A1/G1 LCD/EVF accuracy.. curious... at DVinfo.net

Peter Jefferson · March 17th, 2007, 11:32 PM

does anyone know if the LCD of these cameras is a "what you see is what you get" kinda thing?
Reason i ask is that ive looked at many cameras, and the closest cam ive seen to have this ability is the DVX100b and the HVX.. even the 100a doesnt offer this type of accuracy.. without a field monitor were al gussing as to the actual saturation of what were seeing, as the LCD's usualy have a life of their own..

so how accurate are these units?
for run and gun, i dont have the means to run tests or to mount an external monitor, so the LCD is basically needed to get the job done..

thoughts?

Dan Wilder · March 18th, 2007, 12:34 AM

Peter,
Adam Wilt's review in DV magazine states tha both the VFW and LCD display 100% vertically and crop a "few percent" horizontally. You can turn on guide lines that mark off safe areas.
-Dan

Alex Leith · March 18th, 2007, 02:06 AM

Certainly the LCD displays most of the recorded image. Like Dan says 100% top to bottom, and about 95-96% side to side.

However, it's quite a bit brighter than the recorded image - which is great when working outdoors in fairly bright sunlight - but it took me a while to work out why my footage was always coming out slightly underexposed!

Peter Jefferson · March 18th, 2007, 03:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Leith

Certainly the LCD displays most of the recorded image. Like Dan says 100% top to bottom, and about 95-96% side to side.

However, it's quite a bit brighter than the recorded image - which is great when working outdoors in fairly bright sunlight - but it took me a while to work out why my footage was always coming out slightly underexposed!

THATS the answer i was wanting..
Now is there any way one can flatten the brightness to a neutral output, to offer the closest preview (in the EVF/LCD) to the actual output?

I wasnt too impressed with the lack of audio tweakability.. heres hoping the LCD's can at least be tweaked...

Jay Fisk · March 18th, 2007, 03:25 AM

Is anyone familiar with this type of LCD bellows ?

http://www.canhamcameras.com/Bellows.html

It appears to be a viable alternative to the usual velcro Hoodman type for the on-camera LCD and even the Marshall.

Tom Hardwick · March 18th, 2007, 03:32 AM

Camcorder viewfinders and side-screens are WYSIWYG in the sense that you're seeing the image at taking aparture, at taking shutter speed and through all the menu tweaks (progressive scan, black stretch etc) that you've applied.

In film camera days viewfinders were much less informative, generally peeling off the image before the shutter and not showing you the aperture related depth of field. Of course projector masking was generally rather less severe than a lot of TVs, but screen masking was another matter entirely.

I like the fact that now we see just what the chips are seeing, especially the DOF and effects of graduated filters at the taking aperture.

tom.

Bill Busby · March 18th, 2007, 04:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay Fisk

Is anyone familiar with this type of LCD bellows ?

http://www.canhamcameras.com/Bellows.html

It appears to be a viable alternative to the usual velcro Hoodman type for the on-camera LCD and even the Marshall.

Interesting Jay. I haven't seen those. Now... if only I could use my mag lens from my Hoodman with it, I'd grab one. I wonder... hmmmm...

Bill

Richard Hunter · March 18th, 2007, 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

Now is there any way one can flatten the brightness to a neutral output, to offer the closest preview (in the EVF/LCD) to the actual output?

Hi Peter. You can connect the video output from the cam to a calibrated monitor, and adjust the LCD/EVF settings to get as close a match as possible to what you see on the monitor. This is not perfect, because the LCD apparent brightness will vary with ambient lighting, but it gets you close and you soon learn whether it is under or over reading.

You should also use the zebras to avoid overexposure, because this is all too easy to get if you just expose based on the average image brightness.

Richard

Peter Jefferson · March 18th, 2007, 05:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard Hunter

Hi Peter. You can connect the video output from the cam to a calibrated monitor, and adjust the LCD/EVF settings to get as close a match as possible to what you see on the monitor. This is not perfect, because the LCD apparent brightness will vary with ambient lighting, but it gets you close and you soon learn whether it is under or over reading.

You should also use the zebras to avoid overexposure, because this is all too easy to get if you just expose based on the average image brightness.

Richard

Yeh i was thinking i might need to do this if i was to get this unit.. i did it with every other camera, but when i saw the HVX/DVX100b and how accurate they were out of the box, i thought i'd doublecheck

As for the Zebras, does the A1 allow for 2 readings simoultaneously.. well a range in fact.. ? Also does it allow for peak numbered readouts (like the DVX/HVX) reason i ask is that sometimes, Zebras actaully get in the way of the shot.. and seeing the exposure with a numbered readout is simetmes easier to manage..

Richard Hunter · March 18th, 2007, 08:07 AM

Hi Peter. No you can't set a range of zebras, just a single value. And I haven't seen any mention of a numbered readout. Sounds like a nice feature.

Richard

Peter Jefferson · March 18th, 2007, 09:01 AM

it is.. basically it removes teh zebra patterning on screen and replaces it with a point peak meter.. like a target of sorts.. which reads out the exposure level in percentages (much liek Zebras work in percentiles.. so does this.. ) the good thing about it as that you can see the exposure blow out as opposed to guessing it through the zebra itself.. sometimes u might WANT a shot to blow out.. (doing events, its a nice way to mess with live lighting situations.. )

March 17th, 2007, 11:32 PM	#1
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	A1/G1 LCD/EVF accuracy.. curious... does anyone know if the LCD of these cameras is a "what you see is what you get" kinda thing? Reason i ask is that ive looked at many cameras, and the closest cam ive seen to have this ability is the DVX100b and the HVX.. even the 100a doesnt offer this type of accuracy.. without a field monitor were al gussing as to the actual saturation of what were seeing, as the LCD's usualy have a life of their own.. so how accurate are these units? for run and gun, i dont have the means to run tests or to mount an external monitor, so the LCD is basically needed to get the job done.. thoughts?

March 18th, 2007, 02:06 AM	#3
Alex Leith Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Northampton, England Posts: 500	Certainly the LCD displays most of the recorded image. Like Dan says 100% top to bottom, and about 95-96% side to side. However, it's quite a bit brighter than the recorded image - which is great when working outdoors in fairly bright sunlight - but it took me a while to work out why my footage was always coming out slightly underexposed! __________________ Alex

March 18th, 2007, 03:25 AM	#5
Jay Fisk Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: CSL BCS MX Posts: 67	Concertina bellows hoods??? Is anyone familiar with this type of LCD bellows ? http://www.canhamcameras.com/Bellows.html It appears to be a viable alternative to the usual velcro Hoodman type for the on-camera LCD and even the Marshall.

March 18th, 2007, 12:34 AM	#2
Dan Wilder Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 29	Peter, Adam Wilt's review in DV magazine states tha both the VFW and LCD display 100% vertically and crop a "few percent" horizontally. You can turn on guide lines that mark off safe areas. -Dan

March 18th, 2007, 03:32 AM	#6
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Camcorder viewfinders and side-screens are WYSIWYG in the sense that you're seeing the image at taking aparture, at taking shutter speed and through all the menu tweaks (progressive scan, black stretch etc) that you've applied. In film camera days viewfinders were much less informative, generally peeling off the image before the shutter and not showing you the aperture related depth of field. Of course projector masking was generally rather less severe than a lot of TVs, but screen masking was another matter entirely. I like the fact that now we see just what the chips are seeing, especially the DOF and effects of graduated filters at the taking aperture. tom.

March 18th, 2007, 08:07 AM	#10
Richard Hunter Trustee Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lipa City Batangas, Philippines Posts: 1,110	Hi Peter. No you can't set a range of zebras, just a single value. And I haven't seen any mention of a numbered readout. Sounds like a nice feature. Richard

March 18th, 2007, 09:01 AM	#11
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	it is.. basically it removes teh zebra patterning on screen and replaces it with a point peak meter.. like a target of sorts.. which reads out the exposure level in percentages (much liek Zebras work in percentiles.. so does this.. ) the good thing about it as that you can see the exposure blow out as opposed to guessing it through the zebra itself.. sometimes u might WANT a shot to blow out.. (doing events, its a nice way to mess with live lighting situations.. )