Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499

Dan Carter · September 3rd, 2014, 06:30 PM

Very surprised Panasonic posted this video. It is bad to the point of embarrassing. As previously mentioned, it looks like bad SD footage.

Dave Blackhurst · September 3rd, 2014, 07:07 PM

Glad I'm not the only one that thinks the promo clip looks atrocious... when you are used to the AX100 4K output (which generally looks pretty good on YT), the Panasonic clip leaves you scratching your head... saw several sections with noticeable blocking, smearing is horrid, grass particularly was just a mess...

I saw similar "issues" in the FZ1000 clips, but ONLY in shadow areas, on this clip it was everywhere. the few short parts with heavily blurred backgrounds and only a part of the screen in focus looked almost OK, but on full screens, it looked like "detail" just overwhelmed the processor, leaving a blocky, mushy, smeary, visual turd...

I REALLY hope that there is not so much rush to get 4K product on the market that this is considered acceptable "output"... Certainly we already know that the AX100 and GH4 can produce excellent 4K... well under this price point.

Dan Carter · September 3rd, 2014, 09:28 PM

Thinking it must be an issue with one video, I found this equally disturbing example. Almost seems like an April Fools joke.

Mark Fry · September 4th, 2014, 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Zhang

This is the same concept as the FDR-AX1. Repurposing a cell phone sensor with a 1/3'' active image area to use for 4K. If you're wondering why the footage looks muddy, that's likely why.

I'm a little surprised Panasonic haven't used the 1" sensor from the FZ1000. Sony have already shown that 1" single-chip cameras (AX100) are a better compromise than 1/3" for 4k (AX1 / Z100). Maybe the X1000 is a stop-gap model while they work on a 1" model with a processor and recorder capable of handling 4k at 50p/60p? Or maybe this is the first, and smallest, of a range of 4k camcorders? It's certainly impressively small. The B&H images are quite startling - the pictures of the camera alone make it look quite a chunky size, then you see a couple of shots with a human hand and you realise how dinky it really is!

All the major companies have released compact 4k cameras now except Canon. On past experience, they'll be about 6-9 months behind the others, but their response will be worth a close look. I wonder if they'll adopt Sony's XAVC codec family?

Tony Maceo · September 4th, 2014, 03:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darren Levine

i'm actually quite curious about the low light, it's still bigger than a 1/3",

That extra sensor area is used for stablization...its effectively a 1/3" chip.

While I love the competition to keep the 3 big makers (and then there's JVC) on the cutting edge of video camera introductions...deep down I'm glad this one isn't turning out to be a "must have" since I recently jumped ship from all-Panasonic to Sony investments. Still stacking chips and setting aside for a couple X70s. 10bit 4:2:2 from here on out.

Ken Ross · September 4th, 2014, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave Blackhurst

@Nate -

On my 4K computer/monitor, it looks truly awful... not sure if it's YT compression or what, but I have it at 4K resolution, and it is more than "mushy"... looks like (bad) SD in parts...

Precisely what I was just going to post. I couldn't believe how bad it looked and I've seen tons of 4K YouTube footage on my 4K monitor. None looked this bad. For some reason the compression looked huge!

I also don't understand why they went with a small chip like this as opposed to something like the 1" in the AX100. Weird. But it does do 4K@60p....hopefully far better looking than the posted clip!

Ken Ross · September 4th, 2014, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Carter

Thinking it must be an issue with one video, I found this equally disturbing example. Almost seems like an April Fools joke.

Panasonic Camcorder HC-X1000 - The Art of Motion, Frank Sauer | Director & DoP - YouTube

Wow! Speechless, Dan! This camera can't be that bad, it just can't be. This must be some kind of an encoding/uploading issue. If not, I hope they're not producing more than a couple, they'll have trouble selling 2.

Dave Blackhurst · September 4th, 2014, 01:22 PM

Somehow I think Panasonic has some CODEC implementation issues... the funny thing is that I can recall seeing similar pixel block patterns back with a GS100K I owned... and the same issues with the FZ200... I really like many of Panasonics design features (constant f/2.8 in the FZ200 made that a big purchasing point for the RX10), but the image quality has been disappointing, especially when comparing it to the other plusses.

I took some time to look around for FZ1000 samples on YT, found a few that looked "mostly good", but in certain areas (motion, and darker areas of a frame), I noticed consistent macroblocking/pixelization - I previously mentioned that shadow areas were noticeably smeared/blocky.

Looking at the new promo clips for this new X1000 cam, there's also a weird "poster" like quality to that "motion" video - almost like some odd filter was applied to get a stylized look. I'm trying to figure out how these samples (which we're all seeing as "bad") are supposed to sell a product? I'm with Ken, I wouldn't touch a camera that produced video that looked THAT bad.

There is a definite "pattern" (literally in the case of the promotional clips!), and while I'm glad there's competition, I starting to get the feeling that Sony has been easing off 4K after looking at the "competition". I can only hope that Panasonics "4K" demos do not set the expectation of what 4K footage should look like.

Steven Ansell · September 10th, 2014, 04:13 AM

Looking at those YouTube videos, I think the problem is a bad rendering job by whoever edited the footage. It looks like a really low bit rate was used, someone probably just messed up.

Bryan Wilkat · September 11th, 2014, 08:24 AM

I'm assuming they exported with some kind of default Youtube compression settings, as a properly exported 4k image should be tack sharp, I was expecting to see moire and aliasing when downscaled to 1080!

We should all wait to see some real world examples before judging this camera. Anytime a company puts out "footage shot with..." it's always the same old stuff, skylines, flowers, water, etc...

Phil Goetz · October 3rd, 2014, 09:31 AM

The battery is model VW-VBD58 Retail = $199.99. Street probably less.

Ted Ramasola · October 3rd, 2014, 10:24 AM

Here is a video done by the camera store:

This video was a review on the LX100 but was shot WITH the x1000. They had to apologize at the near end for the crappy quality of the review video due to the bad quality of the x1000.
The shooter said that since its an early version, he will not use it for anything if they won't change the quality and address the issues.

Vaughan Wood · October 5th, 2014, 05:34 PM

Here are links to two new samples from the HC-X1000.

MUCH better than the previous clips, so this camera looks pretty good.

Cheers,

Vaughan

Paulo Teixeira · October 6th, 2014, 01:22 PM

They did a follow up video claiming it was a pre-production model that isn't finalized yet.

Hans Stephan · October 14th, 2014, 02:38 AM

For those in the Los Angeles area who want to see the HC-X1000 firsthand,
SAMY's is hosting a free event to launch it, and I will be on hand to talk about it and show how it works. November 6th.

with Barry Green ......
Panasonic HC-X1000 4K Video Launch Party at Moto Art Studios w/Barry Green- Eventbrite

September 3rd, 2014, 06:30 PM	#16
Dan Carter Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Scottsdale, Arizona Posts: 366	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 Very surprised Panasonic posted this video. It is bad to the point of embarrassing. As previously mentioned, it looks like bad SD footage. __________________ Dan Carter: HDC-TM700, DMC-GH2 and DMC-GH3, Sony RX100II and RX10, Final Cut Pro X http://www.vimeo.com/user582748

September 3rd, 2014, 07:07 PM	#17
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 Glad I'm not the only one that thinks the promo clip looks atrocious... when you are used to the AX100 4K output (which generally looks pretty good on YT), the Panasonic clip leaves you scratching your head... saw several sections with noticeable blocking, smearing is horrid, grass particularly was just a mess... I saw similar "issues" in the FZ1000 clips, but ONLY in shadow areas, on this clip it was everywhere. the few short parts with heavily blurred backgrounds and only a part of the screen in focus looked almost OK, but on full screens, it looked like "detail" just overwhelmed the processor, leaving a blocky, mushy, smeary, visual turd... I REALLY hope that there is not so much rush to get 4K product on the market that this is considered acceptable "output"... Certainly we already know that the AX100 and GH4 can produce excellent 4K... well under this price point.

September 3rd, 2014, 09:28 PM	#18
Dan Carter Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Scottsdale, Arizona Posts: 366	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 Thinking it must be an issue with one video, I found this equally disturbing example. Almost seems like an April Fools joke. YouTube (Short URL) __________________ Dan Carter: HDC-TM700, DMC-GH2 and DMC-GH3, Sony RX100II and RX10, Final Cut Pro X http://www.vimeo.com/user582748

September 4th, 2014, 01:22 PM	#23
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 Somehow I think Panasonic has some CODEC implementation issues... the funny thing is that I can recall seeing similar pixel block patterns back with a GS100K I owned... and the same issues with the FZ200... I really like many of Panasonics design features (constant f/2.8 in the FZ200 made that a big purchasing point for the RX10), but the image quality has been disappointing, especially when comparing it to the other plusses. I took some time to look around for FZ1000 samples on YT, found a few that looked "mostly good", but in certain areas (motion, and darker areas of a frame), I noticed consistent macroblocking/pixelization - I previously mentioned that shadow areas were noticeably smeared/blocky. Looking at the new promo clips for this new X1000 cam, there's also a weird "poster" like quality to that "motion" video - almost like some odd filter was applied to get a stylized look. I'm trying to figure out how these samples (which we're all seeing as "bad") are supposed to sell a product? I'm with Ken, I wouldn't touch a camera that produced video that looked THAT bad. There is a definite "pattern" (literally in the case of the promotional clips!), and while I'm glad there's competition, I starting to get the feeling that Sony has been easing off 4K after looking at the "competition". I can only hope that Panasonics "4K" demos do not set the expectation of what 4K footage should look like.

September 10th, 2014, 04:13 AM	#24
Steven Ansell Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Vancouver Canada Posts: 34	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 Looking at those YouTube videos, I think the problem is a bad rendering job by whoever edited the footage. It looks like a really low bit rate was used, someone probably just messed up.

September 11th, 2014, 08:24 AM	#25
Bryan Wilkat Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 171	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 I'm assuming they exported with some kind of default Youtube compression settings, as a properly exported 4k image should be tack sharp, I was expecting to see moire and aliasing when downscaled to 1080! We should all wait to see some real world examples before judging this camera. Anytime a company puts out "footage shot with..." it's always the same old stuff, skylines, flowers, water, etc...

October 3rd, 2014, 09:31 AM	#26
Phil Goetz Austinite Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Austin Posts: 550	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 The battery is model VW-VBD58 Retail = $199.99. Street probably less.

October 3rd, 2014, 10:24 AM	#27
Ted Ramasola Trustee Join Date: May 2005 Location: Allen, Texas U.S.A Posts: 1,117	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 Here is a video done by the camera store: This video was a review on the LX100 but was shot WITH the x1000. They had to apologize at the near end for the crappy quality of the review video due to the bad quality of the x1000. The shooter said that since its an early version, he will not use it for anything if they won't change the quality and address the issues. Panasonic LX100 Hands-On Field Test (With HC-X1000 Quick Look) - YouTube __________________ Ted Ramasola http://ramasolaproductions.com

October 5th, 2014, 05:34 PM	#28
Vaughan Wood Major Player Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 278	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 Here are links to two new samples from the HC-X1000. MUCH better than the previous clips, so this camera looks pretty good. Panasonic HC-X1000 4K-Testaufnahmen: BMW Welt 2 - YouTube Panasonic HC-X1000 4K-Testaufnahmen: BMW-Welt 1 - YouTube Cheers, Vaughan

October 6th, 2014, 01:22 PM	#29
Paulo Teixeira Trustee Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 1,773	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 They did a follow up video claiming it was a pre-production model that isn't finalized yet. Panasonic HC-X1000 Review Clarification - YouTube __________________ https://www.youtube.com/user/PhotoVi...esEtc/featured https://www.pond5.com/artist/paulot

October 14th, 2014, 02:38 AM	#30
Hans Stephan Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Vienna / Austria Posts: 37	Re: Just announced: Panny X1000 4k camcorder: $3499 For those in the Los Angeles area who want to see the HC-X1000 firsthand, SAMY's is hosting a free event to launch it, and I will be on hand to talk about it and show how it works. November 6th. with Barry Green ...... Panasonic HC-X1000 4K Video Launch Party at Moto Art Studios w/Barry Green- Eventbrite