Final Cut Pro and XDCAM EX -- various topics
 

What FCP setting for editing 1080 30p footage?

I'm cutting my first show in Final Cut and have a question about logging clip info.

I'm wanting to know if there is some way to get the Clip Comments that I enter in the XDCam Transfer software (with Final Cut open and I used the Import/XDCam menu option) to come along with my clip.

In the XDCam Transfer software, there is a Source section and a Clip section, both have a comments field.

I've figured out that the Title can help you rename the .mov clip to something more human readable, but I'm also wanting the comments to come over as well into a comments field in my clip browser in Final Cut.

Is this possible?

NOTE: I found out that I hadn't pressed ENTER while in the Clip/Comment field. Once I did that, the comment transferred over to the Log Note in FCP just fine.

Thanks,

Jim

Good to know. Thanks Jim! (I didn't know that Comments would transfer. I thought it was only the Clip name) Cool!

Why not use the Log and Transfer plugin for FCP instead of XDCAM Transfer? I've heard XDCAM Transfer is faster but the Log and Transfer plugin keeps all of your logging info within your FCP project file.

Andy

I use Clip Browser before importing to FC. Then I can delete bad clips before archiving, even bad parts of long clips. I change the clip name to something understandable and also write something in the "Description" field. This comment in "Description" will be imported to "Log_note" in FC when importing with XDCAM Transfer. Very useful.

From Sony's Micro site: (Sony | Micro Site - XDCAM EX)
------------------------------
Log and Transfer Utility for Apple FCP Version 1.00

The Log and Transfer plug in software utility for XDCAM EX allows any resolution of current XDCAM EX file to be easily imported within FCP using the standard Log and Transfer interface within FCP.

Works with Apple Tiger /Leopard Operating System (Mac OS X Ver10.4.11 or later) also requires FCP 6.03 or later.

Instructions:
1) Create a new folder to copy dmg file to.
2) Copy file to your Mac.
3) Double click on the icon in the folder you have created.
4) Installer will launch. Follow the installation instructions.
5) Use the Log and transfer window to ingest EX files into FCP.

NOTE: XDCAM Transfer has the following advantages over Log and Transfer
Support both XDCAM EX & XDCAM Disc
Handles XDCAM EX and XDCAM Disc clips
mounting SxS & PD media at the same time
MXF export capability
Can write edited material back to Professional Disc in MXF files
Standalone browser/viewer
Browsing/viewing are possible without running Final Cut Pro

Other benefits
Full-screen playback
Cache functionThumbnail information available even after ejecting the media
Can create multiple sub clips by Mark In/Out

Log and Transfer has the advantage of working directly within the standard Log and Transfer interface within FCP

Click here to download the software

What FCP setting for editing 1080 30p footage?
 

Okay, I'm about to start editing the first footage I filmed with my EX1. I shot everything 1080 30p so I'm curious what setting in FCP to choose for the timeline? I see multiple options under Sequence Preset;

ProRes 422 1080 30p
DVCPro HD 1080 30p
HDV 1080 30p
XDCAM HD 1080 30p (VBR)
XDCAM HD 1080 30p (CBR)


Which is the best? I would assume one of the XDCAM options but I've also seen ProRes 422 mentioned in several threads. Once I get my editing situation up and running then I can worry about the downconversion problems everyone has a different opinion about.

Thanks for any input.

The easiest way to do a simple edit is just to drop a clip in the seq, FCP will ask if you want to adapt that clips settings to seq.

If you click apply then you will have a XDCAM HD 1080 30p (VBR) or XDCAM HD 1080 30p (CBR) depending on how you shot the video.

This works great for a simple edit session, no rendering needed to play.

If you need to do a lot of cc or composting the Prores422HQ 30p is best. If you are jumping into Color then set color to output that as well.

I shoot mainly 1080 30p and edit with Final Cut Pro so I feel qualified to answer this! :)

1) Use EASY SETUP. It makes things REALLY easy. Just go to Final Cut Pro>Easy Setup and choose XDCAM EX 1080p30 VBR. Make sure you choose the one with EX in the name. If you don't have any with EX in the name, let me know and I'll tell you the fix (thanks Craig!)

2) File>New Project and you'll be all set.

3) Select your Sequence in the Browser window (highlight it) and go to Sequence>Settings. Go to the Render Control tab and change Codec: Same as Sequence Codec to Codec: Apple ProRes 422 [HDV, XDCAM HD/EX only]. This will force FCP to render in ProRes instead of XDCAM EX. This will save you time and you'll have fewer problems (at least in my experience).

From now on, every new sequence you create will have the correct sequence settings for your footage. It will play without rendering. NOTE: Don't forget to manually perform Step #3 every time you create a new Project. Easy Setup won't do this step for you.

Chad I have shot 4TB of EX1 footage in the last year and for 1080p 30p I use the FC XDCAM EX 1080p 30p VBR with excellent results.

I just noticed that in your original message you don't see a choice for XDCAM EX (only XDCAM HD). I'm guessing you have the same problem that quite a few of us had. Here's how to add XDCAM EX settings to FCP. (thanks Craig!)

If Final Cut Pro is running, quit the application.

1) In the Finder navigate to Macintosh HD>Applications>Final Cut Pro Additional Easy Setups>English. Scroll down and you'll see the XDCAM EX settings your missing (there are 10 of them)

2) Navigate to Macintosh HD>Library>Application Support>Final Cut Pro System Support>Custom Settings. So now you should have two windows open in the Finder.

3) Drag the 10 XDCAM EX files from Step #1 window into the second window Custom Settings folder.

Launch Final Cut Pro and you should now see XDCAM EX settings in your Easy Setup menu. This should make things a lot easier for you. :)

Thanks guys for your input. Mitchell, I followed your steps for getting the EX option to show up under the Easy Setup. Was dragging the 10 files over any different than just copying them and paste. By dragging them out and removing them from the first folder, will that affect anything I do later on?, or does it only matter that they're in the folder they are now?

One other question, when I highlight the Sequence and then click on Sequence>Settings and adjust the codec to ProRes 422, on the "General" tab, what "Pixel Aspect Ratio" should I set to? Right now it defaults to "Square". The last thing I edited was DV 4x3. Which of the HD options should I go with?, and should I check the Anamorphic 16:9 box?

Thanks for all your help. Greatly appreciated.

1) You can copy/paste them. It doesn't matter. In fact if you drag them over but hold down the option key while dragging, you'll notice your "mouse arrow" turn into a "plus sign". This is telling you that you're about to copy the files over instead of moving them. Try it and you'll see what I mean.

2) Re-read what I wrote. Once you have selected XDCAM EX 1080 30p VBR in Easy Setup, all new projects you create will have the correct Sequence settings.....except, the Render tab setting. That's where you want to change the compressor to ProRes, not the compression setting in the General tab. You got that part mixed up. :)

Final Cut Pro Sequence Render Setting. Avoids Long GOP Conform during editing.

Thanks again. I did understand what you were saying Mitchell, I had changed the setting under the Render tab, I just was just also checking out the other tabs to see what was there and noticed the General tab had those pixel settings. I wasn't sure if that needed changing, but after clicking on a few HD options I see that it really stretches the Viewer window out, which doesn't look right. So I left it at "Square".

If there were other options to change I'm sure you would have pointed those out anyway, I was just getting curious. So I'm all good now, I'll start editing this week. Then I'll have to sort out the downconversion steps for best outcome. I see lots of posts but no unifying best option.

Thank you for everyone's help!

Sorry.......Square Pixels is the correct setting for XDCAM EX footage.

Good luck with your first edit! :)

iMovie 09 works well with PMW-EX1 - HD Samples
 

Been using iMovie 09 for non critical work with PMW-EX1 1080/30p footage over the last month and while the video enhancement controls are sparten compared with Final Cut Pro 6, iMovie09 saves you a ton of time when doing fun stuff.

In this HD sample only 1080/30p from PMW-EX1 was used.
I cut up the footage with iMovie09 and used one of the themes.
Changing some of the timing tools and ken burns effects give me this:
6000kbs encoded using 29.97fps, H264 and Quicktime for YouTube.com

YouTube - PS196 does Rumba and the Waltz - Ball Room Dancing by Larocca 5th Graders in HD 720p (Sony PMW-EX1)


This HD sample has a short portion from a Canon HG10 in the front at 1080/60i
iMovie09 cannot handle mixed media right now perfectly as the 60i footage seems badly encoded when compared with the main 1080/30p material. I think I can work around this by processing the 1080/60i source with FCP but again, iMovie09 is for saving time. If you want to do critical stuff, iMovie 09 is not my recommendation.
still, this stuff looks good enough in HD
7000kbs at 29.97fps, H264 and Quicktime

YouTube - William Chiu plays Chopin Nocturne Op 9 No 2 (Lyrical poetry to Madame Camille Pleyel)


In this last HD sample you see the limitations of iMovie 09 with video enhancement.
the 1080/30p footage was taken with the wrong +9db gain setting for the fireworks show.
I should have used +0 or +3db. As such, the graininess showed throughout and without Final Cut Studio's great noise controls, iMovie09 handle it only ok for 720p resolution.
8000kbs at 29.97fps, H264 and Quicktime
(BTW, the cropping used in the fireworks footage was as much as 50% of the original in order to isolate the castle and eliminate bodies!)

YouTube - Wishes Nighttime Spectacular Entertainment at Magic Kingdom Theme Park Fireworks in HD 720p / 1080p


Please share your settings and techniques!

paul

Final Cut Studio 2, with FCP 6: will it work with EX3
 

A producer/editor that I work with alot got a good deal today on a Final Cut Studio 2 package that includes FCP 6 and as I am not a editor.... my BIG questions is:

Will this new program work with native EX3 video files? and will we still have to use Sony 2.5 clip browser to convert the files?

I know that this seems silly and strange to most of you out there on this forum But the EX3 camera and the SxS,KxS world is all new to us ,as we have both have made a large investment in gear and computers.

So, I just want to make sure this will all work and we can live "happily ever after" in the XDCAM EX world.....

thanks

Sigh, doesn't Sony's site provide any info?

ClipBrowser 2.5 is for copying files primarily as far as FCP is concerned.
XDCAM Transfer 2.9 rewraps to MOV for FCP.
Sony has Log and Transfer plugin for FCP as well.

Sony | Micro Site - XDCAM EX

Sony | Micro Site - XDCAM EX

http://pro.sony.com/bbsccms/assets/f...lCutPro_R1.pdf

I've used fcp 6 with the Ex cams for over a year now. It's a great tool and you will have no problems with the xdcam integration

Bill: The answer is yes. :)

How "snappy" is it to work with XDCAM EX footage using iMovie? I'm on a newer MacBook Pro and when trying to edit with Final Cut 6, it's kind of sluggish. Usable, but nothing like editing on our 8-core MacPro. Does iMovie help in this area?

Apple always designs great looking templates. I haven't even looked at iMovie 9 yet. Thanks for the heads up! :)

i know what you mean by sluggish working with FCP 6 even with a mac pro. with macbook pro, even with a recent 2.66 unibody, loading of XDCAM-EX files can be slow. rendering is faster, but the general moving around, 3 color correction, audio editing can still be slow on the mbp15-2.80. i have yet to test a mbp17-2.93 with 8gb ram, but FCP is a pig. powerful, but needs tons of ram.

with a mbp15-2.80, iMovie09 is very quick loading XDCAM-EX 1080/30p footage. moving portions around is quick and pause-free.
rendering on the mbp15-2.80 is about 20 minutes for 8 minutes of 1080p footage into quicktime h264 at 8000bps. very acceptable.

i recommend iMovie09 for casual work!

paul

Thanks Paul! I'm going to have to give it a try soon. Thanks for sharing.

Some edit software will work 'natively' with EX footage. FCP needs the original footage put in the electronic equivalent of a brown paper bag to keep things together. So the files aren't converted, just 'bagged up'.

Another analogy I've thought of (probably due to the lateness of the hour) is that if each shot from your EX camera wants to enter the Final Cut Pro conference, it needs to get a little badge and a goody bag, which is what happens in Clip Browser or XDCAM Transfer.

Of course, Clip Browser can clip on a different sort of badge and a different conference pack for the Avid conference or even (sorry about this) mince up the delegate and reconstitute him or her as a SD clip, WMV or whatever. It's been that kind of day.

But I wouldn't get too stressed about the ability to edit 'native' versus the software helper route. It has advantages of backup, adding extra data, batch naming and filing. And it's not altering the actual visual data at all.

A variant on Matt's analogy.

Each NLE is a fairly exclusive nightclub with a dress code.
XDCAM Transfer will make sure it's dressed for the FCP nightclub (with MOV clothing)
ClipBrowser can make sure it's dressed for the Avid nightclub (with MXF for NLE clothing)
Then there are the "naturist" camps that will let them in with naked MP4.

If your machines are at least intel dual core processors, you should have no problems.

what if?
 

What if you want the footage shot on an EX camera used in more than one edit system?

Lets say I transfer the footage from the cards via clip browser to a hard drive and put it in an FCP wrapper. Then that hard drive gets taken to a different editor who uses Premiere on a PC system. Then what? Then a month later the client goes to a different editor who uses AVID or ?

this is one reason I always keep a copy of the entire BPVA folder, even after logged and transferd to final cut. Problem is that they can't pick up from your edit as it has to be logged again

Sorry, I don't understand this comment. I am very new to all this. Speak VERRRRY slowly and with very simple words!

I mean that the clips you have imported into final cut can't be taken directly into premiere. If you have a copy of the original BPVA folder ie. Everything that was on the SxS card you can bring that folder into premiere and edit the same footage, but you have to start from scratch since you don't have the edit points you made in final cut

Opinion Needed - EX3 - New Tower how much Ram????
 

Hello everyone, We are about to buy a New Mac System, we will be editing HD Video from our 2 EX3 Camera's. Along with Authoring it to BluRay via Toast 10 and Encore.

The Issue is, how much Ram to get?

The System will be running the following. Do you guys see any problems or any overkill within the system? Your expert knowledge would be very much appreciated.

do we need 16 Gigs of Ram or will a smaller amount do the job.??????

System specs

Final Cut Studio 2
ADOBE CREATIVE SUITE 4 PRODUCTION PREMIUM

Two 2.93GHz Quad-Core IXeon “Nehalem” processors
16GB (8x2GB) 1066MHz DDR3 ECC SDRAM
Mac Pro RAID Card
1TB 7200-rpm Serial ATA 3Gb/s
1TB 7200-rpm Serial ATA 3Gb/s
1TB 7200-rpm Serial ATA 3Gb/s
1TB 7200-rpm Serial ATA 3Gb/s
ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB
One 18x SuperDrive/Plus external Blu-Ray burner
Apple Cinema HD Display (30" flat panel)

THANK YOU

Do you NEED 16 gigs of ram? No. But it would be cool to have : ).

Minimum for that setup I would say 8gigs. Should keep you happy.

JS

While there is some dispute over whether 6 slots is better than 8, barefeats and diglloyd have put the new Nehalem through its paces and agree that mo' is better. You should get 16.

Memory Tech Notes on "Nehalem" Mac Pro

Macintosh Performance Guide: Reviews ? 2009 Mac Pro Nehalem ? Introduction

And it looks like if you have Silverado configure your system, you'll get the RAM for free (but compare the cost to what it would take to get the RAM from OWC @$289 for 16 gb)

Silverado Systems, Inc. :: HARDWARE :: Apple Hardware :: Apple Mac Pro :: Apple Mac Pro - 8-Core Intel Core i7 Nehalem for StudioBuilder Readers

I use and almost identical set up as you are looking to purchase:

MacPro 2 x 3Ghz Quad-Core Intel Zeon
9 GB of RAM

Ciprico RAID (5-drives / Fibre channel connection to MacPro)
Apple 30-inch Cinema Display
LG USB external Blu-Ray burner

We use Final Cut Studio 2 and Adobe Creative Suite 3 Production Premium (need to upgrade to 4) I've never missed not having 16 GB. Most software won't utilize more than 3 or 4 GB. Don't waste your money. :)

You will probably find that 4GB of ram is really all you will ever need.
I don't think FCP can use more than 2.5GB of ram. That seems to be the max on my MBP 15" late 2008.

It's BPAV folder, which is the native format that is stored on the Sony Flash Memory cards.

Actually, one of the small complaints I now have, and this is probably not Sony's fault at all but Apple's fault, is the need to wrap the EX1 codec files at all as quicktime files in order to use them in Final Cut Pro. Obviously there isn't any transcoding or other processing done to the files, they just need the Quicktime wrappers added to the files.

However, this requires a somewhat time consuming wrapping and copy of the files from the native XDCAM EX to MOV. This results in another copy of the files, and as is noted above, not necessarily compatible with other NLEs. It would be a lot more convenient for FCP to just use the native files. Obviously it's very possible, the Mac version of the XDCAM clip browser can read them with no problem. Apple, if you're listening, make FCP read native XDCAM files -and while you're at it, native AVCHD too!

I'd say it's a marketing decision to not support open standards by Apple. They make their money by being proprietary, or they would disappear over night.

There is a plug-in for OSX that adds MXF read function. Calibrated{Q} MXF Import for OSX

Maximum memory usage in Final Cut Pro is 2.5 GB
 

This is what our Mac dealer says - it's a revelation!! :

Hi Mark,

Please take a look at the following document:

Maximum memory usage in Final Cut Pro is 2.5 GB

I reckon we can utilise the additional RAM by creating a RAM disk, where Final Cut can use this as an accelerated scratch disk increasing performance...

So the only advantage jumping from 16GB to 32GB is to have more applications open simultaneously or to increase the size of the RAM disk.

Another what if?
 

What if you are shooting stock footage with an EX?

You need to edit down your raw footage and store it on drives or DVD's. When it's time to deliver a clip to a buyer what do you deliver? What files do you actually store?

I think it may help to look not just at what FCP alone is using. When a render in
After Effects can chew up 15 gb of RAM: Adobe After Effects 7 vs 8 (CS3) on various Macs

and with memory so cheap, I tend to agree with this:

"How much memory?
For the MP09, all users are advised to go immediately to 16GB (8 X 2GB)— it’s a small fraction of the system price (10% or less), and there is absolutely no sense in spending $3300 - $6000 on the Mac Pro, then skimping on a few hundred dollars of memory."
Macintosh Performance Guide: Reviews ? 2009 Mac Pro Nehalem ? Conclusions