PDX10 "Film Look"

Ignacio Rodriguez · February 12th, 2004, 07:32 AM

> Buy a pdx10 PAL, get 20 pct more resolution,
> shoot as clean as you can and then play with the
> picture in post. Should look very nice.

Yes, should look nice. I actually thought about doing this, using a tool which I think is called DVFilm Atlantis. It's a great idea if you have the time for all that processing. And if you are transferring to film it should make even more sense. But I do some TV work so the prospect of processing everything just was not too attractive... also: in my market it costs more to get hands on PAL equipment.

Sean McHenry · March 27th, 2004, 07:50 AM

I am thinking that applying a little motion blur will help achieve the film look for this reason. If you think about it there is persistance beyond the 1/60 or even 1/30 (1/24) for film that allows some after image to remain with the eye causing a slight overlap, in the mind anyway, of the preceeding and next images. A slight motion blur might help simulate this effect that would be naturally happening in your mind in a theater.

Just a thought.

Sean

Boyd Ostroff · March 27th, 2004, 08:03 AM

On the Mac, Joe's Filters provides a nice plug-in for this. I found it useful for making computer animation look a bit more like real footage. Certainly worth experimenting with, but a good deinterlacer will probably do what you want. Joe's Filters also has that, or another option is DVFilm Maker.

Graeme Nattress · March 27th, 2004, 08:11 AM

Boyd, have you tested the new DV Film Maker yet that does 24p? I tried it but got very bad flicker that made it unusable.

Graeme

Ignacio Rodriguez · March 27th, 2004, 01:55 PM

Yes. Motion Blur is the way to go. In FCP I can control the strength and the amount of samples for motion blur. The more samples, the more render time, the smoother it looks.

If I add to this some non-linear transfer function (like Stib's Film Curves) then I get a really very 'film like' result. Well actually what I see is similar to that of film transferred to video.

Applying 'film' curves helps get more contrast from the mids, this especially helps if I underexpose a bit, wich also keeps the highlights from being slammed video style.

I also like to do other non-linear stuff like desaturating highlights and lowlights, you can do this with one of Apple's plugs.

It is also possible to use Stib's curves to seperately affect color channels, adding a non-linear tint to the picture. This makes for a really nice effect as seen on many music videos.

Of course, any blurring will --well-- blur the picture a little bit. This might seem like a resolution loss sometimes, but it has the added advantage of reducing noise and chroma artifacts, which is something good if using Stib's Film Curves or something like that with DV-originated material.

So as you see it all kind of fits together, 'film' curves, motion blur, underexposure.

Stib's free plugs:
http://www.scriptgeek.netfirms.com/

Graeme's plugs:
http://www.nattress.com/

Too Much Too Soon:
http://dtlx.datom.se/~mas/index2.html

CHV Silk & Fog:
http://www.chv-plugins.com/silkandfog_m1.html

More (the original link):
http://www.digitalzoo.com.au/lunchti...ed_02_free.htm

I would love to post some footage but I can't right now because of bandwidth and space limitations.

Sorry for the long post. Hope it helps.

Sean McHenry · March 28th, 2004, 06:47 PM

Could you repost that link? The "..." are confusing my browser as the link was shortened somehow.

Thanks,

Sean

Ignacio Rodriguez · March 28th, 2004, 11:30 PM

Ok, sorry for the inconvenience. Added some direct links and fixed the original one.

February 12th, 2004, 07:32 AM	#31
Ignacio Rodriguez Contributor Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Santiago, Chile Posts: 932	> Buy a pdx10 PAL, get 20 pct more resolution, > shoot as clean as you can and then play with the > picture in post. Should look very nice. Yes, should look nice. I actually thought about doing this, using a tool which I think is called DVFilm Atlantis. It's a great idea if you have the time for all that processing. And if you are transferring to film it should make even more sense. But I do some TV work so the prospect of processing everything just was not too attractive... also: in my market it costs more to get hands on PAL equipment. __________________ Ignacio Rodríguez in the third world. @micronauta on Twitter. Main hardware: brain, eyes, hands.

March 27th, 2004, 07:50 AM	#32
Sean McHenry Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hilliard, Ohio Posts: 1,193	I am thinking that applying a little motion blur will help achieve the film look for this reason. If you think about it there is persistance beyond the 1/60 or even 1/30 (1/24) for film that allows some after image to remain with the eye causing a slight overlap, in the mind anyway, of the preceeding and next images. A slight motion blur might help simulate this effect that would be naturally happening in your mind in a theater. Just a thought. Sean __________________ ‘I don’t know what I’m doing, and I’m shooting on D.V.’ - my hero - David Lynch http://www.DeepBlueEdit.com

March 27th, 2004, 08:11 AM	#34
Graeme Nattress RED Problem Solver Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 1,365	Boyd, have you tested the new DV Film Maker yet that does 24p? I tried it but got very bad flicker that made it unusable. Graeme __________________ www.nattress.com - filters for FCP

March 27th, 2004, 01:55 PM	#35
Ignacio Rodriguez Contributor Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Santiago, Chile Posts: 932	Motion Blur and more Yes. Motion Blur is the way to go. In FCP I can control the strength and the amount of samples for motion blur. The more samples, the more render time, the smoother it looks. If I add to this some non-linear transfer function (like Stib's Film Curves) then I get a really very 'film like' result. Well actually what I see is similar to that of film transferred to video. Applying 'film' curves helps get more contrast from the mids, this especially helps if I underexpose a bit, wich also keeps the highlights from being slammed video style. I also like to do other non-linear stuff like desaturating highlights and lowlights, you can do this with one of Apple's plugs. It is also possible to use Stib's curves to seperately affect color channels, adding a non-linear tint to the picture. This makes for a really nice effect as seen on many music videos. Of course, any blurring will --well-- blur the picture a little bit. This might seem like a resolution loss sometimes, but it has the added advantage of reducing noise and chroma artifacts, which is something good if using Stib's Film Curves or something like that with DV-originated material. So as you see it all kind of fits together, 'film' curves, motion blur, underexposure. Stib's free plugs: http://www.scriptgeek.netfirms.com/ Graeme's plugs: http://www.nattress.com/ Too Much Too Soon: http://dtlx.datom.se/~mas/index2.html CHV Silk & Fog: http://www.chv-plugins.com/silkandfog_m1.html More (the original link): http://www.digitalzoo.com.au/lunchti...ed_02_free.htm I would love to post some footage but I can't right now because of bandwidth and space limitations. Sorry for the long post. Hope it helps. __________________ Ignacio Rodríguez in the third world. @micronauta on Twitter. Main hardware: brain, eyes, hands.

March 28th, 2004, 06:47 PM	#36
Sean McHenry Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Hilliard, Ohio Posts: 1,193	Could you repost that link? The "..." are confusing my browser as the link was shortened somehow. Thanks, Sean __________________ ‘I don’t know what I’m doing, and I’m shooting on D.V.’ - my hero - David Lynch http://www.DeepBlueEdit.com

March 27th, 2004, 08:03 AM	#33
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	On the Mac, Joe's Filters provides a nice plug-in for this. I found it useful for making computer animation look a bit more like real footage. Certainly worth experimenting with, but a good deinterlacer will probably do what you want. Joe's Filters also has that, or another option is DVFilm Maker.

March 28th, 2004, 11:30 PM	#37
Ignacio Rodriguez Contributor Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Santiago, Chile Posts: 932	Ok, sorry for the inconvenience. Added some direct links and fixed the original one. __________________ Ignacio Rodríguez in the third world. @micronauta on Twitter. Main hardware: brain, eyes, hands.