Smoothing choppy pan shot at DVinfo.net

Rob Jay · May 11th, 2011, 09:23 AM

I'm pretty new to Vegas Infarct I'm only using a trial version of Vegas 10 pro but I'm already very impressed.
I have some old home movie footage that I'm working with, all in all it's not too bad quality but in some of the panning shots seem very choppy, the original source material is just as bad so its not down to settings or a bad capture.
My question is are there any good temporal filters that would help smooth out the choppy pan shots without blurring the footage?

Edward Troxel · May 11th, 2011, 09:38 AM

Define "choppy". Sometimes preview speeds can be slower which might make it "appear" choppy when, in fact, it is not. If you render it out and then play back the rendered file, is it choppy then? Or if you make a DVD, does it appear choppy on the TV?

Rob Jay · May 11th, 2011, 09:48 AM

I've rendered the scene in question and it still looked pretty choppy, it's not camera shake as such it looks like the frames need to interpolated in order to smooth it out. The rest of the footage is pretty smooth.
The source was VHS and it plays just the same on the TV.
It maybe that nothing can be done to improve it but I was just wandered if there were any filters that may help temporally smooth it out.
I've looked at "Twixtor" but I'm not sure that it is suitable for my needs. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Edward Troxel · May 11th, 2011, 09:59 AM

If the original plays that way, there's probably not a whole lot you can do. Twixtor will change the speed of the clip. If you want to just try slowing it down or speeding it up and seeing if that makes a difference, just hold down the CTRL key and resize it smaller to speed it up or longer to slow it down.

Mike Kujbida · May 11th, 2011, 11:24 AM

You can try playing with the Stabilize feature that's now built into Pro 10.
Right-click on the clip, select "Stabilize Media" and choose one one of the presets.
Go with the default one first and experiment after that.

Michael Hutson · May 11th, 2011, 02:43 PM

Mercalli V2 may be able to help you out. They do have a demo version. proDAD Mercalli V2 - 3D image stabilizer, rolling shutter removal, zoom optimisation, pan shot optimisation

Jeff Harper · May 11th, 2011, 03:40 PM

If it's home video, I personally would leave it alone and go with it, but that is just me.

Richard Jones · May 12th, 2011, 07:47 AM

Not certain I understand why you say this. Even if it's a home video you will want it to be as good as you can make it for your home audience. That means trying to correct/eliminate/over-ride defects to allow the home audience to enjoy it as much as possible. Or am I missing something?

Richard

Dale Guthormsen · May 12th, 2011, 08:24 AM

Curiously,

Is it shoppy or stuttery because you shot in 24 or 30 P??

And yes, you can improve by slowing down and applying image stabilization, but you will lose some quality along the way. It also makes pans a little to long so you often end up cutting it down in size as well. If you have to use footage like that then keep the clips short so the viewer doesn't have a long time to dwell on the less than ideral footage.

Roy Alexander · May 14th, 2011, 12:09 AM

If the pan is not essential to the video why not just cut it out. If it is essential for some reason you could make a still shot of the beginning of pan, another still shot of the end of pan and dissolve the two with some commentary to cover the action. I have found that has worked for me over 60 years.

Leslie Wand · May 14th, 2011, 12:34 AM

'worked for me over 60 years'

my goodness, that has to be the longest pan EVER! ;-)

Roy Alexander · May 14th, 2011, 03:25 AM

Well done Leslie. I often make remarks without seeing the humour until later. I remember in one of my films many years ago when I was making a doc. on California red wood trees I mentioned that they survived for many years and whilst a shot was showing of a very old large specimen, I said on the commentary "And this specimen is over a thousand years old". When I first showed the film at a local film club there was much laughter when the shot appeared and it was only then that I realised my then wife was standing in front of the tree. Happy days.

May 11th, 2011, 09:23 AM	#1
Rob Jay Tourist Join Date: May 2011 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 2	Smoothing choppy pan shot I'm pretty new to Vegas Infarct I'm only using a trial version of Vegas 10 pro but I'm already very impressed. I have some old home movie footage that I'm working with, all in all it's not too bad quality but in some of the panning shots seem very choppy, the original source material is just as bad so its not down to settings or a bad capture. My question is are there any good temporal filters that would help smooth out the choppy pan shots without blurring the footage?

May 11th, 2011, 09:38 AM	#2
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot Define "choppy". Sometimes preview speeds can be slower which might make it "appear" choppy when, in fact, it is not. If you render it out and then play back the rendered file, is it choppy then? Or if you make a DVD, does it appear choppy on the TV? __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

May 11th, 2011, 09:48 AM	#3
Rob Jay Tourist Join Date: May 2011 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 2	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot I've rendered the scene in question and it still looked pretty choppy, it's not camera shake as such it looks like the frames need to interpolated in order to smooth it out. The rest of the footage is pretty smooth. The source was VHS and it plays just the same on the TV. It maybe that nothing can be done to improve it but I was just wandered if there were any filters that may help temporally smooth it out. I've looked at "Twixtor" but I'm not sure that it is suitable for my needs. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

May 11th, 2011, 09:59 AM	#4
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot If the original plays that way, there's probably not a whole lot you can do. Twixtor will change the speed of the clip. If you want to just try slowing it down or speeding it up and seeing if that makes a difference, just hold down the CTRL key and resize it smaller to speed it up or longer to slow it down. __________________ Edward Troxel [SCVU] JETDV Scripts/Scripting Tutorials/Excalibur/Montage Magic/Newsletters

May 11th, 2011, 11:24 AM	#5
Mike Kujbida Inner Circle Join Date: May 2005 Location: Windsor, ON Canada Posts: 2,770	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot You can try playing with the Stabilize feature that's now built into Pro 10. Right-click on the clip, select "Stabilize Media" and choose one one of the presets. Go with the default one first and experiment after that.

May 11th, 2011, 02:43 PM	#6
Michael Hutson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Elgin, IL Posts: 249	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot Mercalli V2 may be able to help you out. They do have a demo version. proDAD Mercalli V2 - 3D image stabilizer, rolling shutter removal, zoom optimisation, pan shot optimisation

May 11th, 2011, 03:40 PM	#7
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot If it's home video, I personally would leave it alone and go with it, but that is just me. __________________ "The horror of what I saw on the timeline cannot be described."

May 12th, 2011, 07:47 AM	#8
Richard Jones Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Woking, England Posts: 116	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot Not certain I understand why you say this. Even if it's a home video you will want it to be as good as you can make it for your home audience. That means trying to correct/eliminate/over-ride defects to allow the home audience to enjoy it as much as possible. Or am I missing something? Richard

May 12th, 2011, 08:24 AM	#9
Dale Guthormsen Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Saskatchewan Posts: 3,048	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot Curiously, Is it shoppy or stuttery because you shot in 24 or 30 P?? And yes, you can improve by slowing down and applying image stabilization, but you will lose some quality along the way. It also makes pans a little to long so you often end up cutting it down in size as well. If you have to use footage like that then keep the clips short so the viewer doesn't have a long time to dwell on the less than ideral footage. __________________ DATS ALL FOLKS Dale W. Guthormsen

May 14th, 2011, 12:09 AM	#10
Roy Alexander Major Player Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 354	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot If the pan is not essential to the video why not just cut it out. If it is essential for some reason you could make a still shot of the beginning of pan, another still shot of the end of pan and dissolve the two with some commentary to cover the action. I have found that has worked for me over 60 years.

May 14th, 2011, 12:34 AM	#11
Leslie Wand Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: upper hunter, australia Posts: 1,410	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot 'worked for me over 60 years' my goodness, that has to be the longest pan EVER! ;-) __________________ www.lesliewand.com.au

May 14th, 2011, 03:25 AM	#12
Roy Alexander Major Player Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 354	Re: Smoothing choppy pan shot Well done Leslie. I often make remarks without seeing the humour until later. I remember in one of my films many years ago when I was making a doc. on California red wood trees I mentioned that they survived for many years and whilst a shot was showing of a very old large specimen, I said on the commentary "And this specimen is over a thousand years old". When I first showed the film at a local film club there was much laughter when the shot appeared and it was only then that I realised my then wife was standing in front of the tree. Happy days.