DV Info Net

DV Info Net (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/)
-   Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-pro-handhelds/)
-   -   Picture Profiles on the EX1 (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-pro-handhelds/112032-picture-profiles-ex1.html)

G.A. Kokes January 9th, 2008 04:03 PM

Picture Profiles on the EX1
 
Can anyone provide some descriptions of the various picture profiles available on the EX1. The manual talks around it but does not give any real details about the four cine gammas, for example.

Thanks,
G

Tuomas Sebastien January 9th, 2008 04:11 PM

Yeah i'd like some info on these too. I already learned from test posted here that detail is better set to OFF. But wouldn't it be basicly best to shoot as "flat" footage as possible and do cinegamma style changes in post?

Steven Thomas January 9th, 2008 04:30 PM

Yes, shooting with detail off would be recommended, but you might find a happy medium with the detail set to something like -25 & frequency set to 20.

Some cameras don't fair well with detail off. The EX1 looks good, but definately softer, more organic.

Gregor Baumann January 9th, 2008 07:20 PM

There are situations where you need to shoot with the final settings inside the camera. I've had clients who wanted to present the video a short time after recording - you can not color grade the image in about 20min from recording to presenting.

Worst case: The client is not able to "imagine" the final look, so you had to set up the camera with the correct settings.

Eric Pascarelli January 9th, 2008 07:35 PM

Detail Off vs. Negative Numbers
 
Just a note based on my observations:

Beware of a negative number in the detail setting - it adds an artificial softening that looks like a "box blur." This is especially apparent if you set detail to -99.

I've found detail off to be the best solution, rather than a negative number.

Detail 0 definitely adds a sharpening filter, and is not a neutral setting either.

Somewhere around -20 appears as neutral, though I am sure it's applying an additional degrading function beyond simply turning it off.

Steven Thomas January 9th, 2008 07:40 PM

Eric, thanks for the "heads up".
I'll look into this. I've been using between -15 to -20 on detail level. Maybe I need to revisit this, but it seemed to be sharper than off.

I'll have to throw up a rez chart and see if can can determine what's going on here.

Wait a minute...., one quick method would be to focus on high contrast objects and use focus peaking. This would give a clue.

Rob Collins January 9th, 2008 07:46 PM

Trust you've been through the sticky above:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=110902

Eric Pascarelli January 9th, 2008 08:06 PM

5 Attachment(s)
Steven,

Let me correct myself. Detail -40 seems around neutral, though it's definitely different from detail off (and a bit weird for my taste, with a combination of sharpening and halation). At -60, the softening really kicks in.

Here are some tests I shot awhile ago. They were shot at too high a stop and have some diffraction softening, but I think they get the point across.

Detail Off
Detail 0
Detail -40
Detail -60
Detail -99

Steven Thomas January 9th, 2008 08:58 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Thanks Eric! It sure looks like you're right about -40.
Thanks to your examples, I compiled a quick comparison from your images.
I wonder if -20 to -30 might be a good medium.
I had no idea -99 was this soft. Good to know.

Here it is:
Far left is detail off, middle is detail at -40, right is detail at 0.

Christopher Barry January 9th, 2008 09:26 PM

Eric, thank you for the frames. Another option to consider, if one is going to post process the footage anyway, is to shoot Detail Off, then use an Unsharp Mask filter in your NLE or compositing app. You can experiment with this in Photoshop to see the effect. Zoom in and see the difference, there are a few parameters to play with for the desired effect. I stacked the Detail Off and Detail 0 frames, two layers, then toggled the top layer on/off after experimenting with Unsharp Mask filter parameters applied to the Detail Off layer.

For fast turn around projects, Steven, -20 to -30 looks to be a good medium choice. Good info, thanks!

Eric Pascarelli January 9th, 2008 09:38 PM

Christopher,

That's definitely my approach. I always shoot with detail off.

Leonard Levy January 10th, 2008 02:39 AM

Thanks Eric, those are very useful stills. I haven't gotten my camera yet, but i'll probably start off at -20 and then do further testing.

I don't do my own editing as I'm sure is true for many shooters here. I'm just a DP for hire. I can't afford to leave sharpening or color grading for some guy in post to screw up ( sorry that's my usual experience.). i need to give them the best picture I can 1st time.

Paul Cronin January 10th, 2008 09:47 AM

Eric and Steve this is great info. For my taste and what I am seeing here detail off looks to work. I will try a few settings today and response in the sticky.

Craig Seeman January 10th, 2008 10:36 AM

It's a shame Sony has no Picture Profiles online for this camera yet. There are XDCAM HD profiles though.

I wonder if there's any F330/350 users who also have the EX1 who can translate these.

http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Broadcastan...Files.shtml#HD

Dennis Schmitz January 25th, 2008 02:43 PM

Thanks Eric for these examples.

The detail=off setting is by far the best.
Resizing and sharpening seems to work great with this setting.

The in-camera sharpening is much worse compared to what is possible in post (I'm in love with LimitedSharpen and avisynth ;))


regards Dennis


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:18 PM.

DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2020 The Digital Video Information Network