What do I need to edit HDV?

[Andreas Dobler]

Hi

I am a totally newbie in HDV. Actually I am a newbie in taking videos at all. So please excuse me some naive questions.

With an HDR-HC1 I have shot a movie of a friends wedding and want to edit it now on my computer. But when I transfer the file on my computer the movie cannot be watched because it's bucking and pixeling and the frame rate is far too slow. The sound is OK but as the frame rate is too slow the sound does not fit to the frames.

I don't know but is it possible that my computer is too weak to edit HDV movies?

My computer:
AMD Athlon XP 3000+
Hard drive: 7200 rpm
Graphic: ATI Radeon 9200SE 128MB
512 MB RAM
Software: Adobe Premiere Pro with HDV Plugin + cineform aspect HD (trial version) --> correct format HDV 1080i 25fps?

What system would you recommend me?

If it's possible to edit HDV with this configuration, can somebody help me out? What did I wrong?

Thanks for any input!

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

If it's bucking and pixeling with the CineForm codec, there is something wrong with your system.
I'm on a slower machine using Sony Vegas, and editing using the CineForm codec, getting smooth playback. Have you upgraded to the most recent version? That likely won't help the bucking/frame skipping, but you'll want it anyhow, IMO.
You might even try the free demo of Vegas Movie Studio.

[Stu Holmes]

Certainly sounds like a capture/PC issue.
The camera will only drop the frame-rate if you force it to by using a very slow shutter speed. Otherwise it'll stay at 30fps (ok 29.97 for the pedants) for NTSC or 25fps for PAL.

i'm assuming here that if you just playback the footage via the cam plugged into a TV with the original tape it looks fine ?

[David Newman]

Andreas,

Your system should be sufficient when using Aspect HD. If you have capture issue might accidentally be capture using the built in capture within Premiere 1.5.1. To avoid this and use the Aspect HD cature tools only, make sure your start your Premiere project using the Aspect HD preset that matches your camera (i.e. 1440x1080i25), no do use anything called "HDV ..." as those presets are the old Adobe modes and they don't work as well.

Also you can capturing using HDLink which operates externally to Premiere (go to the start menu as select programs->CineForm->AspectHD->HDLink.) With this tool you can diagnos if you PC has a capture issue (e.g. bad Firewire card or cable) as it allows you to capture without converting to CineForm Intermediate on the fly -- this allows support for the slowest of PCs. If HDLink is not working for capture you should file a trouble ticket at www.cineform.com/support -- yes you can use our support before you become a customer (if we help you now you are more likely to become one.)

[Andreas Dobler]

Thanks for your answers. Stu Holmes brought me on the right path. I have always used 25fps to record but it is actually 30. But there still remains one problem. I've taken now aspect HD 1440x1080 30i for the project in Adobe Premiere. When I record a sequence and watch it in Premiere it displays correctly but when I watch it with real player or windows media player the framerate is again 25fps because the video is still recorded in 25 but is just displayed in Premiere with 30fps. What do I have to change to save the file in the correct format?

Thanks again.

[David Newman]

I'm still a little confused about what you did. What frame rate was you camera running at, 25 or 30 -- PAL or NTSC? Then what editing mode did you use, NTSC instead of PAL? When you say "I have always used 25fps to record but it is actually 30" -- what were you trying to do?

[Andreas Dobler]

OK. As I have no experience with editing videos it was trial by error for me to get this thing working. In the manual of the camera it is written that the camera is working at 25 MB/s / PAL / 1080i / interlaced.

So, when I started a project in Premiere I have chosen the "Aspect HD 1440x1080 25i" and recorded a sequence. I haven't seen any option to choose between PAL or NTSC. When I was watching now this sequence in premiere it was displayed too slow.

Today I tried the option "Aspect HD 1440x1080 30i". With this option the movie was displayed correctly. That is why I guess that this movie was recorded with 30fps on the camera.

But the movie was only displayed correctly in Premiere, because there in the options it is showed that the movie should run with 30fps. However in the options of the .avi file you could still see that the file was stored in 25fps instead of the 30fps. I do not understand why. So when I open the file now with real player or win media player the framerate is too slow because they use the 25 out of the .avi file. Does somebody know how to solve this issue?
________________________

I have also read today that I need a monitor with a resolution of at least 1900x1200 what I don't have yet. At the moment, until the new one is ordered I have to work with 1024x768 :( Is that a big problem?

@David: special thanks to you for your patience and your helpful answers. It's just a matter of time that you will get a new customer.

[David Newman]

This is confusing as Aspect HD will capture at the frame rate specified by the camera (not by the editing mode in Premiere.) So where you use mode "Aspect HD 1440x1080 30i" or "Aspect HD 1440x1080 25i" the file should preserve is actual frame rate. With Premiere, click on the file that the frame rate will be displayed in the top left thumbnail (with the clips bin.) You may find you PC is too slow for desktop playback, so don't confuse slow playback in media player as a fault with the file. You may have to upload a small sequence of M2T data (a few seconds) so we can determine what your camera is actually doing.

As for the monitor size, any will work, 1920x1200 is nice. I work with a 1280x1024 at home and 1600x1200 at the office. We have a few 1920x1200 displays for the Prospect HD systems.

[Andreas Dobler]

Thanks. I will do that, but it will take some days until I can send you this data, because I don't have the camera available for the next days.

What are these M2T data and how should I send you these data? E-Mail?

[David Newman]

Use HDLink to capture a short segment (10 seconds max.) with the capture option set to Capture only the MPEG2-TS file (*.m2t.) This is the raw camera data before it is converted to CineForm Intermediate. As the file will be too big to email, throw it on a web site (if you have one) if not there are a range of web services for sending large data (anyone have a suggestion for this?)

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

On the display side, check out the Sony 234 monitors. They've just discontinued them, so the price is dropping. I have two of them. 1900 x 1200. Sexy and sweet for HD work without an HD/SDI monitor. One of our editors has a Toshiba, forget the model, but it too, is 1900 x 1200 and very nice looking. I don't like the silver bezel, neither did he, so he covered it with black gaffers tape, but otherwise, it's about the same as the Sony for similar price.

[Tommy James]

I got a flyer from the Modesto Bee offering Vegas Movie Studio + DVD Platinum which handles HDV all for 100 bucks. So the question is what do I get for a hundred bucks. Also I assume that this program handles 720p as well as 1080i correct ?

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

Vegas Movie Studio Platinum manages HD, HDV, at 720p and 1080i. It also scales 1080 to 720, or line-doubles 1080i to 1080p. For the price, there is nothing that competes, which is likely why it's the top-selling consumer/prosumer NLE in its price category.

[George Ellis]

Originally Posted by Douglas Spotted Eagle

Vegas Movie Studio Platinum manages HD, HDV, at 720p and 1080i. It also scales 1080 to 720, or line-doubles 1080i to 1080p. For the price, there is nothing that competes, which is likely why it's the top-selling consumer/prosumer NLE in its price category.

Next month, Pinnacle Studio 10 will. :)

[Douglas Spotted Eagle]

Originally Posted by George Ellis

Next month, Pinnacle Studio 10 will. :)

Will what? Beat VMS sales? Or edit HDV?
Pinnacle is too late to beat the seasonal load in to the retailers, so it won't be VMS in sales there....
And as far as editing 1080 or 720..VMS already does. So there. (sticking tongue out like 3 year old) :-)