Filming LCD Screens using ECS mode of PMW-EX1 at DVinfo.net

Paul Chiu · September 23rd, 2009, 08:36 AM

Results are pretty impressive using the ECS mode, the only issue is having to adjust to the correct frequency with the jog dial.

sample of ECS mode filming a Samsung UN46B8000 flat screen running mixed sources.

Paul

HD 720p Demo of Samsung UN46B8000. Filmed with Sony PMW-EX1 XDCAM

Vincent Oliver · September 23rd, 2009, 04:34 PM

You don't need to use ECS mode with LCD screens, this is used for CRT screens.

Not sure what point you are making with this video demo. I experimented with filming screens to achieve better screen shot tutorials for DVD production, but the screen dot caused too many moire problems. I am still using Camtasia and converting the files to AVI, but even after tweaking, the screen shot movies still look soft.

ps the DVD is for TV playback rather than computer playback.

Paul Chiu · September 23rd, 2009, 06:41 PM

You can use ECS for both.
Sony Pro Support suggested using ECS for LCD screen, so we did.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent Oliver

You don't need to use ECS mode with LCD screens, this is used for CRT screens.

Not sure what point you are making with this video demo. I experimented with filming screens to achieve better screen shot tutorials for DVD production, but the screen dot caused too many moire problems. I am still using Camtasia and converting the files to AVI, but even after tweaking, the screen shot movies still look soft.

ps the DVD is for TV playback rather than computer playback.

Vincent Oliver · September 24th, 2009, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Chiu

You can use ECS for both.
Sony Pro Support suggested using ECS for LCD screen, so we did.

OK, I must confess that I didn't try ECS with my Samsung 24" LCD monitor, but will give it a go.

Paul Chiu · September 24th, 2009, 07:08 AM

we had no idea either and we had these cameras for a year and a half now.
filming of screens was something we needed to do as all my jobs are corporate related and those LCD screens are everywhere.
Until recently, we tried cropping the screens with the flickers out but that was quickly rejected by most customers.

So now the footage with the screen is rock steady with ECS.
The hassle is no auto scan function to arrive at the ECS frequency.
I suggested it to Sony Pro Services....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent Oliver

OK, I must confess that I didn't try ECS with my Samsung 24" LCD monitor, but will give it a go.

Kelly Rush · November 16th, 2009, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent Oliver

You don't need to use ECS mode with LCD screens, this is used for CRT screens.

Not sure what point you are making with this video demo. I experimented with filming screens to achieve better screen shot tutorials for DVD production, but the screen dot caused too many moire problems. I am still using Camtasia and converting the files to AVI, but even after tweaking, the screen shot movies still look soft.

ps the DVD is for TV playback rather than computer playback.

Try the following to fix the "soft" look issue:

1. This is for DVD, correct? Set your recording region to "custom", and either record at 720 x 480 (if that is a large enough space for what you're showing), or some dimension that is a ratio of that (i.e. 1080 x 720, 1460 x 960, etc.)

2. In the editor, set your project settings to a size of 720 x 480 (resolution of DVD). Either set custom zoom/pan points to show off the screen, or enable "SmartFocus" to allow the software to take its best-guess as to where the focus of the screen should be (only works if original recording was a .camrec, not an AVI)

3. Produce the video to an AVI, either TSCC or uncompressed encoding, at 720 x 480 resolution.

4. Bring the video file into your next editor or DVD production software.

That should help keep the video mostly crisp-looking. Keep in mind that going to DVD will introduce a degree of MPEG-2 compression, but that should get you the clearest video possible for the DVD medium.

Vincent Oliver · November 18th, 2009, 02:59 AM

Thank you for the tips Kelly. I managed to get better results by turning off the Frame Blend option (Premiere Pro) and then applyiong a small amount of Unsharp Masking. I am still experimenting with various resolutions, I did try the 720x480 or 720x576 setting but the capture area was far too small for Photoshop tutorial screens. Finally I also applied a Flicker removal.

The problem is that computer monitors have a higher resolution than TV screens and when you play a computer display movie on a TV it can't display the fine lines of pallettes etc. The lines jump between the scans and produce a jumping line (flicker). The Flicker removal fixes this by applying a small amount of blur.

Kelly Rush · November 19th, 2009, 02:55 PM

Right, well for sure you want to set your Premiere Pro project up as a progressive project, rather than interlaced. (assuming you are using software to capture directly from the screen) The footage is progressive, so interleaving the footage will cause it to take on an out-of-focus look.

Regarding the resolution of a TV screen (assuming a 4:3 standard-definition television), that is true, but using something like Camtasia Studio, you can define the region to record to be the same resolution as a television monitor, or even record your entire screen, and set your project to match the resolution of a TV monitor and employ the zoom & pan function to show off regions of the screen (since the resolution of an SD TV display is usually equivalent to only a portion of a computer display).

Hope that helps!

Vincent Oliver · November 21st, 2009, 10:25 AM

Thank you Kelly I will give his a go, I had been using interlaced video capture for all my previous filming, but moved over to 30P since.

I have been using a small portion of the screen on my last DVD, this does focus the attention to what is being demonstrated, we don't need to see the entire application all the time.

Thanks for your help

September 23rd, 2009, 08:36 AM	#1
Paul Chiu Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: new york Posts: 231	Filming LCD Screens using ECS mode of PMW-EX1 Results are pretty impressive using the ECS mode, the only issue is having to adjust to the correct frequency with the jog dial. sample of ECS mode filming a Samsung UN46B8000 flat screen running mixed sources. Paul HD 720p Demo of Samsung UN46B8000. Filmed with Sony PMW-EX1 XDCAM

September 23rd, 2009, 04:34 PM	#2
Vincent Oliver Trustee Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Chislehurst, London Posts: 1,724	You don't need to use ECS mode with LCD screens, this is used for CRT screens. Not sure what point you are making with this video demo. I experimented with filming screens to achieve better screen shot tutorials for DVD production, but the screen dot caused too many moire problems. I am still using Camtasia and converting the files to AVI, but even after tweaking, the screen shot movies still look soft. ps the DVD is for TV playback rather than computer playback. __________________ Eyes are a deaf man’s ears. Ears are a blind man’s eyes

November 18th, 2009, 02:59 AM	#7
Vincent Oliver Trustee Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Chislehurst, London Posts: 1,724	Thank you for the tips Kelly. I managed to get better results by turning off the Frame Blend option (Premiere Pro) and then applyiong a small amount of Unsharp Masking. I am still experimenting with various resolutions, I did try the 720x480 or 720x576 setting but the capture area was far too small for Photoshop tutorial screens. Finally I also applied a Flicker removal. The problem is that computer monitors have a higher resolution than TV screens and when you play a computer display movie on a TV it can't display the fine lines of pallettes etc. The lines jump between the scans and produce a jumping line (flicker). The Flicker removal fixes this by applying a small amount of blur. __________________ Eyes are a deaf man’s ears. Ears are a blind man’s eyes

November 21st, 2009, 10:25 AM	#9
Vincent Oliver Trustee Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Chislehurst, London Posts: 1,724	Thank you Kelly I will give his a go, I had been using interlaced video capture for all my previous filming, but moved over to 30P since. I have been using a small portion of the screen on my last DVD, this does focus the attention to what is being demonstrated, we don't need to see the entire application all the time. Thanks for your help __________________ Eyes are a deaf man’s ears. Ears are a blind man’s eyes

November 19th, 2009, 02:55 PM	#8
Kelly Rush New Boot Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: United States Posts: 6	Right, well for sure you want to set your Premiere Pro project up as a progressive project, rather than interlaced. (assuming you are using software to capture directly from the screen) The footage is progressive, so interleaving the footage will cause it to take on an out-of-focus look. Regarding the resolution of a TV screen (assuming a 4:3 standard-definition television), that is true, but using something like Camtasia Studio, you can define the region to record to be the same resolution as a television monitor, or even record your entire screen, and set your project to match the resolution of a TV monitor and employ the zoom & pan function to show off regions of the screen (since the resolution of an SD TV display is usually equivalent to only a portion of a computer display). Hope that helps!