Ideal hardware set-up

Perrone Ford · March 10th, 2010, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gerald Webb

Are you guys saying you can speed cut, Pan and crop and FX 1080p multi cam footage in EDIUS or FCP without them crashing????

Yes, that's what we're saying. I did exactly that in Avid, along with stabilization, lower thirds, and captions, it never crashed, preview and effects were real time, and output was perfect. And when I say it was real time, I mean RIGHT NOW real time. The first time I scrubbed the timeline, I was floored. I could see the entire movie pass by on the monitor just as fast as I could move the scrubber.

I proxy edit big projects too, and that does save you to a degree. I was actually quite shocked to see Vegas crash on an SD render yesterday. I had a single color correction effect on the 20 minute DV clip.

Mike Calla · March 10th, 2010, 10:13 AM

Exact opposite here:
Vegas has been rock solid for 4 versions minus release bugs. Never used AVCHD before, just cineform and in the past DV, and it pretty much never faltered. Sony ACID as well. They are transparent for me now...

...i'm actually on the Edius site now though checking it out...

I'll say this, if i had the money and most importantly time to learn a new OS on the mac, i'd use AVID again - in heartbeat! If for nothing more than the universal acceptance within our industry - Sometimes i feel like Vegas is like an open reel analog tape finding its way in to a studio. The quality of the tape, is sometimes said to be superior, yet in can't be used with anything else!

Cliff Etzel · March 10th, 2010, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gerald Webb

ok, Im taking my life in my hands by asking this among guys that have way more experience than myself, but ill ask it anyway for myself and anyone else who wants to know.

I dont get it! Ive done a few large projects in Vegas ( hour and half finished from about 15 hrs of raw footage ) and Ive had a couple of AVCHD tracks mixed with HDV mixed with MXF and a heap of Lagorith in there too, alot of the footage has up to 10 cuts a second in places. Ive delivered it to DVD and Bluray and broken it up for web delivery too.

I just havent had that many problems, yes it crashes sometimes, but before Ram preview or rapid multicam cutting I always save, in fact I save every couple of minutes anyway out of habit ( maybe thats your point afterall, lol )
Am I going to hit the wall soon? Is there something thats looming in the distance that hasnt hit me yet, because if my beloved Vegas is going to let me down in the future, I want to know NOW.

I always proxy edit for anything of any complexity or length, Is this saving me? Are you guys saying you can speed cut, Pan and crop and FX 1080p multi cam footage in EDIUS or FCP without them crashing????

Gerald, Proxy editing is probably saving you the headaches of natively editing HD material in Vegas - probalby why you are not experiencing the isses many of us have.

I cannot speak for FCP, but my experience with Edius has been this: Even the $200 Neo Booster 2.5 can edit 3 or more tracks of AVCHD natively in real time as long as you have an I7 chipset configuration - otherwise, bring the clips into your bin, right click and batch convert to Canopus HQ AVI's right in the application itself. You need plenty of hard drive space, but the cost of 1TB drives is nothing compared to the headaches of losing valuable time due to constant crashing of an application. I can tell you from first hand experience as well as reading the Edius forums, there's no mention of crashing from what I can see.

The Vegas forums have numerous threads on issues that just should not be happening with a "PRO" NLE as SONY likes to market it.

Edward Troxel · March 10th, 2010, 11:07 AM

Same here. Vegas has been solid for me. I've been using it since "Vegas Video 2" and am currently on Vegas Pro 9. I've edited many SD and HD projects. Couldn't ask for an easier to use editor and everything else has simply worked.

I've looked at Edius but simply creating a crossfade is so unnecessarily complicated! Plus, I'd be lost without scripting to simplify my workflow.

Erik Phairas · March 10th, 2010, 06:26 PM

I'm not a pro in any way, shape, or form. :) I've been using Vegas about a year and a half. I edit XDcam and AVCHD. No transcoding, I use the native codecs.

I've never experienced a render crash.

Perrone Ford · March 10th, 2010, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erik Phairas

I'm not a pro in any way, shape, or form. :) I've been using Vegas about a year and a half. I edit XDcam and AVCHD. No transcoding, I use the native codecs.

I've never experienced a render crash.

You are also on Vegas 8. BIG difference.

Erik Phairas · March 10th, 2010, 08:08 PM

I didn't realize there was that big a difference. I only bought it for the XDcam support.

Perrone Ford · March 10th, 2010, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erik Phairas

I didn't realize there was that big a difference. I only bought it for the XDcam support.

8.0c and 8.1 were nearly bulletproof for me. 9.x has been.. less so.

Erik Phairas · March 10th, 2010, 10:16 PM

Well it is good to know I did something right. :)

Gerald Webb · March 11th, 2010, 03:08 AM

man, im smashed! i downloaded the Edius demo, that software is a monster, it looks like it could be awsome, as the guys said, real time 1080i preview in full quality, but after an hour of playing around I cant even do a cross fade or move my media to different tracks.

Where do you get started with this beast?? theres not much on youtube. Would love to see a tutorial with some basic crossfades, fx, compositing and then exporting. and yes this is a big hint, NUDGE NUDGE come on guys, id do it for you, lol.

I should walk away, but i cant, it really looks good, but the pain behind the eyes..........

I can see an all-nighter coming on.

Lynne Whelden · March 11th, 2010, 07:44 AM

Fascinating discussion from both sides!

I feel like the guy who can't marry the woman he really loves because she's already claimed by another man. So he has to "settle" for the overweight high school classmate whom he dated many moons ago.

This is probably why people use the mac and FCP. It may not be the prettiest or most intuitive interface but it's stable.

Knowing that the possibility exists of a major crash within Vegas would hang over my head like a sword all those months I'd be working on a project. My heart wants to use Vegas but my head is telling me mac (yuck). The other reason, alluded to above, is that for Edius there is no support other than two rather expensive dvds ($50 or $100). No books (the pdf manual for Edius is 600 pages long). Even for Vegas there's like one book. For the mac stuff there's tons of material, plus a store to go to for one-on-one consults. For someone like myself who's not very versatile on the computer, that's nirvana!

Edward Troxel · March 11th, 2010, 09:38 AM

I edited a two hour program last year shot on two Panasonic cameras using straight AVCHD footage captured to the card in Vegas Pro 8.1.

I edited the equivalent program this year shot on the same cameras with the same type footage in Vegas Pro 9 (64-bit).

Both handled the process fine. I did find Vegas Pro 9 to be more stable than 8.1 in some areas but both finished the project fine. Most of my other edits have been SD instead of HD but both worked fine in HD.

Mike Kujbida · March 11th, 2010, 11:23 AM

Lynne, there are several users on the Sony Vegas Pro forum who have done and are continuing to do long form documentaries of the kind you're talking about with no problems whatsoever.

Lynne Whelden · March 11th, 2010, 12:23 PM

Can someone who understands Vegas better please make sense of this for me, as I'm totally confused now.
Is there something that can be done to insure stability? (Like clicking one's heels...?)
Is it a roll of the dice?
Is it the latest version of V.9?
Is it avoiding certain types of footage?

Perrone Ford · March 11th, 2010, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lynne Whelden

Can someone who understands Vegas better please make sense of this for me, as I'm totally confused now.
Is there something that can be done to insure stability? (Like clicking one's heels...?)
Is it a roll of the dice?
Is it the latest version of V.9?
Is it avoiding certain types of footage?

It is a combination of all the above. And one other factor that I will mention to you privately.

March 10th, 2010, 10:13 AM	#17
Mike Calla Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Shanghai Posts: 344	Exact opposite here: Vegas has been rock solid for 4 versions minus release bugs. Never used AVCHD before, just cineform and in the past DV, and it pretty much never faltered. Sony ACID as well. They are transparent for me now... ...i'm actually on the Edius site now though checking it out... I'll say this, if i had the money and most importantly time to learn a new OS on the mac, i'd use AVID again - in heartbeat! If for nothing more than the universal acceptance within our industry - Sometimes i feel like Vegas is like an open reel analog tape finding its way in to a studio. The quality of the tape, is sometimes said to be superior, yet in can't be used with anything else! __________________ boxoutsidemedia.com

March 10th, 2010, 11:07 AM	#19
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Same here. Vegas has been solid for me. I've been using it since "Vegas Video 2" and am currently on Vegas Pro 9. I've edited many SD and HD projects. Couldn't ask for an easier to use editor and everything else has simply worked. I've looked at Edius but simply creating a crossfade is so unnecessarily complicated! Plus, I'd be lost without scripting to simplify my workflow. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

March 10th, 2010, 06:26 PM	#20
Erik Phairas Major Player Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 628	I'm not a pro in any way, shape, or form. :) I've been using Vegas about a year and a half. I edit XDcam and AVCHD. No transcoding, I use the native codecs. I've never experienced a render crash. __________________ EX3, Q6600 Quad core PC - Vista 64, Vegas 8.1 64bit, SR11 b-cam

March 10th, 2010, 08:08 PM	#22
Erik Phairas Major Player Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 628	I didn't realize there was that big a difference. I only bought it for the XDcam support. __________________ EX3, Q6600 Quad core PC - Vista 64, Vegas 8.1 64bit, SR11 b-cam

March 10th, 2010, 10:16 PM	#24
Erik Phairas Major Player Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 628	Well it is good to know I did something right. :) __________________ EX3, Q6600 Quad core PC - Vista 64, Vegas 8.1 64bit, SR11 b-cam

March 11th, 2010, 03:08 AM	#25
Gerald Webb Trustee Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Central Coast Australia Posts: 1,046	man, im smashed! i downloaded the Edius demo, that software is a monster, it looks like it could be awsome, as the guys said, real time 1080i preview in full quality, but after an hour of playing around I cant even do a cross fade or move my media to different tracks. Where do you get started with this beast?? theres not much on youtube. Would love to see a tutorial with some basic crossfades, fx, compositing and then exporting. and yes this is a big hint, NUDGE NUDGE come on guys, id do it for you, lol. I should walk away, but i cant, it really looks good, but the pain behind the eyes.......... I can see an all-nighter coming on.

March 11th, 2010, 07:44 AM	#26
Lynne Whelden Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: williamsport, pa Posts: 604	Fascinating discussion from both sides! I feel like the guy who can't marry the woman he really loves because she's already claimed by another man. So he has to "settle" for the overweight high school classmate whom he dated many moons ago. This is probably why people use the mac and FCP. It may not be the prettiest or most intuitive interface but it's stable. Knowing that the possibility exists of a major crash within Vegas would hang over my head like a sword all those months I'd be working on a project. My heart wants to use Vegas but my head is telling me mac (yuck). The other reason, alluded to above, is that for Edius there is no support other than two rather expensive dvds ($50 or $100). No books (the pdf manual for Edius is 600 pages long). Even for Vegas there's like one book. For the mac stuff there's tons of material, plus a store to go to for one-on-one consults. For someone like myself who's not very versatile on the computer, that's nirvana!

March 11th, 2010, 09:38 AM	#27
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	I edited a two hour program last year shot on two Panasonic cameras using straight AVCHD footage captured to the card in Vegas Pro 8.1. I edited the equivalent program this year shot on the same cameras with the same type footage in Vegas Pro 9 (64-bit). Both handled the process fine. I did find Vegas Pro 9 to be more stable than 8.1 in some areas but both finished the project fine. Most of my other edits have been SD instead of HD but both worked fine in HD. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

March 11th, 2010, 11:23 AM	#28
Mike Kujbida Inner Circle Join Date: May 2005 Location: Windsor, ON Canada Posts: 2,770	Lynne, there are several users on the Sony Vegas Pro forum who have done and are continuing to do long form documentaries of the kind you're talking about with no problems whatsoever.

March 11th, 2010, 12:23 PM	#29
Lynne Whelden Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: williamsport, pa Posts: 604	It's not over 'til the fat lady sings... Can someone who understands Vegas better please make sense of this for me, as I'm totally confused now. Is there something that can be done to insure stability? (Like clicking one's heels...?) Is it a roll of the dice? Is it the latest version of V.9? Is it avoiding certain types of footage?