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Canon XL H Series HDV Camcorders
Canon XL H1S (with SDI), Canon XL H1A (without SDI). Also XL H1.


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Old April 10th, 2008, 11:25 AM   #16
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6 pin firewire! About time!!!

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Old April 10th, 2008, 11:30 AM   #17
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I personnally really like Canon's idea to create a body version with no HD-SDI. For those of us who don't need that kind of output and wanna upgrade to a brand-spankin'-new XL series body, not having to pay 3 more grands for that option is good news!

But is SD-HDI the only difference between the 2 bodies? Did I miss something else here?

Can't wait for reviews, maybe this time I'll upgrade my XL2!
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Old April 10th, 2008, 01:50 PM   #18
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I wonder why they haven't upgraded the image processing chip... The press release says it's using the "DIGIC DVII", which is the same one they've been using (I believe), whereas Canon has been touting the DIGIC DVIII in their latest SLR cameras.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 02:12 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Josh Chesarek View Post
Finally, a cheaper shoulder mount from canon, The price isn't much lower then a first gen h1 but it has the newer features AND its a shoulder mount. Sign me up! My wrist is happy. From what I have read the ergonomics of the canon shoulder mounts still leave much to be desired with the front heavy design but after strapping my nnovia unit to the back along with my wireless receivers I figure that should help bring it a little more in balance.
It was a disappointment to me after the revamp of the product line from XL1s to XLH1 that the "partial-shoulder" mount design was retained. At the very least I was hoping that a modular rear section would be designed that could convert it into a true shoulder mount (plus pro battery mount, wireless slots etc). JVC really got that one right with their HD100/200 series.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 02:25 PM   #20
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disappointing upgrades to say the least...
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Old April 10th, 2008, 02:27 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Brent Ethington View Post
...Canon has been touting the DIGIC DVIII in their latest SLR cameras.
Incorrect. Their D-SLRs use Digic III. That's a photo DSP. Digic DV II is a video DSP.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 02:30 PM   #22
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Okay... Canon's HD cameras are great cameras. They do 1080p and they have 24p/30p modes on top of having some of the best 60i around. But, things are changing now in the industry. We have a 4K camera system which can be had for nearly twice the price of the XLH1S, there is a $6,000 handycam camera that has, arguably, the best 1080p resolution images, the Sony EX1, Panasonic has just greatly lowered the price of the 2/3" HPX500 P2 broadcast camera and added a $2,000 rebate on top of that, thus making for about an $8,000 2/3" camera, and NAB is just a few days away with potentially even more announcements, particularly with tapeless and, perhaps, 2K options *cough*Scarlet*cough*. All Canon has done with the XLH1S and XLH1A is basically sat on their hands.

Neither option makes much sense, the XHG1, for quality sakes, can be had for about the same price as the XLH1A and offer the same image quality with uncompressed HD-SDI output in a smaller body. The XLH1S doesn't offer much more over the XLH1, other than the refined lens.

The only way you could make either camera make sense is with tapeless recording but even that isn't an option. They could have simply added a tapeless option along with HDV like Sony has done with the Z7U or, if they really had to do it at the last minute, add an AVCHD recording mode to SD cards like the HF10 and HF100 have. But no, Canon didn't do either of those things. If you went with a third party solution, like the Convergent Designs CF recorder, you're adding $5,000 on top of the $9,000 XLH1S, which equals $14,000, just a few thousand shy of RED territory.

Don't get me wrong, the XLH1S and XLH1A aren't bad cameras but then again they're not good enough either compared to the competition. At the end of the day, the competition just has more flexible options. Hopefully Canon has other announcements at NAB.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 02:49 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Jack Felis View Post
We have a 4K camera system which can be had for nearly twice the price of the XLH1S, there is a handycam camera that has, arguably, the best 1080p resolution images, the Sony EX1, Panasonic has just greatly lowered the price of the 2/3" HPX500 P2 broadcast camera and added a $2,000 rebate on top of that, thus making for about an $8,000 2/3" camera, and NAB is just a few days away with potentially even more announcements, particularly with tapeless and, perhaps, 2K options *cough*Scarlet*cough*.
Please, the Red is not 18K...its more like 40-80K when you get all the stuff to make it work (lenses, on-boards,MBs,FFs etc,etc). Canon has always done a small upgrade before it makes a Big change. Also, manufacturers tend to use rebates to help move product. I could go on but I won't.

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Old April 10th, 2008, 03:18 PM   #24
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The only way you could make either camera make sense is with tapeless recording but even that isn't an option.
Tapeless recording options for either camera already exist... FireStore FS-C, nNovia QuickCapture, etc.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 04:10 PM   #25
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And let's not forget the Convergent Design XDR Flash recorder to be shown at NAB and shipping sometime in May.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 04:57 PM   #26
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OK not to be picky or start fights here but the red comparison is kind of a fair one. IF you add the convergent design box and a 35mm adapter (I would add the mini 35c) you bring the whole thing up to around 23k vs the 20 or so for a comparably equipped red. You can then add more cost to the RED (MB FF, Sticks, Lenses etc.) but it would be the same stuff you'd need to add to the canon.

That being said, being able to do long form work (I've had three requests this year already to do round table discussions) where you don't need 4k or 35mm DOF make the canon a great deal, I don't think this camera is the best choice available anymore for cinematic work, but I think it's one of the best options for documentary and long form work.

(and I will say I'm not terribly impressed with the upgrade either but it does seem remarkably similar to the xl1 to xl1s upgrade so it's kinda to be expected.)
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Old April 10th, 2008, 05:05 PM   #27
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While that is true....now one is looking at spending $14K (with the XDR), for that price you can go get 2 EX1's, or for just a bit more have 2 Z27's both of which have direct to media card capture systems.

I was enamored for a moment, and then the moment passed, especially since my plan is to have 2 identical cameras, which means an upgrade budget of $28K!

....sorry canon, now i'm sure i'm upgrading away from your line.

Sincerly,
One disappointed XL owner
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Old April 10th, 2008, 05:17 PM   #28
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At first glance, the upgrades from the XL H1 to the XL H1S appeared to be welcome improvements, but limited to a few improvements.

As I have dug deeper, some of the less obvious improvements enhance the value of the upgrade.

It is nice that we can use our original XL H1 presets, as well as the XH A1 type presets. Thus we can easily match to a XH A1/G1.

It is nice that we now have better audio options, such as the ability to use an xlr and non-xlr mic at the same time.

The embedded audio and timecode are most welcome, but are obvious, essential improvements.

It is nice that we now have variable peaking.

If it is proven that we can now zoom and focus that the same time, this is a huge improvement. The lens functions are now more customizable, such as the amount of rotation to achieve zoom or focus.

The iris ring on the lens is very welcome.

I need to learn more about the histogram and SDI bitmap. In either case, we did not have these on the XL H1 (as far as I know). The same applies to the F Stop / Gray display.

The peaking feature now has variable gain and frequency. The maginifing function can now be recorded.

I like the idea of being able to assign names to custom presets. (I am assuming that these are now displayable.)

I love the idea of having audio limiters.

My point is that at first glance, there do not seem to be many improvements, but actually there are.

I fully agree that this is an upgrade, as opposed to a new 1/2" or 2/3" camera.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 05:25 PM   #29
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As I read another page of the USA - Canon's website, I found another desirable feature.

The gain settings from 0 db to +18 db can be fine tuned in 0.5db increments. I think this may come in handy. Of course, we now have a +36 db gain settins also

Gain Settings (-3dB, 0dB, +3dB, + 6dB, +12dB, +18dB, +36dB, with fine tuning in 0.5dB increments from 0dB to +18dB)

And, we now have an AGC (Automatic Gain Contol) limit as an option. I feel that this could be very useful.
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Old April 10th, 2008, 06:13 PM   #30
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No HDMI port on the XL H1A? How can we mate it with the new Cineform recorder? This would have possibly been a killer combination for us "fast" motion folks that don't want some of the problems inherent with HDV.
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Last edited by Mark Williams; April 10th, 2008 at 06:49 PM.
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