New US air travel rules for cam. batteries

Kevin Martorana · December 29th, 2007, 08:18 AM

Interesting about FedEx Ground. I know they are a different company from Express...

I have only shipped Express...usually priority or 2nd day.

In shipping FEDEX Ground.....it takes too long for the equipment to get to the location...OR it gets there a day or two early...which means it can sit around and be a possibility for theft.

Thanks again for the "bad" news about Ground.

I'm so amazed that all this big companies...ie: airlines, shipping companies...etc can enforce these ridiclious "hidden" guidelines in their business. I know..it's probably on some piece of paper..in 2pt. font when you do the shipping bill....but it's amazing.

If all of us ran our business this way...we'd be out of business. I know they're dealing with MILLIONS of customers a day....but still.

I think I heard that FedEx ships over a million packages a day. They have a 99% success ratio each day. That means that 100,000 packages didn't get to the right place. Alot of packages....but also 100k people that are seriously bummed.

Peter Ferling · December 29th, 2007, 11:11 AM

Our shipping department always ships expensive/insured items overnight. The package is always moving and is placed right on the plane. Second on the list is avoiding saturday deliveries if possible.

Alex Dolgin · December 29th, 2007, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Miller

The travel restrictions in the US are completely ungrounded (no pun intended!) in reality.

They should restrict the number of pens or pencils in case you have a sudden urge to stab someone in the jugular.

I wonder who decides these idiotic things that serve no purpose other than to remind travelers of the boogie man.

This picture is self explanatory. A recent incident with a video crew traveling on assignment to cover Anna Nichole Smith death... http://dolgin.net/Li-IonFire.jpg Also, there was a total loss of a UPS plane last year (after emergency landing)

Gabe Strong · December 29th, 2007, 12:39 PM

regarding Fed Ex:

I actually did know this about Fed Ex Ground. Where I live, the Fed Ex Ground 'third party contractor' only delivers two days a week.....and you never know which days they will be. If you happen to be out you won't get the package. I have had a HUGE problem with them because of this. However, I have had a problem with Fed Ex in general. Four different times, I needed something within two or three days and paid $150 extra to have it shipped Fed Ex next day air. EVERY TIME it didn't get to me in time. When I attempted to get a refund, I found that Fed Ex has an out clause for shipping to Alaska, basically they don't have to honor their on time guarantee for shipping here. Ever since then I will us ANYONE other than Fed Ex.....maybe it's petty but I refuse to give my business to a company after having that happen to me.

Brian Drysdale · December 29th, 2007, 12:54 PM

Here's a video of a Li-ion battery catching fire in a laptop.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=WeWq6rWzChw

Greg Boston · December 29th, 2007, 01:35 PM

We have a no-rant policy here at DVINFO and this thread is supposed to be about air travel with lithium type batteries. This is not supposed to be a rant session on a particular freight company's policies or shortcomings.

Thanks,

-gb-

John Miller · December 29th, 2007, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Dolgin

This picture is self explanatory. A recent incident with a video crew traveling on assignment to cover Anna Nichole Smith death...
http://dolgin.net/Li-IonFire.jpg
Also, there was a total loss of a UPS plane last year (after emergency landing)

I fully understand the seriousness of the chemical fire that can occur. That's why I can't understand the arbitrary nature of the restrictions. If such incidents can lead to loss of an aircraft then active use of any electronic items using such batteries should be prohibited. Period.

The notion that if the fire starts while someone is operating the equipment makes it safer is nonsense. Looking at the video posted to this thread, if such a thing happened, there would be immediate panic in the cabin. The owner of the equipment would have little idea how to react in a calm and safe manner.

Like I said, the mentality towards safety is one of probabilities rather than absolutes. i.e., dollars vs lives.

Bill Ward · December 29th, 2007, 06:30 PM

OK, then. I travel with 4-5 IDX Lithium-Ion bricks for my BetaCam and HDCam with a capacity about 70-80 WH each.

I normally have them in a Pelican case with the segmented interior, each brick in its own little compartment. How am I supposed to transport them with the rest of my gear in a manner that's more safe than that, and which the TSA will allow?

Technically, wouldn't shipping them ahead FedEx have the same issues as shipping them on a plane with my other equipment cases?

Drew Long · December 30th, 2007, 02:26 PM

People
Unfortunately shoddy reporting is starting all sorts of panic.

Here is a link to a website where the calculation of lithium content and real implications of the Li-Ion rules are:

http://wetpixel.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=22191

Sorry to the admin if this is against the rules. Just too much info to copy and paste.

Basically, most batteries should be under 8g of lithium and we are allowed to carry as many as we like.

Carl Middleton · December 30th, 2007, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drew Long

Basically, most batteries should be under 8g of lithium and we are allowed to carry as many as we like.

No..... We are allowed to carry up to a total of 25g. If like that site says, the Sony F970 battery - 7000mAh = 4.2g... We could bring a total of 5. Not unlimited under 8g.... over 8g is *not* permitted, period. Under 8g has the aggregate max.

C

Alex Dolgin · December 30th, 2007, 03:02 PM

They limit to 2 spare batteries. Look at the "special case" in the table...

Drew Long · December 30th, 2007, 03:31 PM

Carl

I left out the "how" part. You are allowed to hand carry as many lithium batteries as you like so long as it is under the 8g rule.

What is forbidden is spare batteries in the checked luggage. The 25g is the aggregate of the batteries over 8g. You are also allowed to have anything under 25g lithium content battery installed in the equipment as checked luggage. Please read the link in the first post. That is from DOT and is the official release.

Brian Drysdale · December 30th, 2007, 04:03 PM

This release says up to 2 spare batteries under "special case". All other references are to a single spare battery for a device, not numerious spare batteries for a device.

Drew Long · December 30th, 2007, 04:14 PM

That is my point. The other references (AP report, yahoo etc) are wrong.

Read the DOT release:

Under the new rules, you can bring batteries with up to 8-gram equivalent lithium content. All lithium ion batteries in cell phones are below 8 gram equivalent lithium content. Nearly all laptop computers also are below this quantity threshold.

You can also bring up to two spare batteries with an aggregate equivalent lithium content of up to 25 grams, in addition to any batteries that fall below the 8-gram threshold.

That means any battery under 8g content is allowed. There is no aggregate or limitation to quantity of any batteries under 8g of lithium content.

Brian Drysdale · December 30th, 2007, 04:39 PM

I believe the intention is that you can have a spare battery for each device under the 8 gram threshold.

However, it doesn't allow you to bring 4 batteries for your device (assuming one mounted on the device) unless (it seems) you have another device that uses the same battery and this is also allowed its own spare.

December 29th, 2007, 08:18 AM	#16
Kevin Martorana Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Lancaster, PA Posts: 250	Interesting about FedEx Ground. I know they are a different company from Express... I have only shipped Express...usually priority or 2nd day. In shipping FEDEX Ground.....it takes too long for the equipment to get to the location...OR it gets there a day or two early...which means it can sit around and be a possibility for theft. Thanks again for the "bad" news about Ground. I'm so amazed that all this big companies...ie: airlines, shipping companies...etc can enforce these ridiclious "hidden" guidelines in their business. I know..it's probably on some piece of paper..in 2pt. font when you do the shipping bill....but it's amazing. If all of us ran our business this way...we'd be out of business. I know they're dealing with MILLIONS of customers a day....but still. I think I heard that FedEx ships over a million packages a day. They have a 99% success ratio each day. That means that 100,000 packages didn't get to the right place. Alot of packages....but also 100k people that are seriously bummed. __________________ Shooting Video since 1/2" EIAJ reel to reel and editing on 2" QUAD machines. http://www.takeoneprod.com

December 29th, 2007, 11:11 AM	#17
Peter Ferling Trustee Join Date: May 2005 Location: Wyomissing, PA Posts: 1,141 Images: 57	Our shipping department always ships expensive/insured items overnight. The package is always moving and is placed right on the plane. Second on the list is avoiding saturday deliveries if possible. __________________ Pete Ferling http://ferling.net It's never a mistake if you learn something new from it. -------------------------------------------

December 29th, 2007, 01:35 PM	#21
Greg Boston Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: DFW area, TX Posts: 6,117 Images: 1	Keep the thread on topic please.... We have a no-rant policy here at DVINFO and this thread is supposed to be about air travel with lithium type batteries. This is not supposed to be a rant session on a particular freight company's policies or shortcomings. Thanks, -gb-

December 30th, 2007, 02:26 PM	#24
Drew Long Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 64	AP and other news reports are INCORRECT People Unfortunately shoddy reporting is starting all sorts of panic. Here is a link to a website where the calculation of lithium content and real implications of the Li-Ion rules are: http://wetpixel.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=22191 Sorry to the admin if this is against the rules. Just too much info to copy and paste. Basically, most batteries should be under 8g of lithium and we are allowed to carry as many as we like.

December 30th, 2007, 03:02 PM	#26
Alex Dolgin Contributor Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Lexington, Ma Posts: 286	They limit to 2 spare batteries. Look at the "special case" in the table... __________________ Alex Dolgin Dolgin Engineering Camera DC Power accessories, Fast 4 position Battery Charger http://www.dolgin.net

December 29th, 2007, 12:39 PM	#19
Gabe Strong Major Player Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Juneau, AK Posts: 814	regarding Fed Ex: I actually did know this about Fed Ex Ground. Where I live, the Fed Ex Ground 'third party contractor' only delivers two days a week.....and you never know which days they will be. If you happen to be out you won't get the package. I have had a HUGE problem with them because of this. However, I have had a problem with Fed Ex in general. Four different times, I needed something within two or three days and paid $150 extra to have it shipped Fed Ex next day air. EVERY TIME it didn't get to me in time. When I attempted to get a refund, I found that Fed Ex has an out clause for shipping to Alaska, basically they don't have to honor their on time guarantee for shipping here. Ever since then I will us ANYONE other than Fed Ex.....maybe it's petty but I refuse to give my business to a company after having that happen to me.

December 29th, 2007, 12:54 PM	#20
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	Here's a video of a Li-ion battery catching fire in a laptop. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=WeWq6rWzChw

December 29th, 2007, 06:30 PM	#23
Bill Ward Major Player Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 580	OK, then. I travel with 4-5 IDX Lithium-Ion bricks for my BetaCam and HDCam with a capacity about 70-80 WH each. I normally have them in a Pelican case with the segmented interior, each brick in its own little compartment. How am I supposed to transport them with the rest of my gear in a manner that's more safe than that, and which the TSA will allow? Technically, wouldn't shipping them ahead FedEx have the same issues as shipping them on a plane with my other equipment cases?

December 30th, 2007, 03:31 PM	#27
Drew Long Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 64	Carl I left out the "how" part. You are allowed to hand carry as many lithium batteries as you like so long as it is under the 8g rule. What is forbidden is spare batteries in the checked luggage. The 25g is the aggregate of the batteries over 8g. You are also allowed to have anything under 25g lithium content battery installed in the equipment as checked luggage. Please read the link in the first post. That is from DOT and is the official release. Last edited by Chris Hurd; December 30th, 2007 at 04:34 PM. Reason: Addition

December 30th, 2007, 04:03 PM	#28
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	This release says up to 2 spare batteries under "special case". All other references are to a single spare battery for a device, not numerious spare batteries for a device.

December 30th, 2007, 04:14 PM	#29
Drew Long Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 64	That is my point. The other references (AP report, yahoo etc) are wrong. Read the DOT release: Under the new rules, you can bring batteries with up to 8-gram equivalent lithium content. All lithium ion batteries in cell phones are below 8 gram equivalent lithium content. Nearly all laptop computers also are below this quantity threshold. You can also bring up to two spare batteries with an aggregate equivalent lithium content of up to 25 grams, in addition to any batteries that fall below the 8-gram threshold. That means any battery under 8g content is allowed. There is no aggregate or limitation to quantity of any batteries under 8g of lithium content. Last edited by Chris Hurd; December 30th, 2007 at 04:34 PM. Reason: Addition

December 30th, 2007, 04:39 PM	#30
Brian Drysdale Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 6,143	I believe the intention is that you can have a spare battery for each device under the 8 gram threshold. However, it doesn't allow you to bring 4 batteries for your device (assuming one mounted on the device) unless (it seems) you have another device that uses the same battery and this is also allowed its own spare.