ElphelVision User Interface at DVinfo.net
DV Info Net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Alternative Imaging Methods > Apertus: Open Source Cinema Project

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old October 24th, 2009, 02:25 PM   #1
New Boot
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 19
ElphelVision User Interface

Hello everyone! I have been working with Sebastian trying to do whatever I can to help the project along. There have been many new developments. We are trying to open up the discussions to the entire community.

For now, the main interface for controlling the camera is the ElphelVision software. There are probably going to be manual controls and a few other ways to manipulate the camera in the future. However, for now we are focusing on ElphelVision as the main interface for the camera. In terms of hardware, ElphelVision will be manipulated using an 8.9" multi-touch touchscreen display with a resolution of 1024x600 mounted onto the rails of the camera.

So folks, we are in the process of completely revamping ElphelVision in preparation for a major next release. I have been working on the interface and have a few mockups to show you. Right now I have only mocked up the main screen of the viewfinder. When I finish more I will post them. The images attached to this post are what I have completed so far. Please let me know what you think.
Attached Thumbnails
ElphelVision User Interface-mockup_main.png   ElphelVision User Interface-mockup_selected.png  

Jeremy Cimafonte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 25th, 2009, 05:22 AM   #2
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Vienna, Austria
Posts: 112
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeremy Cimafonte View Post
In terms of hardware, ElphelVision will be manipulated using an 8.9" multi-touch touchscreen display with a resolution of 1024x600 mounted onto the rails of the camera.
You can of course also use different screens at different resolutions/sizes. I recently purchased this: 8.9" 1280 * 768 LCD CHIMEI 8.9" 1280 * 768, N089A1-L01 + Pixelworks338 Controller - DIY-Beamer

But the layout of the java GUI currently revolves around a 1024x600 pixel canvas, in the future it might auto adjust to different resolutions or you will be able to select the layout in the menu.


Now on to my feedback to the interface itself:
-) I love the icons and text size improvements, what options do the left hand symbols link to?
-) currently the text in the buttons is in a single line like "Shutter 1/48", I like this 2 lined design much better!
-) Careful with "Exposure", I think what you are refering to is "Aperture" which is a feature of the lens not the camera.
-) The slider-area inside the buttons seems really small, I am not sure if you can do fine tuning of parameters with this little room to move.
Sebastian Pichelhofer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 25th, 2009, 04:50 PM   #3
New Boot
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 19
Quote:
You can of course also use different screens at different resolutions/sizes. I recently purchased this: 8.9" 1280 * 768 LCD CHIMEI 8.9" 1280 * 768, N089A1-L01 + Pixelworks338 Controller - DIY-Beamer

But the layout of the java GUI currently revolves around a 1024x600 pixel canvas, in the future it might auto adjust to different resolutions or you will be able to select the layout in the menu.
Of course you can also use different screen sizes. I made the entire layout (except for the viewfinder image) vector specifically so it could resize to fit different resolutions :-)

Quote:
-) I love the icons and text size improvements, what options do the left hand symbols link to?
I will have more mockups in the next few days. The symbols on the left represent "Playback/Browser", "Peaking", "Color/Looks", "Guides", and "Magnification Loupe"

Quote:
-) currently the text in the buttons is in a single line like "Shutter 1/48", I like this 2 lined design much better!
I'm glad you like it. The kerning of the text is a tad off and it should be thicker but its good for now.

Quote:
-) Careful with "Exposure", I think what you are refering to is "Aperture" which is a feature of the lens not the camera.
For some reason I was under the impression that the sensor also had an exposure reading. Or maybe I thought it would control the lens exposure? I don't know what I was thinking I will take it out.

Quote:
-) The slider-area inside the buttons seems really small, I am not sure if you can do fine tuning of parameters with this little room to move.
I was thinking about this. Ultimately, as long as there is a dot to let you know where to place your finger it doesn't need to be all that big. What really matters is that the little speech balloon above the slider remains visible. I do see your point though, I will make it bigger.

Look forward to some more mockups soon, thanks for the critique!
Jeremy Cimafonte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 25th, 2009, 08:47 PM   #4
New Boot
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 19
Here is a mockup of the clip browser. It is a work in progress. The functionality to sync videos with the host computer will be below the metadata/exif tags in the Information box. More to come shortly!

EDIT: If someone could chime in and let me know what they think. I notice that I left the camera controls down at the bottom which seems like just additional clutter. Should I take out the camera controls or do you think they should remain accessible from the playback screen?
Attached Thumbnails
ElphelVision User Interface-mockup_browser.png  

Last edited by Jeremy Cimafonte; October 26th, 2009 at 11:57 AM.
Jeremy Cimafonte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 27th, 2009, 09:15 AM   #5
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: (The Netherlands - Belgium)
Posts: 735
Very nice concepts Jeremy!

Here are some ideas I have about the interface:

-Imagine yourself under the worst circumstances when using the camera. This would be either in bright sunlight or on a dark cloudy day. Using a touchscreen interface, you don't want to hit the wrong button, just because you can't see the screen well enough (reflections etc) So I think the buttons can be as big as possible. I use a 7" touchscreen tablet PC with 'only' 800x480 res.

-I've also discussed a 'portrait mode' some time ago. This is where the rods support is designed around. The idea is to put the screen vertically. You'll end up with a smaller preview image, but a lot of space below for controls and other things like focus info or whatever.
Something like this (old concept but you'll get the idea) http://www.dvinfo.net/forum/attachme...01portrait.jpg

-Another idea: we will probably have an option for an optical viewfinder in the future. If one decides to use only the optical viewfinder, the interface could have a function to disable preview. Maybe only refresh the image when you adjust a setting (exposure etc)
Or use a graphic gadget like a replica of an old exposure meter in stead of the preview image :-)

The last idea makes it possible to use low end controlers like tablet pcs that can't keep up with the preview image.
Oscar Spierenburg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 28th, 2009, 12:27 PM   #6
New Boot
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 19
Thanks Oscar! I'm glad you like them.

Quote:
-Imagine yourself under the worst circumstances when using the camera. This would be either in bright sunlight or on a dark cloudy day. Using a touchscreen interface, you don't want to hit the wrong button, just because you can't see the screen well enough (reflections etc) So I think the buttons can be as big as possible. I use a 7" touchscreen tablet PC with 'only' 800x480 res.
I was waiting for someone to bring this up. LCDs for cameras such as the RED and SI-2k are made to have wide viewing angles and be very bright to ensure even on the sunniest or foggiest of days the display will be visible from all angles. In addition, many LCDs used for film production have sunshades. This is something to consider when selecting a display to use as the viewfinder for a camera.

I designed this interface for use in a certain configuration (1024x600 or greater touchscreen that is around 8"). While designing the interface I made a conscious decision to design it with film makers in mind. It is designed to be the main control element of the camera (replacing many manual controls) similar to cameras such as the SI-2k. That is why I designed this configuration with a 16:9 aspect ratio in mind. The entire interface is strictly vector for a few reasons. First, so it could be scaled nicely to different resolutions. Secondly, to allow for a wide array of possible configurations. I have not mocked up the settings interface but inside the settings interface I wanted to add an option to change the configuration of the interface. There could be options for "portrait mode", when using the screen vertically, as well as an option for "headless" mode which would eliminate the preview screen. These separate configurations could be created on the fly by dynamically resizing the elements (thanks to the flexibility of the vector interface). Does that make sense? I promise my idea will be clearer once I finish all the mockups.

Oscar, on a sidenote I would appreciate it if you could email me all the 3ds max files you created for the prototype. I am using Cinema 4D though so you would need to export them as .3DS (which is compatible with cinema 4d).
Jeremy Cimafonte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 10th, 2009, 12:06 AM   #7
New Boot
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 19
FYI:
I have stopped working on the ElphelVision interface momentarily so I can lay out the prototype camera in VariCAD. I will resume working on the UI once enough of the prototype has been finished.
Jeremy Cimafonte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 13th, 2009, 04:51 AM   #8
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Vienna, Austria
Posts: 112
I think its time to show a little of what has been achieved with ElphelVision in the last time.

The Java Applet has grown in size and features and even though there is still a lot to be done its already pretty enjoyable to use :)

EV01.jpg shows the main dialog with big live video canvas, the small s... and l... buttons actually say "save" and "load" as I am currently working on implementing that settings are automatically saved and loaded again when closing and starting the software later.

EV02.jpg shows the Settings Tab 1

EV03.jpg shows the Settings Tab 2, this dialog has a smaller live video window to immediately see changes made to gamma curve.

EV04.jpg shows the Custom Resolution Menu that you reach when clicking Resolution-> Custom in Settings Tab 1

EV_inaction.jpg shows ElphelVision running on my EeePc as a proof of concept. Note that the EeePC is not connected to LAN but only communicating with the camera over Wifi.
Attached Thumbnails
ElphelVision User Interface-ev_inaction.jpg   ElphelVision User Interface-ev01.jpg  

ElphelVision User Interface-ev02.jpg   ElphelVision User Interface-ev03.jpg  

ElphelVision User Interface-ev04.jpg  
Sebastian Pichelhofer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 13th, 2009, 06:26 PM   #9
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: (The Netherlands - Belgium)
Posts: 735
Incredible progress! I have to say! (especially the WB settings)
I'll try the last Elphel Vision as soon as possible and report back.
Oscar Spierenburg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 14th, 2009, 04:38 AM   #10
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Vienna, Austria
Posts: 112
Technically setting the WB is working but what I still need are the actual gain values of all color channels at certain light situations.

And I need your help with that, its really easy:

For the "Daylight" preset go outside to a sunny spot.

Enable Auto Whitebalance in parsedit: WB_EN 1

Place a white sheet of paper in front of the camera filling up the whole camera image, make sure the skylight is falling on the paper so holding it a little tilted towards the sky might be good.

Now once the automatic whitebalance adjusted save me the values of: GAINR, GAING, GAINB, GAINGB (see screenshot) in parsedit.

I already did this for Tungsten in my room (in the screenshot), but still need the values for Daylight, Cloudy, Flourescent and maybe more presets if someone sees the need.
Attached Thumbnails
ElphelVision User Interface-wb.jpg  
Sebastian Pichelhofer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old December 14th, 2009, 03:58 PM   #11
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: (The Netherlands - Belgium)
Posts: 735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian Pichelhofer View Post
And I need your help with that, its really easy:

For the "Daylight" preset go outside to a sunny spot.

Enable Auto Whitebalance in parsedit: WB_EN 1......
First thing I'll do when I have the camera mobile. Maybe we can also do a separate tab with advanced color settings (like film look styles)
Oscar Spierenburg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old September 17th, 2010, 12:58 AM   #12
New Boot
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Odessa Ukraine
Posts: 20


RED Epic seems join to touchscreen camera controls too :)
maybe something from this video can help for future versions of elphel vision
YouTube - Epic-Desktop.mov
Dmytry Shijan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 11th, 2010, 07:05 AM   #13
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Vienna, Austria
Posts: 112
Thanks Dmytry, but its hard to see anything on the blurred image and the video does hardly focus on the touchscreen. But that's alright, I don't want ElphelVision to be a Red knockoff anyway.


I made some more progress and posted new screen shots on the website:
ElphelVision | Apertus Open Source Cinema

One of the major changes in the last revisions was the switch from mplayer to VLC (VLCj).
VLC is simply becoming the most powerful video player, not just for simply watching videos but also in terms of technical specs and features. With mplayer we were always struggling to reduce video latency and there was no real solution on the horizon as mplayer did not have any parameters to really influence latency.
With VLC we can reduce the rtsp-cache down to as low as 20 ms (depends on datarate of the stream as well) which is half the exposure time of a single frame at 25fps. This basically feels like realtime video.

Another big advantage is that VLC supports video filter extensions. With mplayer we had to make sourcecode changes of the original player to add certain features.
With VLC we should be able to provide a single file as plugin.
Some of these plugin ideas are posted here as "proposed tasks":
Apertus.Tasks - ElphelWiki

Maybe one or the other VLC plugin will get a feature bounty awarded later on.
Sebastian Pichelhofer is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY USA

Scan Computers Int. Ltd.
+44 0871-472-4747
Bolton, Lancashire UK


DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Special Interest Areas > Alternative Imaging Methods > Apertus: Open Source Cinema Project

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:13 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2020 The Digital Video Information Network