Hi Boyd - thanks for the reply.

I was using it as a front-end for a stop-frame animation video so there was no film in the camera - I was literally grabbing stills via firewire to a Mac. (actually, the jumping effect didn't ruin the shoot and possibly added to the lo-fi flavour ;))

I first noticed the computer monitor jumping and re-booted, but then I noticed it was happening on the camera display so I changed the firewire cables etc but still the same thing occured. That's when I powered-down the PDX and noticed that I got the 10mins of normal use upon powering it up.

I will, as you suggest, turn off the steadyshot and see if that helps.

Thank you again


Dave

Damn - sadly that didn't do the trick :(

On closer inspection though, it seems to be a kind of picture stretching, as opposed to jumping, and the right of the picture isn't affected at all. Very odd indeed.

I think it's time for the menders :-/



Dave

Hi Dave,

there is a web site here by sony europe in 2005 about faulty LCD screen problems on some pdx10p and pd170p . it gives all people a free repair on the stated serial number. I hope it helps

this is the site:

http://www.sony.co.uk/view/ShowArtic...site=odw_en_GB

david

Thanks very much for that David - for a moment there was a glimmer of hope :)

Sadly though, my serial number is higher than those.

I might call the number on there though. You never know.

Thanks again


Dave

David: see my other post here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...d=1#post577133

The recall is not for LCD problems, but for CCD problems.

again sound
 

Hi

Always i read about the 2 channels of sound, and the capture of these 2, that in PC does not work, personally I am working with Adobe Premiere pro 1.5, independent that one can set the software so that it recognizes this camera model, not recognize the 2 channels. Something that it just happen is that I was capturing from of a VHS, through the pdx10, didn’t captures well, leaving a track outside, but in the loudspeaker of the camera you can listen the 2 tracks, is that are a problem or of reproduction of the camera towards the PC or directly the card of capture/PC /software, somebody has some idea of how can be captured in stereo? I will have some settings bad? Or I must change to Mac and use Final Cut?

The pdx does have some issues regarding capture of stereo. Some use scenelyzer capture utility which captures stereo perfectly. I thought
it was just a sony vegas capture issue though. I get stereo through my
pdx when I use the external xlr mic but not when using the in camera mic.
I'm quite sure you won't need to use final cut for stereo. If you have another camera the tapes recorded on the pdx will capture in stereo off of that.

( will now wait for Boyd's answer :)

Well you're testing my memory here ;-) IIRC, the stereo problem on the PDX-10 was related to the Windows operating system and its firewire drivers. I don't think it is a Vegas issue specifically.

Here are a couple old threads. You will probably find more if you dig through the forum...

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=26190
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=17454

It is true however that there are no PDX-10 audio issues if you use FCP, which is what I have.

PDX10P: shooting a feature film, need help on image quality issues
 

We're a group of people working on a no-budget movie with a borrowed PDX10P and a modified Letus35A 35mm adapter and being the cinematographer (new at this) I'm trying to get the best possible image out of this thing.

I noticed that we lose a lot of light with the adapter so I'd be inclined to open up the camera's exposure all the way but... I do notice that if I keep the camera's exposure one or two notches away from maximum exp, I get a more pleasant and more colorful image. This is probably normal and I should never go for max exposure, right?

Another issue: sometimes images are a bit grainy, often due to slight grain getting picked up from the adapter. Just wondering if anyone knows any camera tricks I can use to make the image smoother.

And in general: any advice from PDX10P veterans on doing a feature film with this cam would be greatly appreciated, we can use all the help we can get :) .

Hi Reese and welcome to DVinfo! I used my PDX-10 (NTSC version) to shoot a lot of footage which was projected on a 45 foot wide screen as part of a live opera performance of Il Trovatore. I was really happy with the overall quality, and the review singled out the video as being very professional. We used a 10,000 lumen Barco DLP projector in the theatre.

So the PDX-10 is quite a nice camera for its price, and capable of delivering some pretty impressive footage. I don't have any experience with 35mm adaptors, but if I were you I'd give some serious thought as to whether the advantages of using one outweight the disadvantages (like the ones you mention).

Also realize that the PDX-10 has an undocumented internal ND filter wheel which comes is activated whenever the camera thinks it's needed. There is no way to override this feature or control it manually. The idea is that the camera forces you to stay within the "sweet spot" of the lens and not use small apertures. So when you're working in manual mode, as you close the iris at a certain point the ND filters start dropping in although the camera doesn't tell you. IIRC, it's impossible to shoot at an aperture less than f4.8.

Spend a little while browsing back through our PDX-10 forum, which is pretty inactive these days so you'll need to go way back. There's a lot of good information here. BTW, you actually posted this thread to the wrong forum, the PDX-10 is covered in a sub-forum here: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisplay.php?f=43

I'm moving your thread there and maybe others will have some ideas.

Aah great, thanks a lot :)

This is good info.

PDX10 missing or not working remote
 

I just got my PDX10 back from Sony repair. The remote does not work, which is why it was sent off. (RMT-811). The technicians note says this is not the right remote for the camera....yet B & H photo lists this as the replacement. Can the technician be wrong? Or indeed is a RMT-811 not the right remote. And does anyone know where I can get a functioning remote?
Thanks,
Davyne
Asheville, NC

Sony PDX10 Question
 

I have a Panasonic DVX100 with the Panasonic anamorphic adaptor lens. I am looking to get a slightly cheaper 2nd cam. Is the footage shot by a Sony PDX10 true anamorphic or do I have to buy a Century Precision Optics lens to make it "true anamorphic?"

If I shot some in footage in a Sony PDX10 in its 16x9 mode, will Final Cut Pro see it as anamorphic footage? If the footage from Sony PDX10 can match that of the DVX100, then I will buy one as a backup cam.

Can any PCX10 users enlighten me on this subject? Thanks.

Hi Jason. Yes, the PDX-10 shoots high quality 16:9. It has 4:3 shaped CCD's, however the resolution is 1152x864 (IIRC). That allows the camera to sample a 16:9 area at full resolution and gives surprisingly good results.

The terminology can be a little ambiguous here "true anamorphic" isn't really meaningful in and of itself. That just means the image has been squashed so it can be stretched to 16:9 on playback. A lot of cameras do this (PD-170 for example) however their CCD's aren't high res enough to give you a full quality 16:9 image. Anamorphic is just the image format, and doesn't tell you anything about the quality. I think "true 16:9" would be a little more accurate way of describing what you want.

Now there are plenty of differences between the PDX-10 and DVX-100 though. The chips are small (about 1/5") so the more light the better, and of course there are no progressive modes. But it's really a great little camera, especially considering the price.

BTW, this was posted to the wrong forum. The PDX-10 forum is a sub group (http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisplay.php?f=43), so I'm moving your thread there. You might want to browse back through this forum to learn more about the PDX-10.

Yes, the PDX10 is a sweet little camera. It won't offer you the same manual control flexability of the DVX, but then again it's a lot more compact.

You talk about the Sony 'matching' the Panasonic, but as always there will be colour differences to contend with and control and menu layouts that will differ. There are small Panasonics that also have 1"/5 chips and they too give high quality 16:9 footage. Have you dismissed these?

tom.

The Pdx10 is a good camera, it gives better 16:9 images, better than more expensive camera around. My ex pdx10 beats my dvx100b in 16:9 hands down... I miss my Pdx10

PDX10P sharpness/color settings seem very underrated
 

I've read several times on this forum that it's best to dial sharpness all the way down as well as color a bit because then you get the raw data from the ccd.

What most of the experienced ones are saying here is that these sharpness/color boosts you can get out of it are simply in-camera post-production filters. This sounds logical but I've done some testing and all is not as it seems...

Dialing sharpness all the way down causes an actual loss of detail, so what you see then is LESS detail than what you could normally get out of the ccd. And what's really interesting is that when you dial it all the way up, you get a very sharp image that seems very hard to replicate by adding sharpness filters on a medium sharp image from the camera in post. So even if this is just a post-filter at work, it's a very powerful one.

Same goes for the color, dialing up the color setting does not simply increase saturation, it actually brings out more of the actual colors.


I'm not saying these settings are magical and you should always dial them up, but they're certainly not always evil image-destroying gimmicks.

I'm conducting more tests today.

I guess it depends on your personal taste and also your subject matter. Personally I always disliked the oversharpened default on the PDX-10 that left hard outlines around objects. I don't use mine anymore (it's on "vacation" with a friend in Greece now :-)

But several years ago I shot this series of tests using a scene with lots of fine detail. I think my favorite would be sharpness set at -2. But like I said, it depends on your personal taste.

Excellent comparison material there, thanks for the info. I agree with what you're saying but these shots do confirm even more that this is not a simple sharpening filter.

I think what would probably be the case here is that there is a slight sharpening filter applied to the raw ccd data before it is then downscaled to the normal video resolution (because I believe the camera downscales it from a resolution that's quite a bit higher).

As for the colors... No clue what exactly happens there but I love the look of a slight color boost, it's definitely not the same as just increasing saturation. I guess it may also be applied to raw ccd data that of course contains more color info than the final image.

Thing is, we're shooting with a modified Letus35A lens adapter which causes for some loss in color vibrance and sharpness and the tests I'm doing now are really yielding beautiful results with sharpness maxed out and color 2 dials higher than medium.


Thx for the insightful reply, the pictures were quite helpful.

Yes, the CCD's are 1152x864. I did the following test by framing a shot to fill the frame in photo mode, then switched to 4:3 and 16:9 video in order to learn how it crops the image (note: I was using the NTSC version, so yours will be a little different).

The PDX-10 is a really nice little camera, and a lot of bang for the buck. But the tiny (1/5") chips have their limitations. Even though they are relatively high resolution, the small size seems to give a rather coarse quality to the full res stills.

Recently I was playing around shooting photos of the full moon using a 500mm mirror telephoto on my D80 (35mm equiv of 750mm). Then I remembered that the PDX-10 lens has an equivalent of 500mm, and I could bump that to 1000mm with my telextender. So I shot a series of memory stick stills with the PDX-10. They looked terrible! Granted, I was comparing them to 10 megapixel Nikon stills, but nevertheless I thought they had a very harsh, oversharpened look.

Good luck with your project, let us know what you learn in your tests.

The PDX-10 lives on
 

Visit this index page on Sony's Business Solutions and Systems site: http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Broadcastan...et_10014.shtml and scroll down to the DVCAM link....

Although the PDX-10 is no longer made, it has now become the icon for the Sony DVCAM system :-)

What happens when PDX10P goes 1/25?
 

When you shoot with a shutter speed of 1/25, it seems to affect image quality but it doesn't seem to cut the resolution in half. If I just set the camera on a tripod and shoot something at 1/60 and then go to 1/25 I see only an extremely subtle loss in detail. There seems to be more loss when there are more vibrant colors and when there's more motion.

What exactly happens here? Does this have something to do with the PDX10P's high-res CCD chips? Do they somehow compensate partially for the loss in resolution?

I think you just get field doubling when setting the shutter at 1/25 (assuming you have a PAL camera). Theoretically it should cut vertical resolution in half, but in reality it isn't that bad. This is due to the fact that the PDX-10 (and all interlaced cameras AFAIK) don't ever provide the full vertical resolution. Imagine a horizontal liine running from left to right which is only 1 pixel wide. With an interlaced camera, that line would be captured in only one of the two interlaced fields, and when viewed on the screen it would flicker on and off every 1/50 second. To avoid problems like this, the camera does some blending of the two fields. I'm not sure how this is accomplished, but it means you aren't getting the full 576 lines to start with.

As far as colors and motion making a difference, I never noticed that myself so I'm not sure what might be happening.

I'm not 100% sure if it's the colors and the motion that does it but what I do know is that I see little difference right away when I switch from 1/25 to 1/60 but I often see huge differences in quality at certain moments when comparing 1/25 footage to 1/60 footage. May also depend on the amount of light. 1/25 allows more low-light conditions but not without a price it seems.

Anyway, just felt I needed to add I've now decided to definitely not shoot at 1/25, the quality trade-off is huge. I didn't realize what it was for a long time, it didn't occur to me that the shutter speed could have this effect, but for a long time I've been thinking about why I'm not getting a nice crispy clear image at times. Now I've decided to go back to 1/60 and make it look film-like in post and goddamn, I feel like I'm working with high-def material here! :)

Need PDX10 expert opinions
 

Hello, all.

I'm new to the dvinfo.net forum, but have been here off and on for a while, just reading and absorbing.

I've just purchased a used Sony PDX10. However, it did not come with the XLR block or a mic.

So, should I spring for the XLR block made by Sony for this cam (to the tune of $260 just for the block), or should I get something like a Beachtek XLR adapter and a non-Sony mic (maybe a Sennheiser)?

I like the idea of being able attach the XLR block to the camera itself, on the top, rather beneath it, like with the Beachtek. Is there a way to attach third party XLR adapters to the "intelligent accessory" shoe of the PDX10? And how is the quality, if I do that, when the connector is a mini jack, rather than the proprietary connector with the Sony-built XLR accessory?

Also, since I don't want to use my camera as a deck, should I purchase, say, an inexpensive one-chip camera and use that to transfer my PDX10 footage to my computer? Or is there a better method?

I'm sure I'm going to have other questions, but I think I've asked enough for the moment.

Thanks all very much!

Sincerely,

Paula DiSante

Welcome Paula!

I'm sure a Beachtek would do most of what you want... I always laughed that Beachtek shows the DXA-6 on a PDX-10 in fact. If you get one, your camera will look like this:

http://www.beachtek.com/dxa6_inside.html

But I don't know if the quality is the same when going through the miniplug. I have one of the passive Beachtek boxes for my VX-2000 and I know it requires you to set the mini-plug for microphone level and I always wondered if this introduced more noise than a line level connection would.

Ideally I would want the XLR block if it were my camera. I don't think anyone else makes a box which works with the "smart shoe", and without it you would lose some of the menu controls. But whether it's worth $260 to add an accessory to a used camcorder is another issue. Perhaps you can buy and inexpensive used Beachtek and see if it meets your needs?

Thanks for welcome
 

Thank you very much for your welcome, Boyd. And thanks especially for the advice.

[b]>>Ideally I would want the XLR block if it were my camera. I don't think anyone else makes a box which works with the "smart shoe", and without it you would lose some of the menu controls. But whether it's worth $260 to add an accessory to a used camcorder is another issue. Perhaps you can buy and inexpensive used Beachtek and see if it meets your needs?[b/]

I have a bit to consider, it seems. Part of me says "go with the manufacturer's accessory made specifically for this camera!" Another part says "pick up a decent Beachtek on eBay!" I'll have to think about this for a while.

If anyone else knows the answer to Boyd's question as to whether or not using a mini jack could possibly introduce line noise, I'd love to hear about it!

This camera is not my dream camera, but it's going to take a while to save for different equipment. I bought this in the meantime so I could help teach my nephews how to make movies, since they have expressed an interest in it. Its small size will make things a lot easier, at least starting out.

Thanks all again very much.

Sony PDX10 Scrambled Image Occasionally
 

occasionally, the video from my pdx10 appears a bit scrambled.
everything will look great, and then little scrambled blips pop up for
a few seconds at a time...they usually appear in a line from the top
of the screen to the bottom.

i tried cleaning the heads with a sony miniDV head cleaner tape, and
it seemed to get better...but it still happens occasionally. i've
since used the head cleaner many times, and it now rarely
happens...but it still happens (maybe two or three times per 40 minute
DVCAM tape). any advice is appreciated.

pdx10 DV to analog passthrough?
 

Anyone know if the pdx10 can do DV to analog passthrough?

I use Vegas 7 for editing and want to set up an external monitor. I want to do this by: computer -- firewire -- pdx10 -- s-video -- TV. But I can not figure out how to do this with the pdx10. I am starting to suspect the pdx10 does not have this function since I can not find anything about it in the manual. (I know it does analog to DV, but I want to go the other way).

Anyone know if it is possible to do DV to analog on the pdx10?

Thanks.

I don't think you need to do anything special to the PDX-10 in order to get what you want. The default menu settings should allow it. If not, then I believe there's a menu called AV/DV IN. Try changing that setting and see if it helps. Or try resetting the camera and that should restore the default settings. Also confirm that your computer is set correctly by trying another camera.

Sorry, I gave my PDX-10 to a friend so I can't check it myself.

(note: I moved this thread to our PDX-10 forum from the VX-2100/PD-170 forum)

For the record, the pdx10 does do DV to analog pass-through.

My problem was related to improper setup of some of the options in my editing program.

Thanks!

Considering buying a used PDX10
 

Hello from a new forum user,

I am thinking about buying a used PDX10 and I have some questions.

- I've read that it is not possible to adjust exposure and shutter speed simultaneously. I hope this means that I can adjust them separately and have both adjusted to custom values AT THE SAME TIME? Meaning, that PDX10 does not provide simple Aperture Priority and Shutter Priority modes, but indeed provides full manual mode (well, within limitations of auto gain and auto ND filters) ?

- Is it possible to display datacode -- or at least shutter/aperture info -- during recording? I've read recommendations on using ND4 in daylight, but how can one use two-stop filter blindly without knowing whether the gain has turned on or not? Say, if I wanted to use the shallowest DOF possible, I would want wide iris, but I would want no gain if lightning allows, so I don't want to induce gain by putting a filter. Any way to monitor this? I am ok with stupid "exposure" control instead of normal aperture control if I can read actual aperture info back. My current Canon Elura 100 works the same way: the Exposure control actually operates on aperture/gain with shutter speed locked, and I can read current shutter/aperture settings by half-pressing Photo button.

- I've read that camera tends to stay above (numerically below) f/5.6 which works for shallow DOF. What if I want to shoot a panorama far away? I need long DOF in this case, therefore I need small iris and no ND filters. How this can be achieved?

- Does it still makes sense to buy a used PDX10 for say $1000 without XLR/mic? Yes, it has a metal body and has DVCAM, but isn't HV20 a better camera for the same $1000, new? Hasn't it time gone?

Thanks.

Boyd Ostroff
is who you need to talk to on this forum he really knows the pdx10.
the pdx has 18 db of gain that can be turned off in custom presets.
I am also curious about its time being passed but i still don't have an hd tv so no hurry for me.

Hi Michael,

Yes you have full control over both shutter speed and iris, but there's just one limitation. In full manual mode, when you change the shutter speed, the current value of the iris will change to compensate for the new shutter speed. However you can then go back into the iris mode and change its setting as often as you like while retaining the shutter speed you just chose. So in other words, be sure to choose your shutter speed FIRST, then adjust the iris afterwards. This is the exact same behavior which you will see on the VX-2000.

Yes, you can show all the settings in the viewfinder while shooting in manual mode. Again, it behaves just like the VX-2000. Simple rule to remember: if you don't see the value in the viewfinder then that parameter is under auto control. Gain can be manually controlled as well. As you open the iris, when you reach the full opening then each successive click of the wheel will add another 3 dB of gain, up to a max of 18dB.

The camera tries to keep your iris in the "sweet spot" as you noted, and it will automatically drop internal ND filters into the optical train as needed. Unfortunately this is not documented and the camera doesn't tell you when it's doing this. So forcing a wide open iris is best acheived using an external ND filter so that the camera has no choice but to open the iris all the way.

Not sure about your panorama question. You can always focus the camera anywhere you like, and that's not the same as depth of field. Depth of field relates to the full range of distance in which all objects will remain in focus. F5.6 will actually provide quite a large depth of field; in other words, objects in the foreground and background will all be in focus. I don't think you will find many situations where you want MORE depth of field on the PDX-10.

Obviously the PDX-10 is a standard definition camcorder. I think it was a great value in its day, and it was selling for around $1,300 shortly before it was discontinued IIRC. $1,000 sounds a little high to me for a camera without the XLR or microphone, maybe you should make a lower offer and see what the seller says? If you want high definition then you shouldn't even be looking at the PDX-10, so I don't see how a comparison with the HV20 is particularly relevant personally.

We actually have a separate sub-forum dedicated to the PDX-10 here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisplay.php?f=43

I'm moving this thread there. You might want to browse back a bit through that forum, you'll find lots of good info there. I gave my PDX-10 to a friend last year, and it's having a great time in its new home in Greece :-)

PDX10 Hot Pixels?
 

On my PDX10 when I shoot low lit scenes I have a group of 4 pixels that show up white. When shooting a bright scene they are not noticeable at all.

How can a white hot or dead pixel show up on a 3 CCD camera? Wouldn't all three CCD's have to be bad in the exact same spot?

PDX10 XLR adapter
 

I'm curious if there are any other XLR adapters that work with the PDX10 other than the one included with the camera? Thanks!