MA-200 or XLR-3.5 minijack at DVinfo.net

Christopher Hughes · February 9th, 2003, 04:57 PM

Im thinking of getting a Sennheiser K6 and ME66 for the XL1s, however money is a little tight at the moment, so im trying to buget as best I can.

Those that have the same mic set up....do you all use the MA200 or the Beachtek (i think its called) the one that mounts on the base of the camera???? Or do you use just an XLR to 3.5 mini-jack cable?

I'm just wondering if theres much really notable difference, I like the idea of the MA-200 so it can act like a shoulder support, but moenys tight and I think sound benefits outway my own comfort [most shots will probably be on a tripod anyway.]

So if anyone has used both ways...is the MA-200 really a necessity piece of kit? or shall I just get the mic with XLR-XLR (for future) and XLR-3.5 minijack (for now) and do without the MA-200 until I get some more money. I have mainly used PD-150s previously so never had this problem.

You ideas will be appreciated...Thanks...

Vic Owen · February 9th, 2003, 07:05 PM

You need one of the adapters. I've used both the MA-100 and the Beachtek. The MA-100 is, indeed, a nice shoulder rest, but for versatility, I prefer the Beachtek. It gives you more control over individual gains, stero/mono selection, line/mic levels, etc. It's also all passive inside -- the MA-100 has active (powered) circuits, and can be easily overdriven when used with line-level signals (like from a house mixer).

There's another mfg that makes one -- can't remember who. Some like it better. I'm fine with the Beachtek.

Also, note that neither provide phantom power. If you use the Senn, the power module will work fine. Other mics will need a phantom adapter or battery. Lots of options out there.

Sandy Kaye · February 10th, 2003, 01:02 AM

IMHO-
the MA-100 isn't a good shoulder rest.

Don Palomaki · February 10th, 2003, 04:59 AM

The other product is from Studio One. http://www.studio1productions.com/

Steve Clodfelter · February 10th, 2003, 11:00 AM

Why do you need one of the adapters (the MA-100, Beachtek or Studio1)? Will the mic not work if you use an XLR to mini-jack cable? If it will work, couldn't you control the levels using the level controls on the XL1S itself?

Similarly, could you use an XLR to RCA cable and run the mic into Audio 2?

Finally, if you use a wireless mic receiver with RCA outputs, is there any need for the MA-100, Beachtek or Studio 1 adapters?

Thanks for the help.

Ken Tanaka · February 10th, 2003, 11:14 AM

Chris,
To best answer your question we really need to know more about what type of shooting you plan to do with the XL1s and ME-66. Mounted on tripod/stabilizer? Running around? Etc. Do you plan to mount the mic on the camera or use a boom/fishpole?

You may be muddling the shoulder pad attribute of the MA-200 with its audio circuitry...something easily done.

Christopher Hughes · February 10th, 2003, 11:29 AM

Type of filming would be be just sort of location shooting - like weddings here and there, but more for single camera films (movies). Im not on a budget or anything, just my own money at the moment.

I just thought that I could used the mic attached to camera and then use the XLR - 3.5mini jack from the back of the K6 to camera. Its possible that I would do walking when not on a tripod, so thats why I thought the MA-200 would be more useful, than the Beachtek so the wires go out of the way of tripod head area. Its very likely that in future I will use more than one mic set up, as and when I can afford more mics. But just wanted to know if everyone uses the MA-200 (or equivalent) or if some with single mic setups just shoot on mic to 3.5minijack.

SO just after some general opinion, as to whether just get the gear in one go, or whether best to get mic and XLR-3.5mini, and then MA-200 as soon as I can afford it. Guess I'm just trying to cut corners where possible and share my costs around, ie, filters, mic, windjammer, etc. So every one on XLR? or would using the 3.5 mini just kill the quality same as using cheap cables????

Christopher Hughes · February 10th, 2003, 11:45 AM

just one more thing....

The mic would be just camera mounted,
I will be using it for documentary style work, but that would be later in the year, so by then I would definitely have necessary kit of boom pole, XLR pack, etc. I would need the XLR to XLR,

But the mic will be camera mounted for the moment, so not subjected to possible pulling on mic cable that could cause it to be pulled out easily. Im just bothered about quality is all. If I need a XLR kit - I need one.

So far my mind is made up on MA-200, but some swear by Beachtek. Which would be the best for films and/or documentary - So on a whole like 90% tripod shots.
So which is the best???? Or it just a matter of taste???

Ken Tanaka · February 10th, 2003, 12:21 PM

The BechTek is fine for straight 2-channel recording. But the MA-200 gives you up to 4 channels, has far more flexibility and capabilities than the Beachtek or Studio One, and offers a shoulder pad.

Honestly, though, if you're comfortable with only camera-mounting the mic you don't really need anything other than an XLR-to-Mini adapter cable. (Defeating the balanced connection won't cause any noise trouble for such a tiny distance.) This would allow you to plug the mic directly into the standard mic socket.

But before youo spend the savings note: you will need to also budget for an adapter to mount the ME-66 to your XL1s. The most popular is made by Lightwave Systems.

Buying what you need up-front is less expensive than buying only what can afford and later replacing it with what you need.

Christopher Hughes · February 10th, 2003, 04:34 PM

Ken,

You think the clamp is necessary?, just with mics before as with the days using an PD-150 we would just use the on-camera clamp and make a tube of a kind of rubbery foam like the can coolers or those 'springy' 35mm camera straps or even thin bits of rubber cut from car tires, with gave it a nice tight fit and acted like shock absorber [any skateboarders amongst us will verify to the great shock absorbsion] and I believe there was a post last week on this matter. So you use the Lightwave clamp? Cos from what I believe the K6 & ME66 is a little thinner than the regular Canon mic so would sit in the regular clamp using the technique I have said.

Ken Tanaka · February 10th, 2003, 04:43 PM

You can try to adapt the standard clamp with some type of sleeve but you're likely to get some handling noise, particularly on handheld shots. The Lightwave Isolator works pretty well in this regard.

But hey, try the free path first if you've the time and inclination for experimentation.

Brian M. Dickman · February 11th, 2003, 10:55 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Don Palomaki : The other product is from Studio One. http://www.studio1productions.com/ -->>>

According to Tom at Zotz Digital, the last batch of Studio1 XLR boxes they got had plastic cases, not metal, so they're going to be moving away from them. They're looking at SignVideo as a potential replacement vendor. SignVideo make an XLR box very similar to Beachtek and Studio1, with an undercamera mounting screw. According to the website literature it has a beltclip of some sort as well.

http://www.signvideo.com

Tustin Larson · February 11th, 2003, 11:50 AM

I have the ME66/K6 setup with the MA-200. I think it works great. I did not buy an adapter for it to fit in the mic slot. I just took some cloth medical tape and wrapped it a few times towards the back of the mic. It works great, and holds tight. Also, when you use the MA-200, it is my opinion that you need more weight on the back of the cam. So I bought the dual battery adapter and 2 large batteries. This helps keep it steady. And for my own personal taste, I like to extend the MA-200 out almost as far as it will go..... for almost perfect balance.

Hope this helps...
Tustin

Charles Fields · February 17th, 2003, 08:16 AM

I have the Studio 1 XLR-BP Pro. Great unit. When you order, tell them you are using it with the XL1 or XL1s, they will give you an adapter cable so you can adapt the 1/8" stereo plug to RCA plugs so you can go in either thru the 1/8" jack or the RCA jacks on the back of the camera.

I had there old XLR adapter, didn't like the way it mounted under the XL1. The new XLR-BP Pro's clip on your belt. MUCH nicer.

Someone commented they are in a plastic box. Yes, they are, but it does keep them light weight since they are on your belt. Even though they are in plastic, they are very rugged. I was shooting from the roof of a building and knocked my Mic and XLR-BP Pro off the building. The mic broke, but the XLR adapter didn't.

One note, they XLR-BP Pro is lined with a shielding material in addition to having other components shielded. This was brought up once before and I believe that someone from Zotz's stated they weren't shielded. This is BS that Zotz's is passing around. It is even stated on the Studio 1 website that the XLR-BP Pro is shielded.

Just want to set the record straight. Charles

February 9th, 2003, 04:57 PM	#1
Christopher Hughes Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sunderland, England (y Merida, Mexico) Posts: 269	MA-200 or XLR-3.5 minijack Im thinking of getting a Sennheiser K6 and ME66 for the XL1s, however money is a little tight at the moment, so im trying to buget as best I can. Those that have the same mic set up....do you all use the MA200 or the Beachtek (i think its called) the one that mounts on the base of the camera???? Or do you use just an XLR to 3.5 mini-jack cable? I'm just wondering if theres much really notable difference, I like the idea of the MA-200 so it can act like a shoulder support, but moenys tight and I think sound benefits outway my own comfort [most shots will probably be on a tripod anyway.] So if anyone has used both ways...is the MA-200 really a necessity piece of kit? or shall I just get the mic with XLR-XLR (for future) and XLR-3.5 minijack (for now) and do without the MA-200 until I get some more money. I have mainly used PD-150s previously so never had this problem. You ideas will be appreciated...Thanks...

February 9th, 2003, 07:05 PM	#2
Vic Owen Major Player Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 540	You need one of the adapters. I've used both the MA-100 and the Beachtek. The MA-100 is, indeed, a nice shoulder rest, but for versatility, I prefer the Beachtek. It gives you more control over individual gains, stero/mono selection, line/mic levels, etc. It's also all passive inside -- the MA-100 has active (powered) circuits, and can be easily overdriven when used with line-level signals (like from a house mixer). There's another mfg that makes one -- can't remember who. Some like it better. I'm fine with the Beachtek. Also, note that neither provide phantom power. If you use the Senn, the power module will work fine. Other mics will need a phantom adapter or battery. Lots of options out there. __________________ -- Vic Owen --

February 10th, 2003, 01:02 AM	#3
Sandy Kaye New Boot Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Silverlake, CA Posts: 16	IMHO- the MA-100 isn't a good shoulder rest. __________________ i've seen evil and it's name is pc

February 10th, 2003, 11:00 AM	#5
Steve Clodfelter Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Golden, CO Posts: 43	Why do you need one of the adapters (the MA-100, Beachtek or Studio1)? Will the mic not work if you use an XLR to mini-jack cable? If it will work, couldn't you control the levels using the level controls on the XL1S itself? Similarly, could you use an XLR to RCA cable and run the mic into Audio 2? Finally, if you use a wireless mic receiver with RCA outputs, is there any need for the MA-100, Beachtek or Studio 1 adapters? Thanks for the help. __________________ Steve

February 10th, 2003, 11:14 AM	#6
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Chris, To best answer your question we really need to know more about what type of shooting you plan to do with the XL1s and ME-66. Mounted on tripod/stabilizer? Running around? Etc. Do you plan to mount the mic on the camera or use a boom/fishpole? You may be muddling the shoulder pad attribute of the MA-200 with its audio circuitry...something easily done. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

February 10th, 2003, 04:59 AM	#4
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	The other product is from Studio One. http://www.studio1productions.com/

February 10th, 2003, 11:29 AM	#7
Christopher Hughes Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sunderland, England (y Merida, Mexico) Posts: 269	Type of filming would be be just sort of location shooting - like weddings here and there, but more for single camera films (movies). Im not on a budget or anything, just my own money at the moment. I just thought that I could used the mic attached to camera and then use the XLR - 3.5mini jack from the back of the K6 to camera. Its possible that I would do walking when not on a tripod, so thats why I thought the MA-200 would be more useful, than the Beachtek so the wires go out of the way of tripod head area. Its very likely that in future I will use more than one mic set up, as and when I can afford more mics. But just wanted to know if everyone uses the MA-200 (or equivalent) or if some with single mic setups just shoot on mic to 3.5minijack. SO just after some general opinion, as to whether just get the gear in one go, or whether best to get mic and XLR-3.5mini, and then MA-200 as soon as I can afford it. Guess I'm just trying to cut corners where possible and share my costs around, ie, filters, mic, windjammer, etc. So every one on XLR? or would using the 3.5 mini just kill the quality same as using cheap cables????

February 10th, 2003, 11:45 AM	#8
Christopher Hughes Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sunderland, England (y Merida, Mexico) Posts: 269	just one more thing.... The mic would be just camera mounted, I will be using it for documentary style work, but that would be later in the year, so by then I would definitely have necessary kit of boom pole, XLR pack, etc. I would need the XLR to XLR, But the mic will be camera mounted for the moment, so not subjected to possible pulling on mic cable that could cause it to be pulled out easily. Im just bothered about quality is all. If I need a XLR kit - I need one. So far my mind is made up on MA-200, but some swear by Beachtek. Which would be the best for films and/or documentary - So on a whole like 90% tripod shots. So which is the best???? Or it just a matter of taste???

February 10th, 2003, 12:21 PM	#9
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	The BechTek is fine for straight 2-channel recording. But the MA-200 gives you up to 4 channels, has far more flexibility and capabilities than the Beachtek or Studio One, and offers a shoulder pad. Honestly, though, if you're comfortable with only camera-mounting the mic you don't really need anything other than an XLR-to-Mini adapter cable. (Defeating the balanced connection won't cause any noise trouble for such a tiny distance.) This would allow you to plug the mic directly into the standard mic socket. But before youo spend the savings note: you will need to also budget for an adapter to mount the ME-66 to your XL1s. The most popular is made by Lightwave Systems. Buying what you need up-front is less expensive than buying only what can afford and later replacing it with what you need. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

February 10th, 2003, 04:34 PM	#10
Christopher Hughes Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Sunderland, England (y Merida, Mexico) Posts: 269	Ken, You think the clamp is necessary?, just with mics before as with the days using an PD-150 we would just use the on-camera clamp and make a tube of a kind of rubbery foam like the can coolers or those 'springy' 35mm camera straps or even thin bits of rubber cut from car tires, with gave it a nice tight fit and acted like shock absorber [any skateboarders amongst us will verify to the great shock absorbsion] and I believe there was a post last week on this matter. So you use the Lightwave clamp? Cos from what I believe the K6 & ME66 is a little thinner than the regular Canon mic so would sit in the regular clamp using the technique I have said.

February 10th, 2003, 04:43 PM	#11
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	You can try to adapt the standard clamp with some type of sleeve but you're likely to get some handling noise, particularly on handheld shots. The Lightwave Isolator works pretty well in this regard. But hey, try the free path first if you've the time and inclination for experimentation. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

February 11th, 2003, 10:55 AM	#12
Brian M. Dickman Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 148	<<<-- Originally posted by Don Palomaki : The other product is from Studio One. http://www.studio1productions.com/ -->>> According to Tom at Zotz Digital, the last batch of Studio1 XLR boxes they got had plastic cases, not metal, so they're going to be moving away from them. They're looking at SignVideo as a potential replacement vendor. SignVideo make an XLR box very similar to Beachtek and Studio1, with an undercamera mounting screw. According to the website literature it has a beltclip of some sort as well. http://www.signvideo.com

February 11th, 2003, 11:50 AM	#13
Tustin Larson Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Palm Springs, CA Posts: 86	I have the ME66/K6 setup with the MA-200. I think it works great. I did not buy an adapter for it to fit in the mic slot. I just took some cloth medical tape and wrapped it a few times towards the back of the mic. It works great, and holds tight. Also, when you use the MA-200, it is my opinion that you need more weight on the back of the cam. So I bought the dual battery adapter and 2 large batteries. This helps keep it steady. And for my own personal taste, I like to extend the MA-200 out almost as far as it will go..... for almost perfect balance. Hope this helps... Tustin

February 17th, 2003, 08:16 AM	#14
Charles Fields New Boot Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 19	I have the Studio 1 XLR-BP Pro. Great unit. When you order, tell them you are using it with the XL1 or XL1s, they will give you an adapter cable so you can adapt the 1/8" stereo plug to RCA plugs so you can go in either thru the 1/8" jack or the RCA jacks on the back of the camera. I had there old XLR adapter, didn't like the way it mounted under the XL1. The new XLR-BP Pro's clip on your belt. MUCH nicer. Someone commented they are in a plastic box. Yes, they are, but it does keep them light weight since they are on your belt. Even though they are in plastic, they are very rugged. I was shooting from the roof of a building and knocked my Mic and XLR-BP Pro off the building. The mic broke, but the XLR adapter didn't. One note, they XLR-BP Pro is lined with a shielding material in addition to having other components shielded. This was brought up once before and I believe that someone from Zotz's stated they weren't shielded. This is BS that Zotz's is passing around. It is even stated on the Studio 1 website that the XLR-BP Pro is shielded. Just want to set the record straight. Charles