited control over your camera during a shot. A steadicam or gimbal has it's place and if you use it when it matters it can make a difference but to shoot an entire day with a gimbal is like using a slider all day long.

I tested yesterday with my 80-210mm (420mm full frame equivalent) tamron lens on my gx80 and was able to keep it steady at 420mm, can you do that on your gimbal? Or 2 days ago I shot a lot with my 75mm prime lens handheld and those shots look like they are almost done on a tripod, 75mm is 150mm full frame equivalent if you might not know, seriously Steve, it looks like you clearly have a wrong gimbal :)

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Steve, do you mind me asking what gimbal are you using ?

Thanks.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

He is using a right one.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I'm using the Mini Sturdy Flight. Company producing them, if they still do is in Italy.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Really Noa, petulance doesn't become you. :)

Need I remind you that what sits in your GX80 and allows your smooth handheld footage is a miniature version of the same tech sitting inside my gimbal, more or less. What's the difference? Why is 1 more handheld than the other?

I obviously missed the memo that tells me my gimbal is not designed for general handheld footage and limited only to those sweeping, circling shots of the couple to be found in many Wedding Highlights Videos. I do use mine for handheld footage, whatever your thoughts on the matter.
When I used it for the Ceremony, necessary as before and after I was moving about a lot, I was mostly static. Zoomed in at 35mm, capturing the same shots of the couple as if I was filming on a monopod. Similarly for the Reception, there is a mix of movement and static, again using the gimbal for convenience and because re-adjusting my position is smoother and easier with a gimbal than my other preferred choice of a monopod.

You say I can't use my 75mm on my gimbal. Why not? Did I miss a memo telling me it can't be done. I'm clearly not getting those memos. :) If I rebalanced the gimbal for the 75mm, keep myself and the gimbal as still as possible, what's the difference between such footage captured by my external stabiliser and footage from the GX80 with its internal stabiliser.

Well the big one of course is an internal stabiliser doesn't need rebalancing. Big marks to the GX80 IS and why I hope such tech will find its way to the GH5. That said I won't use it for handheld 75mm. I stick to my monopod and tripod there and rely on IS to smooth out the odd jitter that can appear in longer focal lengths. It would also be useful when using others lenses and when I don't have the gimbal to hand.

As someone who uses both gimbal and slider at every Wedding, I find the suggestion that each is as limited in use as the other frankly bonkers. I shot 90% of a Marryoke with a Gimbal, could never have done that with a slider.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

As someone who has used a steadycam and shot more handheld during a wedding then most users here for years I think I can say that I know the difference between the two, steadicam and handheld shooting is not the same, I can repeat why but it's clear you don't read that part so there is no use discussing this any further.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I'm sorry you feel that way. On the contrary I have read what you had to say and appreciate that handheld is different to stabiliser, but there is no reason a gimbal can't be useful in a similar way that handheld can be. On mine, I am able to pull focus, change some settings as long as I am careful without any noticeable shake. I don't always have to be in motion too. Some of the shots I am getting are of a kind some here would grab handheld. It is just 1 solution and no better than any others. True you lose some of the benefits of handheld; swiftly change of lenses and being able to put the camera down and pick up as needed. I agree with your points that unless 1 employs additional tech, getting smoother shots handheld will be very difficult.

When it comes to freeing yourself from a tripod and wanting shake free footage, you have the options of a shoulder rig, a gimbal or stabiliser, a monopod or rely on the cameras IS. Each has their strengths and weaknesses and in some cases, relies on you picking the best tool that fits your shooting style.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

OK, thanks Steve.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Hi Noa

Apart from my main camera for ceremony and speeches ALL my B-Cam work is handheld ..and yes I do agree that it's nothing like stedicam or gimbal shots ... my little Panny's have a 5 axis OIS in them and to be honest my handhelds are pretty much wobble free (unless I'm backing up and walk into a guest) and a LOT better than my old shoulder mount shots. Maybe this is taken way too far. Take a look at modern TV productions and watch the top frame and you will see that it's a handheld shot ..people never complain about the odd frame movement as long as the content is good. We are getting way too technical in producing absolutely perfect shots with zero movement. If the big studios can produce shows with the odd bit of movement and people don't complain then why try and get everything so clinical?? A bit of movement is natural and I have never had a bride comment about it. Is it really necessary Steve to have clinically perfect non movement footage??

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

It has nothing to do about "how I feel", it's just common sense to me that a steadycam is no substitute or replacement for handheld shooting, there is a hugh difference in handholding the camera and actually operating it manually in a run and gun situation compared to using it on a steadicam or gimbal where you are mainly controlling the gimbal but not the camera.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Actually I was referring to your remark "I can repeat why but it's clear you don't read that part so there is no use discussing this any further." when I apologised that you felt that way and not on your opinion regarding steadicam and handheld. I feel we've entered an impasse. I'm not disputing what you say; we're arguing semantics here. I'm looking at handheld from a different perspective maybe - perhaps approaching from a different mindset. No offence intended.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I seem to be digging myself a hole. I'm not refuting handheld, saying its wrong to use it by any means. My GH4 doesn't have 5 axis OIS. So if I didn't use a gimbal, I'd be technically at a disadvantage when compared to your camera and my footage could be shakier because of it. My footage isn't clinically perfect. I just take advantage of the gimbal in the way you take advantage of your 5 axis OIS. Same tech basically or at least same purpose, just different equipment.

Going back to the original question. If using a shoulder rig, to disguise camera wobble you have got to have either the camera image in motion (panning, zooming included) or have the subjects themselves moving. Or both for that matter. Camera wobble only becomes most noticeable when you're trying to hold the camera still on non moving subjects. That is the draw back of shooting handheld. Perhaps a minor one depending on what you shoot. If stable footage is important in such cases, then you need to think about either some form of stabiliser (external or internal) or use a monopod. Though none of these options are handheld, they do allow you more freedom when shooting run n gun than a tripod.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

With the main difference that I"m controlling my camera and you are not, once it's recording you almost can't touch it anymore, see the difference? I am handholding a camera and can adjust every setting on the fly while you can't, you have to deactivate the gimbal, change a setting on your camera, activate the gimbal and start shooting again, while that will work in certain situations it won't in many others.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

In that reply you're referring to Noa, I was simply answering Chris' question as to whether I was aiming for clinically perfect shots with my gimbal, and my reply was there not as a comment on our discussions, but merely to suggest the gimbal was working for me in the way the 5 axis OIS was for Chris.

I appreciate that handheld has some advantages over the gimbal, but some disadvantages too. That said, I can adjust focus, I have placed a ND filter on and off, plus made some minor setting changes without turning off the gimbal. I have footage of that if you feel proof is needed. It is true some gimbals go haywire or so I've heard if you dare touch the camera. Perhaps because I have some cable attached to the hotshoe, mine does respond well and I can even turn on the camera once the gimbal is activated if I have forgotten to do so before hand. Tilting the screen is also possible. I have to be careful using the wheels, but basic button presses are possible. I have adjusted ISO on the fly and exposure compensation, switched on and off peaking. Again, without switching off the gimbal. So I have focus control, exposure control, ISO control, peaking control; all without turning off the gimbal. Can't adjust volume though, changing menu settings would be tricky. So yes, I'm pretty restricted there compared to handheld. When I get a moment, I shall have to upload a video demonstrating this.

I suppose from my perspective, I use the monopod in the way you use handheld, so for me the difference is rather between the monopod and gimbal as opposed to handheld and stabiliser for you. In that I can see clear differences as you describe. Before the gimbal however, I only ever handheld the camera for walking back down the confetti line and for moving around the dance footage; in those cases, I have found the gimbal has replaced such shots when possible.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

That again is very different, I can move to the left or right handheld while you have to lift a monopod to change position, handheld will give you more freedom to move your camera around. A monopod is only good if you want more controlled static shots with some panning motion. With my gx80 at the last wedding I was able to use the camera from different heights and angles in a much quicker way that ever could do on a monopod without having any restriction where I held my camera as opposed of having a leg dangling under your camera that often gets in the way.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Nevertheless, that's how I use it. We film different ways Noa. I can't zoom with my camera either, so I don't try. I can use my monopod at different heights, holding it above my head. Useful for some dancefloors and occasionally at Ceremonies where field of view is blocked. I'm not knocking handheld or saying its wrong to use it. I just don't use it the way you do. Personal preference you can call it.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I"m only saying as you make it sound it's the same, it isn't.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Thanks, Steve. While the discussion of stabilizers, gimbals, monopods, and 5-axis in-camera stabilization are interesting, I'm trying to minimize the noticeable wobble/shake of my LS-300 when on my shoulder mount. So technique, rather than different equipment is my focus. I have tried a monopod and my experience thus far is that it is not quite as stable as my shoulder rig, which is very heavy and uses its inertia to dampen camera movement.

My original post was a reaction to watching the live feed from a cameraman following a group during a televised golf tournament. He was using a large shoulder mount camera and kept the camera in continuous motion (slight pans and zooms) so any wobble/shake was not noticeable. That prompted the question as to whether there were additional techniques I could employ in my shooting.

I'm pretty much a newbie when it comes to serious video, so the collective wisdom of the forum is very much appreciated.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I can't really think of any other techniques that are available. Unless you're swinging your camera about, wobble will only become really obvious in static shots, so keeping the camera or your subjects in motion will disguise it. Moving your camera without going overboard is the real skill, keeping such movement subtle where needed whilst still being effective in hiding the shake. In that case, I would say practise is your best answer. The more you shoot, the more accomplished your technique. As Chris said, there is leeway when it comes to camera movement and it doesn't have to be perfect. Just not as bad as novices' home movies, but then that's a pretty low bar..

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I have a ls300 and use the 12-35mm lens on it so I can tell you what I have done to stabilize handheld shooting, I got a small springloaded monopod which was too long but that I cut to custom length and I have a tactical vest from lowepro where this monopod is attached to, you can ofcourse also suspend it from a belt but I have found that you get a bit more unwanted motion when you move. The monopod takes all the weight out of my hands and the spring inside the monopod helps keeping it more stable. It's not perfect but I find my handheld footage pretty stable.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Steve, Noa

Thank you for your suggestions.

Regards,
Luke

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

If you have a shoulder mount then the sprung rod is brilliant .. I had one for my Sony EA-50's and being very front heavy, the rod and waist belt helped a LOT ...definitely worth getting. Most prosumer cameras or cameras that go onto a shoulder mount are very badly balanced ..I think the only exception is the JVC 700 or 800 series where if you put the camera on your shoulder it's neither front or back heavy which is more important to achieve if you are shooting from the shoulder. Just for interest I got my sprung rod from Camtree in India for the mere $60 .... It does need a bit of cleaning up so the rod pieces slide smoothly however the actual belt was useless so I just grabbed a LowePro fanny bag and used the belt from that and stitched a pocket in that. On my Panny's I'm currently using just a very simple piece of aluminium flat bar under the camera with a handle each side which gives me a two handed grip but for long winded processionals my arms get tired so I would like a mini support rod that is sprung to keep it stable. Where did you find a monopod section that was sprung Noa???

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I have a shoulder mount but stopped using it because it was counter productive. While it did a great job distributing weight back to my shoulder making it easier to hold, the wide handles in the front acted like levers that multiplied the camera's yaw. Like putting your camera on the end of a sea saw a little motion on one end creates a lot on the other end.

I've found monopod a good compromise. Like others have said the inability to touch your camera on a gimbal/steady cam and complexity of setup and operation make it a challenge to use.

I've found that it's not hard to hold a camera until you strap on all manner of accessory and when a 5 minute speech turns into 20 minutes.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I raise my monopod all the time :) Very useful on multiple occasions when there are too many people!

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Same place where you got it which was by far the cheapest I could find, it was also easy to modify.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Well I'm still rocking the Steadicam Merlin so I'm very much behind the times but for me I only use it for a small part of the day, as a solo shooter I tend to play it safe! The rest of the time I use my monopod tucked into a Manfrotto belt pouch and I can get rock steady shots - way better than hand held or shoulder mount. Also I can perform a few limited pans and tilts (I use a manfrotto tilt head and keep the tilt loose) - I've only started to use this technique this year but it's made a massive difference to the way I film and saved me a lot of back ache in the process.

It's a pretty cheap Libec monopod (my Manfrotto ones are too long) with a Manfrottoo #200 tilt head and QR base - works a treat for steady shots! While not exactly a technique - a bit of kit not to be overlooked

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

AFAIK the DVTEC Multirig was the first rig to offer the sprung rod & belt support Multi Rig camera support DSLR SHOULDER MOUNT - ***** DVTEC camera supports There are lots of Multirig knock offs available very cheaply now
DSLR Rig Support Rod Belt fit Shoulder Mount Video Camcorder Camera DV DSLR?UK? | eBay
Retractable Waist DSLR Rig Support Rod and Belt with 3/8" Screw fit. | eBay

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

That actually looks better than the Camtree ones from India ... Neewer mades quite a few things nowdays and that has neater fittings than the Camtree one.

Thanks Noa ..I was confused when you said "monopod" ...... You could quite easily also make one with some tube and a spring but they are so cheap it's hardly worth it!!

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Smooth shoulder technique: Last Saturday I was shooting a reception with people dancing and moving a lot. I was shoulder with my EA50. At one point I kind of laughed to myself at a realization I had. I am currently trying to learn to use my Blackbird with a dual arm vest. Anyone learning steadycam will be hearing a lot about "the walk" and footwork. Well....I have been shooting shoulder since the big Betacam days. Saturday when shooting handheld/shoulder I realized that I have been instinctively using my FEET and KNEES for twenty years to keep my shoulder shots steady! I noticed that I was almost dancing with the subjects as I sidestepped, cross stepped, and moved with bent knees. Luke, handheld/shoulder shooting is something I do with my whole body, not just the shoulders. That is how I keep it as steady as I can. I do not need to learn the steadycam walk. I need to refine what I have been doing from my shoulder for many years.

I also have to be careful of my back. So when going for a static steady shot I place my feet a little front and back and center my hips over them in a nice "grounded position". Again it is about my body position. There is nothing worse than getting caught having to hold a long static shot when your body is in a poor or painful position. I have to be aware of posture at all times or it hurts. Good posture starts at the feet and goes all the way through center mass and shoulders.

Kind Regards,

Steve

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Pete,

Does this system work with your EA50 or just the A7S? With my heavy EA50s I think I may have to go with a spring rod rig?

Steve

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Thanks, Steve. I have been practicing with my shoulder rig, but my first real shoot is a five day event next week. I will definitely need to practice good posture.

Regards,
Luke

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

It's my experience that a springloaded monopod works better because you can tilt the camera without bending your body or making height adjustments on the tripod, just push the camera down if you want to point the camera down. The toppart of the springloaded monopod can bend in all directions, this is a big advantage when you pan the camera a bit because it allows you to keep the camera level, something you cannot do with a regular monopod with a tripod head.

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

Steve my EA50 has been put out to pasture and resides currently on ebay! I use this with my A7s and it works a treat - it's a pan/tilt head with the pan locked and the tilt left loose so I can easily adjust tilt on the fly. The difference to my back the morning after a wedding is amazing! Also if I'm caught out for a lengthy still shot I can just extend the legs and use it like a traditional monopod

Re: Best shooting technique for hand held video
 

I have tried this before with a monopod and head which was attached to a belt and what I didn't like about it was that when I wanted to tilt the camera I couldn't keep my eye against the viewfinder and had to look at the lcd screen instead. If I wanted to keep my eye against the viewfinder, which I prefer, I had to bend my upperbody forward which is not good if you have a bad back.
A springloaded monopod however allows you to keep the viewfinder against your eye without the need to bend your upperbody to do tilts.