Just bought a cheap radio lav.

[Daniel James]

Originally Posted by Roger Gunkel

Chris, I think that would be pretty much the same as the passive mixer box we discussed on the other thread. I just haven't got around to ordering the bits yet.

Steve, I'm sure you are right about greater compatibility with house systems, but half the time people don't use the mics properly and there are often flat battery and distortion problems. The other thing with the More expensive systems, apart from the price, is that they are more likely to conflict with your own system particularly in a situation with lots of wireless mics, like my schools filming.

For me, a radio mic is always a back up as there are always a number of potential problems and I would rather rely on a portable recorder for my main sound, or a direct wired mic that I can monitor.

Roger

We went over to 2.4G (Line 6) mics last year, we've yet to come across a theatre / venue that uses these frequencies, (I accept this will happen in time).

So far so good, very clear audio, no interference issues. However I am unsure how all the different makes of 2.4g kit will play alongside each other. The Line6 wireless has a quite aggressive means of securing its frequencies. (they use 2 frequencies per mic).

We use 4 now, being able to see the battery status of the remote pack on the receiver is real boon.

[Roger Gunkel]

@ Steve, yes interference can affect anything, even wired mics and my preference is for my small pocket Sonys with a lav.

@ Daniel, that's interesting to hear what you have been finding and I will have a better idea after filming every day this week in various environments.

Roger

[Daniel James]

I've used them in 1500 seat theatres with no issues, given all the RF interference from everyone's mobiles trying to find a wifi connection, they have been fine.

We tend to use the TX on the front of the stage, with the RX at the back with the cameras, all been fine.

We don't get the der,der,der that you get with analogue wireless when mobile try and page their networks.

[Roger Gunkel]

Sounding better all the time Daniel

Roger

[Roger Gunkel]

Just got back from the first field trial of the Boyer radio mic.

It was a school production shoot in a theatre with 4 cameras an orchestra and choir. As with most school production videos, it is very difficult to find anywhere to put sound mics and today was no exception. The stage was 5ft high and about 30ft wide, with the entire being used at various times from front to back. There was no possible way to use any stands, but fortunately they had a sound engineer and PA from a local studio. He was using 13 radio mics for the main players, with an overhead pair for the orchestra and choir and a separate side mic for some stage side speaking. He was very happy to take a stereo record out to my Zoom H1 from his desk, so at least I would get the clean full sound.

Being near the front and too long in the tooth to completely trust ANYONE with the responsibility for all the sound for my video, I also had two cameras recording through their own mics, a more sensitive Sony stereo mic picking up forwards and feeding a third camera and the new Boya radio lav mic taped to the front edge of the stage, the only place possible, and TXd back to a Sony portable recorder back at the video mixer.

Checking the sound after the show, the feed from the sound engineer to to Zoom was completely blank although it had recorded, he had accidentally muted the output. As his own son was in the production, he wasn't best pleased. The sound from the Sony mic was perfectly useable although there was room echo which I will be able to reduce. The two cam mics are also useable if neccesary but I am delighted to find that inspite of it's positioning and some footstep noise, the Boya radio mic has picked up a very clear sound from the stage that I can feed into the mix.

Most importantly, the venue had a large number of radio mics and a lot of lighting gear, plus staff walkie talkies, but there was not a trace of a hum or buzz from the Boya. Tomorrow at a new school, I will see if it is possible to use both Boyas and feed them to a camera this time, now that I feel more confident with them.

I'll report back again, now I need to get to bed.

Roger

[Paul R Johnson]

Exactly why desk feeds always need a backup. You cannot blem the engineer. They have their hands full with mixing radio feeds and that can be very stressful even with modern automation. It's also very easy to have programmed in a mute and not noticed calling up the next cue wipes out an output. I bet he feels bad, I would, but it happens frequently. Perhaps more now we are going digital. Seeing lots of meters means missing one is very simple.

[Roger Gunkel]

Paul, having been a sound engineer for many years, I completely agree with you and I don't blame the guy, as his job is not to do mine for me. If he screwed up the PA sound trying to get mine right, nobody would have thanked him.

I am always banging on about taking care of your own sound, whether it is weddings or concerts, otherwise you can come very unstuck.

Roger

[Roger Gunkel]

For those that aren't yet completely bored to tears, I thought I would report back on the second use of the radio mics at a school this week.

The school was a very small primary school in the middle of Cambridge putting on a production of Oliver. A very small platform stage, with a dad supplying his own radio mic body packs with about 5 mics. The music was an excellent live pianist, and the lights were 8 small white dimmable par cans. We had a platform at the back of the small hall with a similar system to yesterday, 3 Panasonic video cams one with a Sony directional mic, Lumix FZ1000 for close shots and a Zoom H1 above the stage.

Today though I took a small mains powered 5 channel mixer with onboard USB audio recording. Into this I ran the two Boya RXs into independent channels. The transmitters and lavs were just hung on the curtain at the back of the stage, not the best way to use lavs, but at least they were on the stage and spread about 10ft apart. The sound was excellent with absolutely no dropout or interference noise and lots of headroom. Just as well as I had the levels too low and had to boost the recording a lot, still a very clean overall sound though. It might not be a pair of Calrecs, but hey it's a primary school and they will be delighted. I will normalise and compress the sound to even out the levels, but I won't bother with the other recordings.

I see that as a great result for a twin talkback radio lav system for less than £100 for the two. I haven't even tested them in the normal close lav configuration, but Claire will use them at her wedding on Saturday. I will be also interested in trying other full sizeds mics now that I have some new leads arrived. the quietness of the radio signal would suggest some interesting possibilities. I also have a split lead arrived so that the talk back can now be used with a conventional mic and headset arrangement, Happy Days :-)

Roger

[Daniel James]

Hi Roger

Glad to hear they are working well for you.

We use a couple of Rode NTG2's plugged into the Line 6 body packs that we have, and a pair of Audio Technica Boundary mics into another pair (u851a) of the packs. If you pick condenser mics that run off "AA" batteries you can plug all sorts in! (We have a rule that all battery powered kit should run off "AA" batteries only, keeps the maintenance simple).

[Roger Gunkel]

Hi Daniel,

I've filmed another school production today with a couple of Sony mics into the two Boyas on stage and they worked flawlessly.

I still have a couple of boundary mics kicking about that I haven't used for a while, so I might give those a go. Funny how various mics get a whole new usage when you can plug them into a transmitter. I may even see if I can plug my guitar in, to free me from being tied to my foot pedals at gigs :-)

Roger

[Chris Harding]

I use my AKG C400 boundary mics quite often ...they are brilliant as long as you put them on a big enough surface like a table top or lectern ...Mine are also nice and small too ...about 1.5" long and 1" wide and look like a tiny computer mouse so even if they get in the shot they are still not obtrusive.

You lose a lot of low frequency audio with them but that's easily added and when you have a bunch of people around a lectern or table wanting to speak they handle that situation perfectly!!

Roger? Boya actually make a system for you muso guys also working at 2.4GHz ...the transmitter has a protruding 6mm jack that plugs in directly into your guitar and then the receiver plugs directly into the amp so you are cordless! I was contemplating buying a set (cheaper than the video ones!) and cutting off the plug as it also has a 3.5mm mic input!

[Roger Gunkel]

Thanks for that Chris, I hadn't realised they made a guitar TX, I'll have a look at that.

I used to use boundary mics all the time for weddings in the wired mic only days I may well get back into using them now with the transmitters.

Roger

[Matt Thomas]

Are you able to plug another microphone into yours? I tried to plug a different microphone in and it just doesnt pick anything up

[Roger Gunkel]

Hi Matt,

The mic supplied has a tip and 2 rings plug, whereas most mikes would be tip and ring or mono plugs. I bought a couple of Y converter leads which convert 1 tip and 2 ring plug to a pair of tip and I ring sockets If you just use a 2-1 tip converter it won't work, the separation of the connections has to be maintained, so one of the pair of sockets on the Y converter will work will work with a different mic.
Headphone with Mic Converter Cable 2 x 3.5mm Sockets to 3.5mm 4 Pole - 4PC-007635 - Audio Cables, Jack Extensions/Splitter, 4PC-007635 from kenable

Using the same adapter lead, you can also use a mic and earpiece talkback set with the RX & TX for a talkback system if you don't want to use a lav mic. Useful for communicating with another camera operator.

Roger

[Paul R Johnson]

Isn't the mic a condenser? So the TRS plug uses the extra circuit for DC power - dynamics might not have enough output, or did I get confused? Splitters or adaptors that short the sleeve to the ring might be fine with a dynamic, but will prevent a condenser getting power unless it's DC voltage superimposed on the audio type.