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-   -   New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/digital-video-industry-news/534171-new-canon-cinema-eos-c200-200b.html)

Rakesh Malik June 15th, 2017 04:35 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Huff (Post 1933456)
Yet you don't own one, and it makes no sense in the context, so why are you pushing for it? The crop is 1.87 to Full Frame, and even higher in 2K. ProRes is only 2K, so that's a 3.74x crop for all ProRes shooting. And you still haven't considered the display costs and the $850 per 120GB Red Mags. It's not even an option, and to continually suggest one in this thread continues to render an example of your poor suggestions.
You're right, I don't own one, I have a different model of Red.

However, to address your obvious cluelessness, Red's ProRes is, as is the case with most cameras that support it, scaled from the full frame rather than cropped.

Gary Huff June 15th, 2017 04:53 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakesh Malik (Post 1933457)
However, to address your obvious cluelessness, Red's ProRes is, as is the case with most cameras that support it, scaled from the full frame rather than cropped.
Yes, I'm the clueless one, not you who thinks an $17k Red package (not including batteries of course) shooting 2K ProRes and *all* 4K being in REDCODE is totally comparable to a C200. Clearly, I'm the one who is clueless.

Rakesh Malik June 15th, 2017 05:24 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Huff (Post 1933458)
Yes, I'm the clueless one, not you who thinks an $17k Red package (not including batteries of course) shooting 2K ProRes and *all* 4K being in REDCODE is totally comparable to a C200. Clearly, I'm the one who is clueless.
It doesn't take much to figure out that you CAN rig up a working Raven for around $13K + batteries, and when you account for an external recorder, the difference is still less extreme than you think it is. The bigger down side to the Raven is that so many people are buying them... because they're so inexpensive.

Besides "all 4K is in RedCode" isn't a down side; it imports natively into almost every NLE out there, which will probably be true for Canon's Raw Light format pretty soon also.

Either way, it's more competition, though this time I suspect that it's Black Magic that will get the squeeze.

Gary Huff June 15th, 2017 05:26 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakesh Malik (Post 1933460)
It doesn't take much to figure out that you CAN rig up a working Raven for around $13K + batteries, and when you account for an external recorder, the difference is still less extreme than you think it is.
And the C200 is $7500. So why don't you break down what you get for $13k + batteries exactly?

And as for an external recorder, that's something most people already have, so you can't really count that.

Rakesh Malik June 15th, 2017 05:34 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Huff (Post 1933461)
And the C200 is $7500. So why don't you break down what you get for $13k + batteries exactly?
Figure out yourself. It's not hard.

Gary Huff June 15th, 2017 05:39 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakesh Malik (Post 1933462)
Figure out yourself. It's not hard.
Like the rest of your advice, you just made that number up here on the spot without knowing if it's correct or not.

For $12.5k I can purchase a C200, 1TB of CFast media (over 4 cards, for about 120 minute of raw recording), 4 A30 batteries, and an Atomos 7" Flame Recorder with 1TB of media.

For $15.5k I can purchase a Red Raven with 120GB of media (for 14 minutes of recording), 2 batteries, and a 4.7" screen.

Cliff Totten June 15th, 2017 05:52 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Anybody know if the C200 will accept any size CFast card? Is it locked down to 128, 256 or 512...etc?

I certainly hope Canon didnt do that. Although these days, I wouldn't put it past them. ;-)

Gary Huff June 15th, 2017 06:03 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
I know Canon updated the firmware on the C300 II to allow for recording on the new Sandisk CFast 256GB cards and Lexar says their 512GB 3500x cards are compatible as well. I have never heard of a Canon camera of any kind being directly crippled in that way, unless those Lexar cards can't support the lite raw codec for some reason (usually sustained write speeds aren't quite up to snuff)

Cliff Totten June 16th, 2017 08:37 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Huff (Post 1933439)
General statements of this nature cannot, by their very definition, be true.



Then there are other options for you, including a GH5 + Shogun. Or even a GH4 + Shogun.

But for some reason you don't want those other options.
I actually have a GH5 rig with a Pix E5 on top. I'm completely blown away by how well the 5k readout to 4k scaling looks in 10bit VLog. The GH5 is literally no joke! Wow!

Gary Huff June 16th, 2017 09:12 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Totten (Post 1933499)
I actually have a GH5 rig with a Pix E5 on top. I'm completely blown away by how well the 5k readout to 4k scaling looks in 10bit VLog. The GH5 is literally no joke! Wow!
I have one as a B-camera to my C300 Mark II.

Danilo Del Tufo June 17th, 2017 08:50 AM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
I still haven't understood this : when do you record in 4K RAW, the LCD display shows desatured colors, ( I mean a LOG image) ?

Gary Huff June 17th, 2017 09:27 AM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Danilo Del Tufo (Post 1933512)
I still haven't understood this : when do you record in 4K RAW, the LCD display shows desatured colors, ( I mean a LOG image) ?
On the C100/C300 II models, whenever you record in a log image you have the option of turning on a viewing LUT for the built-in display. I would assume that is the case here as well.

Paul Chiappini June 17th, 2017 12:29 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Huff (Post 1933500)
I have one as a B-camera to my C300 Mark II.
I'm thinking of getting a GH5 as well to go with my C300 MkII. What are your thoughts after using this combo?

Gary Huff June 17th, 2017 12:54 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Chiappini (Post 1933522)
I'm thinking of getting a GH5 as well to go with my C300 MkII. What are your thoughts after using this combo?
I am very pleased with how close the color is on the GH5. It's nowhere near as clean as the C300 in higher ISOs (1600+), but the picture is really nice in the 400-800 range and 1600 is totally useable. In my testing, I found that the Natural with contrast and sharpness turned down all the way, and then saturation at -3 made for a good foundation to finish matching to the C300 in its Rec.709 mode. I also like that it can record 10-bit 422 so that it's in the league as my C300 II as well.

The Sony PDAF was good for AF like DPAF on the C300 (although Canon's DPAF is better), and I do miss that, but everything else is spot on for a B-camera. I used it in conjunction extensively just yesterday with the Speedbooster Ultra and the Canon lenses in my kit and I am very pleased with the results.

Paul Chiappini June 17th, 2017 03:14 PM
Re: New Canon Cinema EOS C200 and 200B
 
Thanks for the response!


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