Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

the cx730 has a light build right in and it spreads very equally, but it is quite sharp to look at, from a short distance you can't look at it for sure, like I said, only if there is no other option that light will save your shot for sure, as long as you are not to far from your subject. Just having that build in is awesome, almost like a swiss knive :)

Thx for sharing Rickey, looks great! :) Can I ask what the other 20% was filmed with? I"m going to pick up a lightstand as well, mainly for some indoor ceremonies where I can use 3 camera's so I can put one on a lightstand in the back high enough over everyones heads. Especially when the photog passes in front of the camera he/she won't be in the image.

I also saw this rig on ebay which would seem compact enough for my use and you can use filters with it to keep the shutter at normal levels in the sun: http://www.ebay.com/itm/DSLR-rig-set...item20c4abe8f2 Almost looks like the same you got, Rickey? Price at least seems decent and it seems shipping is "free" from China to Belgium without any custom taxes and so on compared to ordering in the Usa, that always adds quite some costs. I won't be using the flags but without them I think it will be a nice addition to my cx730.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

"Can I ask what the other 20% was filmed with?"

The prep outdoor was shot with FX1, most indoor shot and in the grapevine was the CX, ceremony and the dancing was FX1. Ring shot was with the DSLR.

The rig you showed me is almost the price of the Genus rig that I have. If I were you I'll go with the Genus, at least you have the grip and the breast support that comes handy and useful, and if you don't like it, just remove it. Some are still selling this rig for $599, B&H sells this for $299, perhaps in your place you could get a better deal since Genus product are made somewhere or near there.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Especially with DSLRs & wide aperture lenses we can now shoot & get adequately exposed images in just about any situation but the images will look flat & lifeless because there is no modelling or shadows. Professional photographers use flash for fill & modelling not because there isn't sufficient light & for video we need to do the same. It's not always practical to add light but with modern cameras we don't need to add much & LED lights don't have to dazzle the subjects. It's really worth adding light when necessary as it can really lift the quality of the video.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

We likewise shot a wedding with a photographer who did not use flash but had an assistant holding a Lowel iD video light on a pole & it was a complete revelation. The assistant was really helpful & would hold the light so that we could grab the shot too & the difference in the footage was just amazing. Now we often will shoot either with a 160-LED video light in one hand (never on the camera as that doesn't provide the modelling & shadows that we want) or one of us holding the light while the other takes the shot. Just shots of simple stuff like the wedding cake or table decorations really sing with some added light.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

As a stills photographer I ALWAYS bounce flash from ceilings or other suitable surfaces when the subject is inside. The light then becomes much more even and with no nasty pronounced shadows. using a slowish shutter speed ("dragging the shutter") also ensures that where there is nice ambient light it will also feature in the image. The flash can give a nice twinkle in the eye, adding life to what might otherwise appear to be a lifeless subject. When I say always I of course mean nearly always. If there is no suitable bounce surface (rare) then I use small softboxes that clip to the flashgun heads. The light then becomes more directional but still passable.

Panels like the Z96 can also be in effect bounced off surfaces so they don't need to be directly into the face. They are also light enough to sit atop a handheld cam and when used with a 12" articulating arm in the hotshoe will get the output higher than eye level and directed slightly downwards.

Video lights have become the must have accessory for stills photographers in the past year or so, promoted by many self-proclaimed "high end" photographers who have seen their bookings plummet and therefore turned to the seminar and training disc circuit to milk the newbies. I'm not a huge fan myself as I think the results look over-elaborate and over- constructed for weddings (as opposed to fashion and glamour). I don't like the circus that can ensue when using assistants / 2nds either, but thats more a photographer marketing ruse than bringing much real benefit to the clients.

Pete

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

I just came back from a wedding and have another one tomorrow, my footage is importing as I type, I made a bold move and left my xh-a1 at home today and filmed the ceremony with the sony cx camera's only and the rest of the day a combination of my cx730 and my dslr.

For those that are used to work in this way this might not seem a big deal but for me it was, leaving my trusty xh-a1 at home in the bag made me very nervous yesterday but I wanted to know how the workflow would be with those small cams.

It took getting used to the lcd screen to do spotfocus and the small wheel to ride the exposure but after a half hour I got more and more accustomed to it and the spotfocus feature actually works really well and also the iris wheel. Only if I want to go to auto exposure for a while but the button that you have to press is not that responsive, sometimes nothing happened, sometimes I got that selection menu to assign focus etc, so pressing that button needs exactly the right amount of pressure to function right, can be a bit frustrating at times but probable I will get the feel for that after using it more.

it was not easy handholding the camera and adjusting the exposure or operate other functions through the lcd screen, especially when you are used to a xh-a1, but it does getting used to. I absolutely loved the light wheight and easy moving it from one to another place, we did a photshoot in a big town and I just had the cx730 attached to my belt in a small bag and the dslr and monopod with me. Soooo easy to quickly switch from dslr to the cx730, that was a revelation, never felt so light when doing run and gun.

I also saw some footage just know and it's just amazing, you have to know that I come from a xh-a1 so that's all I can compare to from experience and this small cx730 blows my mind, we went in a very dark pub to make photo's and the camera did cope extremely well, the footage just looks so ridiculous good.

Tomorrow I have to take my xh-a1 with me as I need to do interviews and I have to use my large azden setup with my wireless handmicrophone, I must get me a small sennheiser kit asap, my beachtek also arrived this morning but need some experimenting time with it before I use it in the field.

I"m getting more excited every time I use this small camera :)

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Noa, the only thing that I use in the small wheel in front is the exposure, if it's outdoor sunny and bright I meter on the grass or something gray like the road, pavements and lock my exposure. During night time, I auto expose it and let the camera decide than lock it once Im happy with the result.

Holding the camera without the grip is a little bit cumbersome, but you will get the hang of it. When I bought my CX, I also bought the grip, since then, it never leaves the camera, unless I have to mount it on a light stand or tripod. The CX alone has a great stabilization, and with the grip while walking is almost like a having a steadicam.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

I actually find that the right exposure is quite important to get good footage with the cx730, I have been doing the exposure manually the past 2 days, it's just that I have been doing that with my xh-a1 as well and it has become second nature :) The xh-a1 has beside zebra's also has a meter which gives you an indication what the camera thinks is accurate so you can adjust to that or over- or underexpose depending on the situation, like inside a house with a backlight. With the cx 730 you only have zebra's but I feel confident enough now using that only as a guide. The zebra's together with the the very good lcd give me good feedback about where I am with my exposure.

Based on the zebra's I have noticed that the cx730 get's it wrong in automode quite a lot, usually resulting in overexposure, it might not be much but it doesn't do your image much good. That's why I find the addition of the zebra's a godsend, with my xr520 you don't have that and the lcd screen is not that accurate, this has caused me to get overexposed images before eventhough the lcd screen looked all right.

About your handgrip, I definitely need something extra to hold the camera for longer periods yet stay mobile enough, so a monopod is out of the question, I do need the camera to go on and of the tripod quickly so will be looking for a small grip that does allow the tripod plate to be attached as well. Yesterday I almost dropped the camera when taking it out of the bag, it's so small it just slipped my hand so need something solid to grab on to, something really simple like one small handgrip on the side of the camera.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Hi Noa

Just like Colin has made!! I had these when I was still shooting in the late 90's with Panny DS30's ..Just two strips of aluminium bar and two bits of pipe with cycle foam handle bar grips on them....you can tap a 1/4" hole in the bottom bar and screw in your quick release for your tripod too plus the top bar is great for mount other stuff onto!!

Here's mine back when I had the DS30's

Chris

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

thx for sharing this Chris, I am thinking about just one handle on the right side very close to the camera's body, I stll need to be able to fit it in a small bag and I also need to reach the zoom and record button with the same hand that holds the handle. I have some time this week to try some things out.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Noa, how about this sort of thing:

PHOTOGRAPHYattic - Vivitar Medium Format Camera Flash Grip Flash accessory for sale

I have the Sony grip for the CX550 which is a single handle that sits under the camera it is handy in that it has rec/stop and zoom but I find it awkward to use, the buttons don't seem to be in the right place for my hands, I find it easier to use the screen controls with my left hand. I doesn't have a tripod scre so you have to take it off to attach it to a tripod although the grip itself does double as a table tripod, good for very low floor level shots.

This one:
Sony GP-AVT1 Support system - shooting grip / mini tripod

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

yes, the vivitar flash grip is something I"m going to try to find localy, just something very basic to get a more solid grip on the camera, at this stage I"m just worried that soon or later the camera will hit the ground.

This one also looks very interesting: DSLR Mini Shoulder Pad Rig Mount Rails with Handles For Sony T3i T2i GH2 D60 D90 | eBay
Maybe just to leave the left handle off and point the right handle upwards and move it a bit backward so you can still reach the zoom while filming and get a solid grip, seems very small and compact and a good price. With a bit of modification that just might work.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

The Genus product I can find back are very expensive? Like 600 dollar just for the mattebox.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

I should be editing today but I"m too tired after doing 2 weddings in a row :) so I just imported all footage from yesterday's wedding and had a look and took out some parts to show cx730 footage I used as main cam again and why I like the camera so much. I did not include too much footage as I don't have permission but I"m sure the couple won't mind me posting a hidden link on youtube and using it for educational purposes :D

So it's just some random shots, quickly done and because of that handheld, for those shots I didn't have the time to set up a tripod, you"ll also see I really love low angle shots :) This was also for a part to emphasize the size of the church but it's a coincidence that I mainly choose those shots (just found them nice), I mainly shoot from tripods but just shoot those b-roll shots to have some inserts I can use.

I did notice some very fine aliasing in the castle near the end (footage was shot in 50i), it doesn't show on a big lcd HD screen but it does when downconverting for youtube, I do have a bit more time on my hands the following 3 weeks and will be doing some 50p tests but need to get edius 6.5 for that, since I"ll be getting a second cx730 I can do full progressive recordings (50p together with 25p on my dslr's and shouldn't have any issues anymore.)

One thing I have noticed and that is I really need to check up on my focus more using my hoodloupe, in auto mode the camera does an excellent job setting focus, even in dim light but I often switch to manual if I zoom in, 2 times I forgot to switch it back to auto resulting in 2 slightly blurred shots. Not the camera's fault but I need to look better at the info on the screen as a small thumbnail did show I was in manual. Even though the lcd has excellent resolution it's hard to tell from a distance if I"m spot on, if I use my hoodloupe I can see out of focus immediately.

All footage in this short trailer is handheld (except the shot at 00:12) and unaltered. Just check the last zoom shot, that was handheld and the camera was in full auto, considering it was getting dark the camera did cope very well keeping focus, like to see that done on a panasonic ag ac130/160 ;) I also really, really, really like the wide angle :) It makes all the difference for me being able to shoot in tight spaces or just to show a big space like this church.

Don't mind the audio as it sounds a bit distorted, it's also directly from the camera, I do use external audio recorders for all my critical audio but with last wedding I noticed distortion on loud sounds in camera, must be a setting that I need to look into.

http://youtu.be/gEXKZMWAw8s

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

My second cx730 has been ordered, should arrive next week and I will be custom building a small handle next week as well to have some extra grip taking the camera in and out the bag. With prizes around 150 to 300 euro for some very simple rigs on Ebay I decided to custom build and make it small enough so it still fits in a small bag.

With the wedding last Saturday I left the xh-a1 at home again and used a xr520 as second camera, heavy rain moved a ceremony from out- to inside, a very small and dark place but what a joy again using the camera, The camera did not loose it's autofocus once and touch focus did a great job as well, though I check with a hoodloupe everytime I use that function. I'm getting pretty fast now riding the exposure with the small wheel on front and setting the autofocus to manual whenever I zoom in and then use spotfocus to direct the focus to where I want, it's also quickly back to autofocus which is so good you would be an idiot not ot use it when the lens is wide.

Below I did a very short comparison with my 550d and a 35mm f1.4 lens at night with just one reading light on the right, the footage is brighter then what I could see. The cx730 in low lux mode is pretty close to 3200 iso on the 550d, the cx730 does records at a shutter of 1/25th in low lux but that footage is perfectly usable as long as you don't film sports. With low lux mode off it's 1/50 shutter and then it's just a bit darker then the 550d at 1600 iso. Seeing them side by side the cx730 does have a little bit more noise then the 550d but with compression to the internet or dvd that dissappeares.

cx730 and 550d low light comparison

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

So I finally got all my accesoires in this morning and just rigged up my little sony cx730, I got myself a 86 dollar rig from ebay DSLR Mini Shoulder Pad Rig Mount Rails with Handles For Sony T3i T2i GH2 D60 D90 | eBay and a 50 pound viewfinder GGS DSLR 3x LCD Viewfinder Loupe for Canon 5D MKII 7D | eBay that flips open.

This is how it looks (just click on the photo's to browse)https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/1...98582212428482

I plan on using this setup only for interviews on a tripod with a wireless handmicrophone or during "run and gun" interviews but then shouldermount, since the camera has a good build in videolight I don't need to attach this as well. The whole set up like on the photo (including camera) weighs only 2,2kg.

I had to do some modification to get the tripod plate mounted and to get my azden wireless setup attached, the azden is quite bulky but decided to not to buy a small sony wireless system for the time being, my azden is very good and since I had it already I decided to put it to use.

The hoodloupe is pretty cool, flips open so I can look at the viewfinder from a distance but also touch the screen to access controlls and when I want to check focus I just close it, for shoulder mount use its also quite good as I can look through the hooddloupe and can still access the small wheel on front of teh camera to controll exposure and the knob on top to zoom while I"m filming.

I Only need to find a better way to attach it to the screen, on the photo is stuck onto the viewfinder but then I can't close the lcd screen, so I will be looking into a way to easily attach and detach the hoodloupe. Something like this here maybe: Hoodman HoodLoupe 3.0 Camcorder Mount Strap - UK | eBay

I really like the fact that I can easily go from a full option rig that lets me record wireless audio, film shoulder mount and back to a very small handsize camera by just detaching it from the beachtek. That's the kind of swiss knive I was llooking for :) I still need to do quite some fine tuning on the rig but I"m quite happy with the result so far, especially considering that the camera, the beachtek, the rig and the hoodloupe together are still 750 dollar cheaper then what i have to pay for a canon xa10. And since I can use the beachtek with my dslr's as well it's a good investment too.

I also didn't buy a mattebox as this would make the rig even bigger and I wanted to keep it within "normal size", I plan to look into nd filters that I can just screw onto the lens, in run and gun I don't have time to deal with placing separate filters but in controlled shoots that might be an option.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Noa Put, first of all allow me to congratulate you for the wedding video you posted on the first page of this thread, I just watched it and it almost made me shed some man tears. Really good work. What did you use to record the sound outside for the exchange of the rings? I could clearly see wind and could also hear it but just barely, so I'm guessing you had something to reduce wind noise. I'm using a Rode VideoMic Pro which doesn't do a good job in windy conditions, I'm considering buying a Micover Slipover for it.

To answer your initial question, I also use a small camera for weddings. I did 3 weddings so far with my Panasonic TM900 and I really like everything about it, except for the low light performance (which is probably better on your Sony that has a slightly bigger sensor). Looking forward to read the entire thread :)

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Wow Noa, with all the accessories you can't even see the camera.... :-)

Stelios

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Well, the photo's are a bit misleading so I just removed them, just check out below video and you"ll see how small it is in it's more basic setup, I actually lost the handles as they where to bulky but will use just one in the front only when doing run and gun interviews.

It's also the azden receiver that makes it too big and that should be replaced by a smaller one but it works, gives great audio quality when needed (allowing me to use my wireless handmicrophone) and it's still a very light set up. It's also very comfortable as a shoulder rig, you hardly feel it on your shoulder and very stable when using one handle in front, this still allows me to control the exposure in realtime. The hoodloupe is a different version then I originally bhought as I still need to find a better way to attach it onto the lcd screen but this older one I had lying around does an ok job for the time being.

I have been using it in this set up the last weddings (without the azden receiver) and it works a treat. My second cx730 stays without accessories. It also makes me feel less "naked" when I have to shoot handheld in front of a large crowd, then I just lay it on my shoulder, press the beachtek against the side of my head, I slide my right hand in the camera side strap (so I have zoom control) and I controll the exposure with my left hand, I then look through the hoodloupe viewfinder and imagine having an overpriced F3 on my shoulder. ;)

http://youtu.be/Fb16mWkw4Do

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Actually I got a bit lucky, there was plenty of wind noise, only not in that part I used in the demo. :D I don't have any specific wind reducers, if it's a wedding outside and if they use a wireless microphone I try to connect my zoom h4 to the dj's table or to the back of a soundspeaker, some do have xlr out connections. or what I also do is attach my yamaha c24 to the microphones handle and I put a second yamaha c24 inside the grooms vest with a lav attached to his vest. That's about it.

Nah, it's not "that" good, but thx for the compliment anyway :) Now that I have done more weddings with my small sony's I"m getting much better at using them right. The right exposure is key for good images, overexpose a bit and the colors look washed out and faces get blown out highlights that look plain ugly but get the exposure right, or even a bit underexposed (which is easy to correct in post) and I end up with a great image.

Below a trailer from a wedding where I used one cx730, one xr520 (I didn't had my second cx730 at that time) and a t2i, all shots on the steadicam are from the t2i including every static shot with a shallow dof. All the rest is from the small sony's (the footage f.i. in church or persons doing speaches is also all sony). You have to skip though the first 50 seconds of the video to see the first sony shot. I have shot in quite demanding situations, with the sunlight almost directly into the lens up to very dark places and the camera held up beautifull. The lantern shot outside was done at night at 24db gain and on a big screen it looks great.

http://youtu.be/7SDJi1rznzw

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Noa - Your videos are really good. I currently use a VG20, FX1000 & Nex5n to do weddings. Your posts have intrigued me enough to try out one of the small Sony Handycams. I picked up a CX580V and was impresses with it on many aspects. It will cut very well with my other Sony cameras.

The problem I have (and I was not seeing in your sample videos) is ALOT of grain in low light conditions. so far just a few quick shots in auto mode. I assume this cam is close enough to the ones you are using so if you can give any hints or tips on settings you use it would be appreciated. how do you limit how much gain it uses? I also have neat video so I can clean up the noise pretty good but I would rather have clean video to start with.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Not sure about this but it could be that the 580 is about the same as the xr520 that I also have, I can say about the 520 that the lowlight at the highest gain values is the same but it produces a lot more visible grain when that's the case. This is where my 730 shines, I have seen tests here between a canon xa10 and a cx760 at 15db gain and the canon was even a bit brighter, when I asked the maker of the video why he didn't go any higher then 15db he said it was unusable at those gain levels.

Well, I can say that at 24db of gain on my cx730 I have less visible grain then 6db gain on my xh-a1, ofcourse there is grain but it's a very fine grain that in most cases you hardly notice. Until now I have not been using any plugins to remove grain. I can imagine if you do high end commercials or corporate you need a absolutely clean image but then you aren't working with a handycam.

I find gain values up to 24db usable when doing weddings without using something like neatvideo. Only thing you need to consider that at 24db gain only the shutter lowers to 1/25 but that's also usable as long as your subjects don't move too much. I only go that high if I really need to, in most other situations during a wedding I don't need to.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Well from what I can tell so far with the cx580 is it does not show what the gain level is. So maybe I need to try out the CX760 ( that's the unit here)

Can you easily set your gain with the CX730? Or is it buried in menus 9 layers deep? Can you limit the automatic gain and set value to not exceed?

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

on my 730 I can view all camera data only in playback modus, a silly limitation build in by Sony but I guess you can't have it all.

The most important functions you can assign to the front wheel but it's only one function at the time, I have "exposure" assigned to that wheel and leave it at that, there I control the exposure manually all the time.
You can also assign 3 other functions to touchscreen buttons, there I have whitebalance, Ois and focus assigned so I can change those values as well on the fly but only by using the touchscreen, takes some getting used to but works pretty well.

About autogain I know you can set low light on or off, in off mode it goes to 21db max, when on it goes to 24db and shutter 1/25
When lowlight is off you don't have to worry about high gains, the camera handles them just fine up to 21db, if you don't want it to exceed a certain value you have to controll it manually but during recording you can never see what value it's at, only when you playback.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Noa, in reference to a user you mentioned who said his XA10 is not usable above 15db, gain, that is strange of them to say that.

I have found it there is no visible grain at up to 18db with the XA10, it is remarkable. It is also VERY usable up to 21db.

Others on the XA10 forum will confirm this. With the next model down from the XA10, this is not true, even though the cameras seem identical in most every way. But for the XA10, graininess is a non issue for me.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Yes, I thought it would be like that, but not everyone has the same expectations, what you and I find no issue another one finds unacceptable. You will always have people that export frames and blow them up 400% to start to look for imperfections. For wedding clients those high gain values are not an issue either, nor is it that I hold such a small handicam in front of them. From a normal viewing distance to a tv you hardly notice the grain.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Yes, but for anyone to claim XA10 footage unusable at 15db is suspect to me, since I cannot see any grain at 18db, and neither have others in the XA10 forum. Most anyone using these cheap cameras cannot reasonably expect much more than can be delivered by them. If there expectations are for much higher than you get with an XA10 in low light, then they are using the wrong camera for sure. At least until something better for the money comes out, which could happen at anytime.

I vaguely remember the test you refer to, it was outdoors at night and it was shot by someone pretty knowledgeable, I think, but I also remember the test did not make sense to me as to how it was conducted.

Anyway, moving right along.....

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Noa-
Couple of more questions for you. are you able to limit the gain with this camera to a set value (like say 21db) since you stated this is how far you can push it and still get acceptable IQ. I believe you stated that you could simply leave low lux off and it would not exceed that value. So the question is can you leave it in that mode (low Lux off) capped at 21 db and then set the control knob for shutter speed and bring it down to 30 (im in america so it would be 25 for you)

I think that this is the same thing that Low Lux basically does so I am not sure if doing this would just reintroduce some grain right back in? anyways, I am really looking at pulling the trigger to pair up with my VG20 and Nex5N so I am just really curious on how far you can push it in low light.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

With low lux on the gain is limited to 21db and shutter stays at 1/50, if you enable lowlux the camera will leave the shutter at 1/50 untill you go past 21db gain to 24db gain and then sets the shutter to 1/25.

I have set the exposure to manual and assigned the controll of it to the small knob on front of the camera, in the viewfinder there is a ruler with a "-" and "+" (in manual mode) which gives an indication where the gain is at, there's a small vertical line inside that when it's at the far right you know you are at 24db, so even if you have low lux on, you have some visual control if you for any reason don't want to have max gain when you are controlling exposure manually.

If you have assigned exposure to the small knob you can set the exposure, hold the small button inside that knob and select focus and then you can control focus while the camera holds the exposure you choose just before, only if you assign shutter it will put exposure back in auto mode.

Here's a frame from the camera done outside at night with only candle light from wishbaloons, the camera was at 24db, sure you can see grain but like I have said before, 6db gain on my xh-a1 looks worse.

https://plus.google.com/photos/10326...CPPk6Jboq5uNJA

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Here's some other frames of the cx730 paired with a ex3, it was taken from a wedding from last weekend, I was shooting on front and a friend of mine wanted to test his new ex3 and he was shooting in the back. I managed to get some comparable point of views.

It showed the ex3 resolved more detail and it has a wider dynamic range which I expect to be normal from a 1/2" chipper but after applying some sharpening in post on my cx730 and if necessary crush the blacks on the ex3 a bit I can safely use the ex3 images together with the cx730 without noticing that much. If you want to know which camera it is per picture I added that info on the right top side beside the image, the ex3's exposure was also set a bit brighter. The frames from the cx730 have some added sharpening applied.

https://plus.google.com/photos/10326...LuDyKvt9oDkrwE

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Thanks Noa

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Well I sold one of my old PD150's and picked up a CX760V today. Impressed so far!

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Still have not figured out how to see the data in playback mode yet? is there a trick to seeing what my exposure db was for a shot?

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

on the lcd screen press "menu", "setup", "data Code" and then "Camera data".

If you then playback a clip you get gain, f-stop, whitebalance setting, shutter and ois setting.

I checked a few days ago on a clip shot during speeches and it was very dark, gain was at 24db but I noticed the shutter moving from 1/25 to 1/50 when waiters where passing in front of my camera so it seems the camera only goes to 1/25th shutter when it needs to meaning you could have 24db gain and 1/50 shutter. I only wish that info was there during recording...

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Thanks Noa, That did the trick. Yes it would be really nice if you could see that while taking video. I will need to play with this more to understand how the camera thinks. Just looking at a couple of clips that I took in low light settings showed the camera was at 3.4 f stop and pushing the gain at 15-18 db? i wonder why the camera did not bring the f-stop down to 1.8 and lower the gain?

have you ever had any luck using the f-stop as your controlling factor as opposed to exposure (gain)
overall though I am pretty impressed with this little camera. It gives better results than my FX1000 in my opinion.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

You need to assign the front wheel to exposure, if you assign it to iris that doesn't work, the camera will lock the iris at a fixed value (if you are in manual mode) but will still adjust gain and shutter automatically depending on the incoming light. Just try it by putting the iris in manual and then point from a dark to a bright area, you wil see the camera will still adjust the exposure automatically.

if you assign the front wheel to Exposure and then put it into manual, then when you set your exposure you can go from dark to light and the exposure doesn't change, untill you turn the wheel, in that case the camera will try to have the iris at a fixed f4.0 stop and gain 0, if you have to adjust the wheel/exposure for a bright light the shutter increases, if you have to adjust for a bright to a dark place then the shutter will drop to 1/50, then the iris drops to f1.8 and then it will start increasing the gain.

Not sure why you had f3.4 and a high iso, thats not the case when I set the wheel to exposure.

Edit: about the camera having better results then your fx1000, I have done some shoots with my cx730 where a fx1000 was used, I noticed that the cx730 had better low light performance meaning less noise and better color reproduction in very dark scenes but in bright light the fx1000 has better dynamic range, I can see more details in blacks for instance compared to my cx730. Also if you want the cx7xx to look good right exposure is key, a bit overexposed gives ugly hotspots on faces and oversaturated colors, underexposed for a bit is no problem and if you have exposure right it can look very good, I use the zebra's to help determining the right exposure. The fx1000 is a bit more forgiving in that area where with the cx you really need to pay attention and certainly not letting the camera decide.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

So are you using 70 or 100 on the zebra? So I assume you just turn the exposure down until the hot spots disappear?

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

I have mine set at 100, in general I think the lcd screen allready gives quite accurate feedback about how the actual exposure will look like when editing, the zebra's are just a tool for funetuning. My sony xr520 doesn't have this and the screen can be a bit tricky to determine exposure, with that camera I often get a bit too over exposed images, it looks ok on the lcd but not when editing, in that respect I think they made good progress with the cx7xx series.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Thanks for all your input Noa. I will just have to keep using it every chance I get to build my trust in what it looks like in editing. It matches pretty good with my VG20 so I am pretty happy already.

Re: Shooting weddings with small handicams
 

Your welcome :) Also good to hear it matches your vg20, I was looking for one more camera with a bit more controll and if possible not too expensive and have been looking at so many camera's and don't know what to choose anymore, the VG20 was on my list as well and the new vg30 that will be out soon looks quite nice with that new lens.

Do you get camera data (like shutter, gain etc) while recording in the lcd screen with the VG20? I don't see so many buttons on that camera so i suppose it's also quite limited in controlling different functions.
I would like to use such a camera, beside it's kit lens, with a few of my samyang lenzes, do you know if that is possible to mount those type of lenzes? And if so, do you know what the cropfactor on that camera is? (my turn now to ask questions :D)