SOS capturing problems - dropping frames

[Adi Head]

Hi. I'm trying to capture video to Vegas 5.0 with my Sony PAL pd150. I've never had problems doing this in the past, but this time something is definitely WRONG.

THE SYMPTOMS:
Both video and audio do not run smoothly when capturing. sort of a stuttering effect, as if it's dropping every 3rd or 4th frame. and in fact, the dropped frames rate shoots way up to the dozens in a matter of seconds.

TESTS:
Playing back on camera while watching on LCD screen and listening through built-in camera speaker - ALL IS OK.

Tried capturing from different tape which I know has worked perfectly fine before - SAME PROBLEM OCCURED.

SETTINGS:

VIDEO
25 fps. (PAL)
720x576, pixel aspect ratio: 1.0926 (PAL DV)
Lower field first
No deinterlacing

CAPTURE PREFERENCES
Nothing special... did of course set Custom frame rate to: 25.000 (PAL)

............

Does anyone have any ideas? I'm really stuck. Have to edit a wedding and hope to be done by the time the couple gets back from their honeymoon!!

Still not 100% sure this is a Vegas issue, although I can pretty much rule out this being a camera issue..... could be hardware..... I have no idea. I'm not very techy, trying to learn though.

Any help will be blessed. Thank you

[Adi Head]

.... just updating you guys.

Tried more tests:

*** Turned scene detection off. NO IMPROVEMENT. The exact same problem occures regardless of scene detection.

*** Tried capturing to different hard drive. NO IMPROVEMENT.
(By the way, I'm using a deticated hard drive for the video media which is definately fast and big enough. As I said before, have done plenty of editing previously, using the exact same set-up: same camera, same hardware, same software.)

*** Here's an important test... tried capturing with Windows Movie Maker. SAME PROBLEM OCCURED.... (i guess this pretty much rules out this being a vegas issue.... hmmmmm).

When I try playing back the video through Vegas or Windows Movie Maker, using the software controls... I can see and hear the material perfectly. So it's safe to say that this is a problem ONLY when capturing.

I'm using firewire (don't have another option). I haven't tried using a different firewire port or cable, because I don't have one. But my Ipod words fine on the same firewire port.

[Adi Head]

Does anyone have any suggestions... I'm lost here. Went through all threads I could find in this forum that mentioned dropped frames but none have helped me resolve my particular problem so far. I'm close to giving up. I... I... I... don't know what else to try....(getting glossy eyed)... unless I get help I'm afraid...(tear noticeably forming)... my next step will probably be.... (sniff sniff).... formatting my c: drive and reinstalling my entire system (face buried in hands, outright sobbing).

[Lars Siden]

Hi Adi,

My guesses:

1. One or more harddrives has gone back to non-DMA mode(ie PIO mode)
2. Firewire and harddrive(or graphics) has accidently been allocated on the same IRQ(by the ACPI system). Try deleting the firewire card and "re-discover" it
3. Virus protection going wild

Good luck!

// Lazze

[Adi Head]

Lars, first of all thank you VERY MUCH for replying.

I must stress once again that I am not what you might call a techy person. But I'm not afraid to learn. Responding to your tips:

1. I read something about non-DMA mode on a older thread covering dropped frames. I have no idea what DMA mode is, but I followed instructions and checked - opened Device Manager and took a look at the Primary IDE Channel Properties. Device 0 has Current Transfer Mode set to Ultra DMA Mode 5, Device 1 set to Multi-Word DMA Mode 2.... is this ok?)

2. I don't know what you mean by "accidentally been allocated on the same IRQ(by the ACPI system)". My firewire is onboard my motherboard, which is an Intel D865PERL board. If you need the complete specs:
http://www.intel.com/products/mother...perl/index.htm
My graphics card is a Matrox Millennium G550. No separate firewire card.

3. I'm using Norton AntiVirus. Already tried disabling it. Doesn't make a difference.

[Ken Pike]

I had a very similar problem several months ago. Capture to Vegas was erratic at best but mostly non existant. I borrowed a new firewire cable from the shop that sold me my pc. It worked flawlessly - so I went back and paid for it.

[Adi Head]

Ken, I'm curious, did you ONLY have problems CAPTURING video?

Playback seems to work fine. I can plug in my pd150 using the same firewire cable and port, fire up vegas 5.0, go to capture mode and view the tape by pressing the PLAY button - without a hitch. It's just when I try to capture the video that it gets all stuttery and screwy, dropping frames all over the place.

[Chris Barcellos]

Sounds like something else is running in background. Have you added any new hardware or software lately ? Any new addition could be using resources and be interfering with capabity of you hard drive to capture. Have you tried capturing to a different ? Even Microsoft software updating could be creating a download, if you are internet connected. Also, have you ever defragmented you hard drives ?

[Adi Head]

Chris, to answer your questions:

Have you tried capturing to a different ? DO YOU MEAN DIFFERENT HARD DRIVE? YES. I TRIED CAPTURING TO BOTH MY HARD DRIVES - MY DEDICATED HARD DRIVE AND MY SYSTEM HARD DRIVE. SAME RESULTS.

Even Microsoft software updating could be creating a download, if you are internet connected. DISCONNECTED INTERNET. SAME RESULTS.

Have you ever defragmented you hard drives ? I DEFRAGMENTED BOTH MY HARD DRIVES. SAME RESULTS.

The only thing that happened recently which possibly could have something to do with my problem, is that I've been having difficulties with my anti-virus and internet protection software. My Norton Internet Security 2005 expired a couple of weeks ago. I tried to use a trial version Mcafee Antivirus afterwards, only to find out that there's a known software conflict between Mcafee Antivirus and a program called PodUtil which is a 3rd party program I use with my iPod. So I uninstalled Mcafee and tried installing Norton again. Easier said then done. Turns out, you have to remove stuff from your registration that Norton put in there and a bunch of other things before you reinstall a different version of Norton. So I did what I had to do, following Symantec Support Instructions very carefully. Then I tried to install the new version of Norton Internet Security. I completed the installation process, but unsuccessfully. When I open up the program an error message popped up saying: An error has occurred. If this error occurs again, uninstall and then reinstall the product (error 5004,183). Needless to say, the error occurred again. So I got really bummed, poured myself a beer and disabled Norton Internet Security for now. I plan to take care of that problem later when I've prepared myself mentally.

So right now, my erroneous Norton Internet Security is disabled and has remained disabled throughout my unsuccessful attempts to capture tapes on Vegas 5, but could all of this somehow be causing the problems I'm experiencing? and if so, what are my options?

Thanks.

[Ken Pike]

Hi Adi:

Yes my problem was exactly as you describe. Everything worked fine except for the capture process. It was very confusing and very frustrating. I spent hours trying to diagnose the problem and started to conclude that it was a hardware issue and not software or settings related. With that in mind, the simplest place to start was with the firewire cable and that proved to be the problem.

I am by no means an expert - believe me. I just got lucky! I'm sure there are tons of other reasons for this type of problem - mine, fortunalely, turned out to have a rather simple fix.

Good luck.
Ken

[Paul R Johnson]

Have a look at what stuff is running in the background - ctrl-alt-del and go down the list - it will take a while but anything with a strange process name should be run through google. If your machine is internet conencted, I'll bet you have at least 2 or 3 nasties running in the background.

I had very similar problems capturing on one of my machines all of a sudden - the problem seemed to be in the firewire card - the check of background processes revealed a few things that shouldn't have been there, and loads that should, of course. Many of these start up again if you shut them down. The google links usually led me to a site with removal instructions. after cleaning this rubbish out, normal service was resumed. I've been told, but not yet proved, that both norton untilities and windows system restore often have priority and if these kick in during capture you can get the occasional dropped frame.

I now capture using DV-rack (serious magic) and this seems much more stable and reliable than the capture utility in premiere or the windows one.
Paul

[Chris Barcellos]

Well, I have to tell you that about 6 years ago I swore off Nortons, and the other big commercial computer maintenance software. I always felt they create more problems and eat up more system resources than they need to. I currently use AVG from www.grisoft.com as my only virus software. I also use Ad-Aware as a pop up detector, and I also use Spybot Search and Destroy. All have free versions which are more than adequate. I run the AVG all the time, and the others when I detect I am having some problems. (Things like system resources being used up.) They will isolate unwanted programs and spy software. Keep them updated, and you should eliminate the problems there, if you have any. In meantime, try uninstalling any protection software you have on the computer, and then retry the capture. I am guessing you might have McAffee competing with something going on in what is left with the Norton sofware. While you do this, disconnect from internet, if you want to feel protected.

In meantime, the other thing that happens in unprotected situations is that your system has some sort of downloader software on board. It is even remotely possible your machine is being used to carry out bot commands by another system.

If you hit control/alt/del on you keyboard simultaneously, the Windows task manager will pop up and you can see what applications are currently running, and you can select "Processes", and see if anything is using system resources. As I sit here and check mine, and since I am not running any major programs, it tells me 99% of my resources are in system idle mode.

[Lars Siden]

Hi again,

Hopefully everything is solved now...

But:

* Even though the firewire is onboard, yiu can delete it from device manager and then let windows find it again

* Do you have any errors or warnings in device manager? ie yellow ! marks

Good luck!

// Lazze

[Adi Head]

Well guys... thanks for all the effort to help me get this straightened out. unfortunately, i've tried pretty much everything you've suggested so far except for going out and buying a new firewire cable.

i've pretty much come to the conclusion that it might be a good time anyway to make a clean installation of windows, format the c: drive, install my software applications from new and start from fresh.

if this doesn't solve the problem, i'll go and get a new firewire cable.... hopefully at that stage - the new cable will do the trick. if not..... i'll be up shit creek, will probably have to start swapping hard drives and stuff.

i'll update this thread with outcomes.

that's all for now.... cheers

[Dionyssios Chalkias]

I would check for incompatibilities in Device Manager and try a new cable for 3$ before reinstalling everything on my computer...