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Canon XL1S / XL1 Watchdog
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Old November 9th, 2003, 01:54 PM   #226
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Sorry Stephen, as far as I know XL1s has Li-ion batteries which don't show "memory'' effects.
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Old November 10th, 2003, 03:22 PM   #227
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Thank you guys for your advices. At this price, I will try one of these batteries and will inform you of its performance.
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Old November 10th, 2003, 08:33 PM   #228
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Andre is correct.

The Lithium Ion batteries are not subject to "memory". That shortcoming is part of the NiCad family. The only way to get most out of your NiCads was to use the battery until it discharged to the point where it was un-usable but not totaly discharged. Totaly discharging a NiCad could ruin it. Then you would have to give it a full charge and repeat the process.

If, for example, you use a NiCad for 15 minutes and return it to the charger to "top-off", then continue this pattern repeatedly, after a while you would only be able to get 15 minutes of use even if the battery is showing a full charge.

This is not the case with Lithium Ion batteries. You can shoot and top-off your L-Ion batteries without your having to worry about them being conditioned or developing a memory.

So enjoy this new freedom and top-off your batteries without having to feel guilty!

As for your initial question, I'll have to double check my XL1s manual. I have never heard of a battery going bad from being stored charged.

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Old November 11th, 2003, 05:02 AM   #229
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To Stephen: the reason why LI-ion batteries are better stored uncharged is because of the risk of unbalance. Li-ion do discharge, but very slowly. Not all cells in the battery have the same discharge rate. After a long storage (several months), one can end up with strongly unbalanced cells in the battery which cause overstressing (and early dead) of the battery when recharged.
To Rick: it is a misconception that "memory effect" is the result of recharging/topping-off partly discharged batteries. The "memory effect"(voltage depression) is the result of extended trickle charging. Older NIcads were very sensitive to this effect which results in a change of the chemical structure of a part of the battery mass. The changed part keeps the same capacity (Wh) but under a lower cell voltage (about 1V vs 1.2V for Nicad). Fortunately partly discharging the battery (below .9V/cell) a couple of times reverses the unwanted chemical structure.
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Old November 11th, 2003, 05:21 AM   #230
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Many myths, legends and hearsay comments are often repeated about NiCad batteries. Andre is correct in his statements.
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Old November 11th, 2003, 07:59 AM   #231
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Whoops my bad...
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Old November 11th, 2003, 06:29 PM   #232
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Andre is correct!

And FWIW NiMH do also exhibiit the so called voltage depression "memory" effect, although not quite as pronounced as NiCad.

The reason camcorders would shut down due to the memory effect is low cost design of consumer gear. They were designed around 5-volt integrated circuit components and 6-volt (5-1.2 volt cells) batteries. This saves a cell in battery (cost and weight) and allowed use of off-the-shelf components. The voltage drop due to memory effect was just enough to fool a camcorder into thinking the battery was at end of charge early in the discharge cycle.

Note that the nominal 6 volt NiCad was actually about 7 volts at full charge, a bit over 6 volts for most of the discharge curve, and about 5.4 volts at full discharge for camcorder purposes. You can see the loss of a bit over 0.1 volts per cell would put it into apparent discharged voltage state early in the discharge curve.

Some so called no-mem NiCad batteries took the simple approach of adding a 6th cell to keep the voltage higher over the full discharge curve.
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Old November 11th, 2003, 11:12 PM   #233
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no memory

Where did you read this about draining the battery?
I have been under the impression that these batteries do not have memory, and can be charged from any state. Please expound on this subject.
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Old November 12th, 2003, 06:19 AM   #234
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Trig, what do you want to know about draining batteries? Did you read the entire thread and Andre's and Don's comments? Most types of batteries do not need to be discharged. What type of batteries are you using?
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Old November 12th, 2003, 06:40 AM   #235
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We'll probably need to turn Andre's and Don's comments into a page for the Watchdog site, or at the very least, part of an F.A.Q. list. That's some good info to know.
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Old November 12th, 2003, 08:57 AM   #236
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sorry

Sorry, I tried to delete my post when I saw the memory thing was covered, but could not; why not?
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Old November 12th, 2003, 09:14 AM   #237
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Just email a mod to remove a post or post the request to have it removed.
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Old November 20th, 2003, 02:19 PM   #238
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Batteries !

Hi !

I have the XL1s and have seen a large variety to batteries that can be purchased for this camera.

I was originally going to buy 2 Canon brand BP945's rated at 4550mAh's but have found that Energizer make the same battery rated at 5550mAh's !

Has anyone used these energizer batts, and if not, can anyone give any good advice on battery purchases based on personal experience....

Thanks

Nick
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Old November 20th, 2003, 04:27 PM   #239
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Search this site for batteries, there are plenty of posts about them.

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Old November 20th, 2003, 09:40 PM   #240
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Hi, I don't own any batteries from canon or energizer, But I have some Power 2000 6000 mAh and they are great!

I also order a noname 5500 mAh one at 30$ from eBay a few weeks ago, and I was very surprised!!! it last at least as long as the Power 2000. I don't know how it will perform on the long time, but at 30 bucks, it worth the try!

Check for the seller "batteryhome". it is listing a few of thoses BP-45 equivalents each weeks.
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