monitoring audio without a mixer at DVinfo.net

Sharif Zawaideh · April 20th, 2004, 04:32 PM

I have an XL1s with the sennheisser me66 (just purchased). I will have a sound guy to hold the boom pole, but at present I have no mixer.

Is there anyway for the sound guy to have headphones to monitor the audio without a mixer?

Can I just run a 25' mini cable from the camera to his headphones (limits his radius of movement though), or is there some device I can attach to the mic or xlr cable that isn't a mixer but allows for him to at least hear the audio through headphones?

Also, with the long mini cable option, is there one longer than 25' out there, and will there be a long delay or distortion on the headphones (from the long cable) that will actually not be on the recording?

Thanks

Ken Tanaka · April 20th, 2004, 05:32 PM

See this thread from February, 2003. I think you'll get some good ideas.

Bryan Beasleigh · April 20th, 2004, 06:00 PM

I know you said "no mixer" well this isn't really a mixer but it's half the price and works great........ I couldn't resist

This is quality stuff and no I'm not a share holder.

For the princely sum of $349.95 you to can own a Sound Devices MM1. The MM1 is a single channel preamp with 65 db of gain, limiters, phantom, selectable hi pass filter and a high quality headphone amp......... If you really want to get fancy there is a moniter input.

You clip it to your belt, run the mic feed in and send line level output to the camera. It also has a variable volume headphone amp so the boomperson can minitor. The gain is 11 stages click stop (4 db increments at the top end) This way nothing creeps.

http://www.sounddevices.com/download/guides/mm1_en.pdf

Sharif Zawaideh · April 20th, 2004, 06:30 PM

Ken, thanks for the direction with the previous thread.

Unfortunately, the MM-1 is out of my budget right now.

I read about the rolls PM50sOB which might be more of what I am looking for. From what I understand, I can run like a 15' xlr from the PM50sOB to the mic and the boom operator can monitor the sound from there, and then another xlr cable would feed out and connect to my xl1s. Is that correct? Is it possible to connect a wireless transmitter to this device?

In reference to my initial inquery, would the long 25' mini cable from the xl1s to my boom operator work as well (assuming he doesn't travel more than 25' from the camera)?

Thanks again for your input

Marco Leavitt · April 20th, 2004, 06:52 PM

Okay, in the no help at all category -- on some Web site once I found a company that was selling a 30 foot XLR cable that also had a stereo mini cable inside. The idea was to give a boom operator the ability to monitor the sound at the camera. Unfortunately, I've never been able to find that site again, no matter how hard I've looked, so there ya go, but such a gadget is out there.

Bryan Beasleigh · April 20th, 2004, 07:52 PM

Sharif
Yes, the PM50SOB looks like it will do the trick, it won't be perfect but it'll ne pretty reasonable mobey wise. If you do go that route, let us know what will happen.

You will need a balancing transformer between the mic cable XLR and the camera otherwise you stand a good chance of getting interferance .

Just a side note about the MM1. since the MM1 outputs at line, there is very little chance of interference over a run of 25 ft.

Sharif Zawaideh · April 20th, 2004, 08:02 PM

Pardon my ignorance, but if the cable goes from the rolls PM50sOB to the Xl1s through the MA200 would that solve the balancing issue or would i need a transformer such as the Shure A15BT - Bridging Transformer? _

Bryan Beasleigh · April 20th, 2004, 08:28 PM

You didn't say you had an MA200

Sharif Zawaideh · April 20th, 2004, 08:33 PM

sorry, so I guess that means that the ma200 will do and i wouldnt need any aditional balance transformer.

I found that once upon a time website with the xlr cable that also has headphone feed in it

http://www.equipmentemporium.com/audiofor.htm

They call it the EQE mini boom line. It's a 50' thin Canare xlr with a headphone feed in the same cable casing I guess.

Does anyone know anything about the quality of this cable? Does $99 seem like to much for an otherwise $50 cable? Does having the two lines right next to each other create any interference?

Thanks again.

Bryan Beasleigh · April 20th, 2004, 09:11 PM

Why not just go with the little Rolls headphone amp as a pass through. The person on the camera will be in control of the gain anyway and the headphone amp will be sufficient for your boom op to keep the "sweet spot" on the talent.

Try it that way, I think it's getting too complicated.

Ken Tanaka · April 20th, 2004, 09:21 PM

Indeed, I have an MM-1 but many others report that the Rolls unit does a very good job of enabling boom operator monitoring.

April 20th, 2004, 04:32 PM	#1
Sharif Zawaideh New Boot Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 10	monitoring audio without a mixer I have an XL1s with the sennheisser me66 (just purchased). I will have a sound guy to hold the boom pole, but at present I have no mixer. Is there anyway for the sound guy to have headphones to monitor the audio without a mixer? Can I just run a 25' mini cable from the camera to his headphones (limits his radius of movement though), or is there some device I can attach to the mic or xlr cable that isn't a mixer but allows for him to at least hear the audio through headphones? Also, with the long mini cable option, is there one longer than 25' out there, and will there be a long delay or distortion on the headphones (from the long cable) that will actually not be on the recording? Thanks

April 20th, 2004, 05:32 PM	#2
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	See this thread from February, 2003. I think you'll get some good ideas. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

April 20th, 2004, 09:21 PM	#11
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Indeed, I have an MM-1 but many others report that the Rolls unit does a very good job of enabling boom operator monitoring. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

April 20th, 2004, 06:00 PM	#3
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	I know you said "no mixer" well this isn't really a mixer but it's half the price and works great........ I couldn't resist This is quality stuff and no I'm not a share holder. For the princely sum of $349.95 you to can own a Sound Devices MM1. The MM1 is a single channel preamp with 65 db of gain, limiters, phantom, selectable hi pass filter and a high quality headphone amp......... If you really want to get fancy there is a moniter input. You clip it to your belt, run the mic feed in and send line level output to the camera. It also has a variable volume headphone amp so the boomperson can minitor. The gain is 11 stages click stop (4 db increments at the top end) This way nothing creeps. http://www.sounddevices.com/download/guides/mm1_en.pdf

April 20th, 2004, 06:30 PM	#4
Sharif Zawaideh New Boot Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 10	Ken, thanks for the direction with the previous thread. Unfortunately, the MM-1 is out of my budget right now. I read about the rolls PM50sOB which might be more of what I am looking for. From what I understand, I can run like a 15' xlr from the PM50sOB to the mic and the boom operator can monitor the sound from there, and then another xlr cable would feed out and connect to my xl1s. Is that correct? Is it possible to connect a wireless transmitter to this device? In reference to my initial inquery, would the long 25' mini cable from the xl1s to my boom operator work as well (assuming he doesn't travel more than 25' from the camera)? Thanks again for your input

April 20th, 2004, 06:52 PM	#5
Marco Leavitt Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Albany, NY 12210 Posts: 2,652	Okay, in the no help at all category -- on some Web site once I found a company that was selling a 30 foot XLR cable that also had a stereo mini cable inside. The idea was to give a boom operator the ability to monitor the sound at the camera. Unfortunately, I've never been able to find that site again, no matter how hard I've looked, so there ya go, but such a gadget is out there.

April 20th, 2004, 07:52 PM	#6
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	Sharif Yes, the PM50SOB looks like it will do the trick, it won't be perfect but it'll ne pretty reasonable mobey wise. If you do go that route, let us know what will happen. You will need a balancing transformer between the mic cable XLR and the camera otherwise you stand a good chance of getting interferance . Just a side note about the MM1. since the MM1 outputs at line, there is very little chance of interference over a run of 25 ft.

April 20th, 2004, 08:02 PM	#7
Sharif Zawaideh New Boot Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 10	Pardon my ignorance, but if the cable goes from the rolls PM50sOB to the Xl1s through the MA200 would that solve the balancing issue or would i need a transformer such as the Shure A15BT - Bridging Transformer? _

April 20th, 2004, 08:28 PM	#8
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	You didn't say you had an MA200

April 20th, 2004, 08:33 PM	#9
Sharif Zawaideh New Boot Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 10	sorry, so I guess that means that the ma200 will do and i wouldnt need any aditional balance transformer. I found that once upon a time website with the xlr cable that also has headphone feed in it http://www.equipmentemporium.com/audiofor.htm They call it the EQE mini boom line. It's a 50' thin Canare xlr with a headphone feed in the same cable casing I guess. Does anyone know anything about the quality of this cable? Does $99 seem like to much for an otherwise $50 cable? Does having the two lines right next to each other create any interference? Thanks again.

April 20th, 2004, 09:11 PM	#10
Bryan Beasleigh Trustee Join Date: May 2002 Location: Barrie, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,922	Why not just go with the little Rolls headphone amp as a pass through. The person on the camera will be in control of the gain anyway and the headphone amp will be sufficient for your boom op to keep the "sweet spot" on the talent. Try it that way, I think it's getting too complicated.