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-   -   CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/what-happens-vegas/519770-cc-correct-sequence-gamma-gain-offset.html)

Chris Harding November 3rd, 2013 09:50 PM

CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
Hi Guys

When using the Colour Corrector for exposure control (like a clip that has a bit of backlighting and the subject faces are a little under-exposed) is there a preferred sequence when setting the Gamma/Gain and Offset sliders???

Anyone have an answer? Do you set Gamma first, then adjust Gain and Offset or what is the best way to get the most out of the image?

Chris

Juris Lielpeteris November 3rd, 2013 11:19 PM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
The best way is to monitor the process in the Videoscopes, in particular in Waveform monitor. Furthermore, I most often use Color curves instead of CC for similar activities.

Leslie Wand November 4th, 2013 01:41 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
clc - curves > levels > colour

Richard Jones November 4th, 2013 03:22 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
+1

Richard

Graham Bernard November 4th, 2013 05:22 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
Simple, as you wish to raise the Shadows use CCurves and work those Graph Points. Using levels or anything that will have a global effect on your footage, will adjust boost everything!

I've stopped using 2ndColour Corrector about 5 years ago. There are other 3rd party plugs that are admirable. I now use GenArts ColorFast as my GoTo for lifting. It has the ability to shape the mask; keep skin tones safe or/and work with 3 levels of masking - Highlights and/or Midtones and/or Shadows to bring out the best in my exposure-challenged footage.

Colour corrections & grading is a passion with me.

Grazie

Chris Harding November 4th, 2013 05:44 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
Thanks Guys

It only happens on very rare occasions when I'm fighting fierce backlighting and as already mentioned, levels simply boosts everything which doesn't really help lift stuff in the shade.

OK, with my simple mind and totally ignoring the colour wheels I can lift Gamma to get the level I want BUT I can also lift gain and get the same result and tweak either with offset. Vegas help doesn't tell you what effect each slider has on the image so if I have an image with a really blown out background but the faces of the subjects in the deep shade are still a little under-exposed, what is the best way to lift the underexposed part of the image ? This weekend my camera was already running at an EV of 2 stops over but the background was really really a killer so the faces in the shot are a bit crappy.

Thanks for all the suggestions ..the correct way to fix the problem (as minor as it is) would have been to crank the iris even more than two stops and let the background just totally blow out!!

Chris

Graham Bernard November 4th, 2013 07:09 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harding (Post 1819242)
Thanks for all the suggestions ..the correct way to fix the problem (as minor as it is) would have been to crank the iris even more than two stops and let the background just totally blow out!!

Well, yes. I've learnt to try and seek and eek out that sweet-spot of illumination versus blow-out. But that's our job - yeah? But sometimes, depending on the situ, you have to take your pragmatic view.

As a nod to working with what's there, I also use a matt box a rotated ND Grad filter. I can also use a reflector to illuminate the subject.

Grazie

Edward Troxel November 4th, 2013 08:35 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
You might also want to take a look at the ColorFast plugin from NewBlue. It will let you control the darks, mids and highlights separately.

Seth Bloombaum November 4th, 2013 10:53 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harding (Post 1819242)
...so if I have an image with a really blown out background but the faces of the subjects in the deep shade are still a little under-exposed, what is the best way to lift the underexposed part of the image ?...

As mentioned above, color curves would typically be a first filter in this. Make sure you're modifying RGB (default), then add some points and draw the bottom of an S in the lower left area of the graph.

Waveform monitor will help inform you as to exactly what is going on with the various filter controls you're working with.

Chris Harding November 5th, 2013 08:05 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
Thanks guys

I have this footage as best as I can get it but it is a pain when you get heavy back lighting in the background.

I see that Grazie uses reflectors to illuminate the subject..sheesh I never thought of that ! Is it effective without reflecting too much of the light behind the subject onto the front.

Peter Rush on the wedding forum has the same problem on an upcoming shoot with large bright windows behind the couple .... I did mention to him that Grazie talked about reflectors too here ... I would much rather reduce the problem before the shoot so post edit work is not so tricky!

Chris

Graham Bernard November 5th, 2013 10:00 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
Chris? Hand over a still and I'll have a go.

G

Leslie Wand November 5th, 2013 04:39 PM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
i always carry a couple of z96 led's and stands. amazing what they'll do to counter bright back light...

Chris Harding November 6th, 2013 06:18 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
1 Attachment(s)
Hi Grazie

Here is a screen grab to play with ... as you can see the background is fairly blown out already and skins tones have gone crazy. What I normally do is add an Invert plugin followed by the CC and then another invert so I get my footage back to positive again. However I still tend to have to play via the scopes with gamma, gain and offset but never quite know if I should push gamma quite high and then add a little gain and adjust level with the offset or only push gamma a tiny bit and then add a fair amount of gain and correct with offset???

Thanks again guys for all the advice

Chris

Edward Troxel November 6th, 2013 09:02 AM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
ColorFast can definitely correct this very quickly and easily. Sony Color Curves can also easily bring up the lows.

Graham Bernard November 6th, 2013 12:24 PM

Re: CC Correct Sequence? Gamma, Gain Offset
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here's my take on it. The BG isn't doing much for the story anyway. So, I've gone for blowing the BG and concentrated on the foreground using ColorFast+Levels+Bump Map+Soft Contrast. Using a nice white background - some detail, but not the blokes with the rucksacks! - is this:-


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