Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

sorry Ryan - I didn't intend you to think it was a technical term, because not isn't but the Zeppelin shaped wind reducing device - windshield, windscreen, whatever gets covered by the hairy cover, so I figured using 'windshield' might be misunderstood, when I was thinking the hairy cover that gets wet, matted and bends the boom! Hairy Sausage is descriptive, but hardly a proper term. Hence why I like it!

I think, looking back at how I learned things, pre-internet from books was not that different from the net used info we have now, but just always out of date. However - they give a flavour. That's all. In technical disciplines like ours, experimentation and learning from poor (or maybe good) results counts. You listen to all the sources and learn from them. I've learned the hard way to have backups. Indeed, one of the reasons for buying any current favourite camera is the twin card slots for security. I still have my two similar, but tape based cameras, and used one as a B roll camera last week and suffered a head clog. I'd forgotten how these used to happen, but didn't use the hard drive recorded sitting on the shelf. Just a stupid mistake. With sound, I always run two mics, never recording one to both channels, because sometimes this gets you out of trouble.

Just get the mics in close, reduce unwanted pickup by careful aiming and listen really hard to what they are capturing. Loud capable headphones that shut out real sound are pretty critical too.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Oh okay thanks :). When you say headphones that shut out are sound are critical, I was told the opposite before, and that I want headphones to sound as realistic as possible, that way you know exactly what is being heard accurately, but is that true?

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

There are many (most?) headphones out there that are "hyped" to "sound good" to people listening to head-banging hard rock or rap or whatever is popular these days. They have names like "Beats" and/or names of celebrities attached (like "Dr. Dre") and made in a rainbow of colors to make them appealing to children. They are NOT designed to be accurate. Accuracy means even, uncolored response across the audio spectrum. That way you can actually hear properly the audio signal that you are trying to record. You won't hear hyped bass or squeaky highs, etc.

Headphones that shut out or "occlude" or "isolate" external sounds are important so that you can hear ONLY what you are trying to record. But that is a completely DIFFERENT, SEPARATE and INDEPENDENT factor from accuracy (or hype). "Realism" and "occlusion" are NOT THE OPPOSITE. They are completely independent factors. There are hyped, unrealistic headphones that have excellent occlusion. And there are accurate headphones that are "open-air" where you can easily hear outside sounds. There are reasons why people would buy headphones like that. But accurately monitoring what you are trying to record is NOT one of those reasons.

To properly monitor what you are recording, you need ISOLATION so that you hear ONLY what you are recording, and NOT any sound through the air into your ears. You want to hear ONLY what the microphone is picking up because that is the only thing that will be recorded. It doesn't matter what things sound like to your ears because you can't record what your ears are hearing. You can only record what the microphone is hearing.

And you need headphones that are ACCURATE so that you aren't fooled into thinking that your audio sounds "good" if it doesn't.

There are a few kinds of headphones that are favorites with production soundies around the world. In our part of the world, the Sony MDR-7506 have been popular for many years. I have several pairs and have gone through several sets of replacement ear cushions for them. But my current favorite appear also the favorite in Europe, the Sennheiser HD-280. Also popular are Audio Technica ATH-M50X.

Most earbuds are not very accurate and not recommended for serious audio recording. They are fine for entertainment, listening while jogging or on a long plane flight. However, there are SOME brands and models that are specifically made for accuracy and isolation for professional use.

Note also that "noise-cancelling" headphones are NOT RECOMMENDED for proper monitoring. Because they will cancel some types of noise that your microphone is picking up and being recorded. So you will think you are hearing noise-free audio, but you will discover that noise in your recording when you get back to your editing computer. Again, noise-cancelling headphones (or earbuds) are marvelous for entertainment, especially on a long flight. But they are NOT appropriate for serious monitoring.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Okay thanks. But as far as headphones go where you are only hearing what you want to record, let's say that later in post production, you hear unwanted sounds that you couldn't hear as much in the headphones, because of that. Wouldn't that be a bad thing, if you could not hear those sounds, and heard them later in post?

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

NO! NO! You do NOT (NOT!) monitor "what you WANT to record". You need to monitor what you actually ARE recording.

That is why you want headphones (or earbuds) that:
1) ISOLATE you from sounds through the air so that you hear ONLY what the microphone is picking up and recording.
2) ACCURATELY reproduce exactly what the microphone is picking up. Noise and all.

So that if you hear anything wrong, you can FIX IT right then and there during production. Because trying to fix it after the fact (in post-production) will be time-consuming, damaging to the audio, difficult, expensive, and often completely impossible.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Oh Okay thanks, sorry I misunderstood! :).

Yes that makes sense and that's what I want. However, I noticed the headphones I have actually display more noise than what is coming through in post. I hear noise and get worried, but then when I play it back in post, on big speakers, there isn't near as much noise. I don't think it's the headphones though, as I have tried two pairs so far, and I think it might be the headphone jack in my FR2-LE recorder, that I haven been using over the years, cause it's always seemed to give more noise in the headphones, compared to post later, where things actually sound better.

Does that make sense?

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

It is good that you are experimenting with your gear "offline" (not during actual production). That is the best way to understand how it all works together and what everything should look like (and sound like) when it is working properly, and to "calibrate" your ears to know what you will end up with in post-production editing.

Note that a lot of lower-end plastic consumer gear has inferior headphone amps. So it is not surprising that you may hear self-noise from the recorder that is not present in the recording. Until you can afford to use better equipment, at least you can listen to the self-noise from the recorder (with the input turned all the way down) to know what to ignore while you are recording the desired sounds.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

To be honest Ryan, no it makes no sense at all.

Noise - you hear it in the headphones and not in the recording? What kind of noise? We're not talking about hiss, or hum or buzzes - we're talking about the sound your microphone is capturing. What kind of noises are you hearing/ my experience and I suspect Richard's will be the same is that what you hear is exactly what you record. You can hear the aircon duct rumbling, you can hear traffic passing by, you can hear the birds tweeting or the grasshoppers chirping - that kind of thing. Sound on Sound magazine (the only UK one I trust) liked it. The headphone socket was not pointed out in a negative manner - so I don't understand what you mean about it being the problem?

Can you explain what issues you have? I'm confused now. That recorder should do a decent job.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Oh okay, sorry I should have explained. I just meant hiss, as in the noise floor sounds higher in the headphones, than it actually is later in post, when playing through bigger speakers.

But I also feel that the background sounds are louder in general through the headphones than in post later. It's like when I turn up the gain on recorder while in production, I can just hear the background being closer whether it's be air ducks or traffic outrside, etc. Then it post, it's pushed further away then it sounded before.

I think there is more of a contrast between foreground and background sound in post, than it the headphones on production, it sounds like.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

It is a GOOD thing that you hear unwanted noises LOUDER in monitoring during recording. It is a benefit to reducing the noises during production. The purpose of monitoring during recording is to capture cleanly the very best pickup of the dialog. MAXIMIZING the level and quality of the voice, and MINIMIZING the unwanted noises and environmental effects (echo, reverberation, etc.)

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Yes, I suppose that is a good thing :).

I was just surprised at how much better it sounds in post. As for recording dialogue, I read from some sources not to let the gain and volume go over 75%. But some people's voices are kind of quiet, and I need to go over 75% I read. Is this because of the pre-amps of the FR2-LE, or is this normal on other field recorders?

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Ryan - this is recording 101!!

forget totally any kind of percentage. Input gain is set appropriately to make best use of the available dynamic range. So A quiet voice, recorded with a rather insensitive microphone will require more gain than a loud voice with a sensitive mic. You cannot go over, even by a tiny amount, the maximum the equipment can handle. It can sound horrible, nasty and very distorted. At the other end, if you accidentally record too low, then when you boost it in post, it gets noisier.

So forget the idea of recording at 75% on the gain control, or even at 75% of the maximum scale on the meter - not really sure what you meant, or what your friends meant - but they sound the kind of friends who are best asked about video rather than audio, to be honest.

What you really MUST do quickly is get to know your equipment. Learn how it responds to low and high level inputs. Learn how it sounds when you accidentally go too high or too low. Learn how far you can push.

I'll give you an example. Today I've plugged in a new bit of kit to a mixer. The device is set to deliver what's called +4dB output level, which is pretty hot. It's connected to a Soundcraft mixer that does not have a pad control, and could really do with one, as a track mastered to -3dB peak manages to light the peak light on the mixer with the gains only a gnat's whisker above minimum. However, I know this mixer well and it can cope with this considerable overloading. It is impossible to connect to my Tascam interface without sounding dreadful, even on minimum gain. The Soundcraft just copes better with hot signals.

You say your recorder sounds better on proper monitors? Compared with what headphones? Comparable ones or hifi ones? Again, not all headphones are equal.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Okay thanks, but as far as turning it up to the max goes, I've done that a few times to get the voices louder in some locations, and it didn't sound nasty or horrible at all. It sounded fine, so it it normal for the equipment to be turned up max, and still sound decent, as long as the voices are not clipping of course?

As for comparing headphones to monitors, what counts as a hi-fi headphone exactly?

As for mic sensitivity, so far I have the NTG-3 and the 4053b mics only, and the 4053b seems slightly more sensitive but only slightly, it seems.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

As @Paul R Johnson said, Recording 101 reduced to a single sentence is: Record the sound as accurately and appropriately as possible AT THE OPTIMAL LEVEL.

We keep going around and around on "accurately" and "appropriately" but you seem to have some goofy scheme of using "multiple mics to record dialog". But apparently, the only way to cure you of such a delusion is for you to try it for yourself so you can see why it won't work.

Recording at the optimal level means recording as high as possible (to stay above the noise-floor), but to keep the level low enough so that you never hit absolute zero clipping. There are no absolute rules about what level to record at. Adjusting recording levels properly is essentially the primary job of the sound recording person (the "A1") It requires experience and judgement. There is no cookie-cutter rule-of-thumb. And getting the microphone in the right spot is essentially the primary job of the boom operator ("A2") The definitions of A1, A2, etc are not the same for production audio as they are for live sound (like a rock concert, etc.)

The noise floor is a combination of all the noises from ambient noise, echo and reverb, source loudness, microphone sensitivity, microphone self-noise, microphone directionality, microphone working distance, mic preamp signal-to-noise ratio, recorder self-noise, etc. etc.

OTOH, clipping is very simple and totally unforgiving. If you allow the recording level to hit 0dBFS (clipping) then you are recording too loud. Period. Full stop. No debate. Some gear (like premium preamps in Sound Devices gear) are designed to have graceful behavior in the event of modest overload. But most gear simply falls apart at clipping.

If you are recording something very predictable, then you can set your levels high enough to stay well above the noise-floor but avoid clipping. But if you are recording something unpredictable, then you must select a lower recording level to leave yourself some "headroom" between the audio peaks and the absolute maximum (clipping).

You can set recording levels properly during rehearsal while leaving a bit of extra headroom for unexpected exuberance during the actual performance. We often prefer to use 24-bit recording which gives you a very comfortable 144dB dynamic range vs. the 96dB dynamic range from 16 bit recording. Remember that the release format may be 16 bit, but that is quite acceptable once you have properly mixed all the audio elements together. But during live recording, you don't have a crystal ball to predict exactly what the audio peaks will be.,

Perhaps you missed the discussion of headphones including mention of the top 3 favorite models used by production sound people. Sometimes it is not clear why you keep asking things that we thought we had answered?

Mic sensitivity is only one of a dozen factors that affect the signal-to-noise ratio of your recorded tracks.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Oh sorry, I didn't mean to ask the same questions, there are just certain variables, I am trying to understand more in depth, that's all.

But I never recorded with multiple mics, it was just suggested to me, by two people in the audio business, but they are much more experienced in recording music and musicians. But I will stick to recording with just one boom mic, like I've been doing and won't do what they say, like you said.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

no Ryan - that isn't what we are saying at all! None of us have said just use a boom mic and ignore your friends - we're saying that as each project is different, there can be no single rule. For my last three video outings I have never even taken the shotgun out of the case, and the boom has had of all things, a camera on the end, and I used the audio the cameras shot. You seem to be a little like Gibbs in NCIS - but you only have rule 1 and maybe rule 2. You get to rule 100 after more than 100 jobs where you keep writing new ones to fill in the "what if?" holes.

In my career, I have never been good enough at any single discipline to earn the tag expert, because for me, every job has involved learning new things, so I have had consistent work since the seventies because I'm know to be good at lots of things rather than expert at one. I still make mistakes, but I'm proud to have never have made the same one twice. You seem desperate to learn as much as you can in advance, and frankly, because people cannot write sound down, you just have to learn by experience. I have two different shotguns in the same Zeppelin mounts, and I should probably colour code the handles so I know which is the 416 and which is the slightly longer AT815. I've done loads of jobs on what was probably, on paper, the wrong one - but I have never been able to tell the difference. They sound different, but as they get used on different sound sources all the time, this colour difference gets lost. I just tweak the EQ and always get sound that does what it should.

Richard made a good point about levels. We guess. We even get quite good at guessing. I did a single man, multiple job classical choir job a few weeks ago, and needed to set the gains from just a few minutes between the end of my rigging and the choir being broken before the live performance. I picked a level based on maybe 15 seconds of the end of a movement. No idea if this movement was typical, or was the loudest, or what. I knew the musical style, but not the piece. I watched the singers to see how loud they were singing compared to the conductor's hand waving, I listened to the organ, than I knew would be the same volume in the performance as it wasn't on the swell. I picked a level and I actually guess a little low - I had nothing recorded above -10dB on the meters, most being considerably lower. The preamps managed fine, noise was so low that I could hear the rumbles and motor blower on the organ NOT noise.

You have got to start to learn your equipment, and learn how it responds to your adjustments. We have an ex-BBC guy locally, who is in his late 80's and he still records on a Nagra (Google it) in analogue on reel to reel tape that has probably been erased a million times. The paper spec of this recorder, with two Coles (STC) mics is really not remotely the best compared to modern equipment, but his recordings are stunning in clarity and if I'm honest, a low noise floor. He simply rolls off the upper HF, and takes the hiss with it. Probably has always done this. He never makes a bad recording with this gear. He just knows how it works. this is where you should start! please don't think we're criticising - we genuinely want to urge you to stop planning and thinking about absolutes and get you into experimenting.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Okay thanks. I don't mean to say I will operate by one rule only, but as for the multiple mics thing, they are too hard to hide on a set design, without getting in the way of things. So I haven't found a reason yet to plant mics around that don't move with the actors.

As for gain on the field recorder, I can just keep on doing what I am doing then and turn the gain and volume up to around 75% since that gets the levesl at around -12 db most of the time, if that's best.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Hiding mics on set - movies, TV and theatre is actually a tried and tested system - but remember it's planned carefully. If you are using a boom but one shot needs a wide shot that makes the mic too far away, you will get that nasty hollow, weak audio from it. If the actors are grouped around a table with a central plant pot, or light fitting, then hiding a small lav there is a great idea. BUT - you only do it when it's a problem solver. It's the distance thing again - closer the better. If you have tight budgets then many options are simply unavailable - but at the pre-production meetings this is where people discuss and sort these things. You find it often is the same things. You discover the director wants the really wide shot, and asks you about lavs. You are happy, because if they ask, the budget for them is easier to get, but then wardrobe jump in and point out the actress has a tight cropped top and nowhere for a mic to be hidden, let alone the pack. You point out that so far that means no sound, so you'll have to budget for an ADR session. The producer vetos this and you ask wardrobe for a solution, and they ask if it's possible to hide a pack and mic in a hat the actor might be wearing? This is the way it gets planned. No reason why a production of any scale cannot do this process, and find answers.

If your 75% system works - then go with it. I'm just surprised it doesn't need tweaking.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Okay thanks. When you say you are surprised my 75% does not need tweaking, but tweaking do you mean adjustments in levels, here and there? Cause I do do that too, if that's what you mean.

Also, in my past experience, the director will always allow the DP to call the shots on where the mic is placed, and the DP picks places too far away, leading to not the closest sound as it could be. Is this common on a lot of shoots?

As for plant mics, I don't really like the idea of planting them for close ups, but not a master, cause I am worried about something messing with the continuity if I do that, but maybe not.

What about movies where they don't use lavs in wide masters and they used boom mics, but the mics are further away, and they just go with the audio anyway? Take the wide master shot from this scene for example:


The boom mic is further away then usual, and the audio sounds more distant, but the filmmakers chose to go with it anyway, so is further away boom mics in wide master shots, acceptable sometimes then?

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Note that movie was shot in the mid 1950s when there were no reliable wireless microphones.. And clearly nowhere close enough to bother with plant mics. The only other alternative would have been ADR, but it seems quite possible they left the dialog extremely "wet" in order to capture the large, reverberant space in which the scene takes place. You won't find 1 in 10000 feature films that has such distant dialog track. It would normally be considered unusable. Note when they switch to a close-up, the sound is correspondingly close and clean. (Because of proper mic location.)

I would refuse to work on a production where the DP decides microphone placement. If the DP has that responsibility, what do the need you for? That is just insane in my book.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Ryan -after reading all these posts about recording levels, just wondering out of curiosity ... what recorders do you have with a safety track?

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Yeah it's just on a couple of shoots before I would say where I need to place the boom mic to get the best sound possible, and the DP would jump in and say that I cannot do that cause it will interfere with the lighting they have planned, and the director would always give the DP final priority on that. One off the movies I worked on, I saw later, and the cinematography was actually pretty good, but the sound was not as a result.

As for wet dialog during the master shot, I find that during the master it's more acceptable cause everyone is further away in the master, so it's okay for the dialog to sound further away, especially if the actors are distance in a courtroom such as that. But I am wrong, on not minding wet dialog on a master? Of course you have to make sure that the master dialog stays on the master shots, and you cannot swap it with any of the close up shots of the characters speaking, but is wet dialog okay like that as long as it stays on the master?

Oh I have the FR2-LE, which doesn't have safety tracks unfortunately, so I just have to use one track when using that.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Doing a production is a TEAM EFFORT where all the departments are supposed to work cooperatively.
If the Producer and Director let the DP get away with that, I won't be working with them again.
Unless, of course, they are making a silent movie.

Strongly recommend reading the "Open Letter from your Sound Department"
An Open Letter from your Sound Department - A Production Sound Manifesto written by audio professionals

As well as:
sync.sound.cinema: The Ten Commandments of Sound for Picture! (Part One)
sync.sound.cinema: The Ten Commandments of Sound for Picture! (Part Two)

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Okay thanks, I will check those out!

I also like to see the storyboards cause I would like to get ideas for mic placement based on those, but the directors did not show me the storyboards, with one even saying the sound department does not get to go over storyboards. Is this common or no, and the director should do so for the sound department?

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

I thought you only used one mic? So you have a spare track you can set a different level on, so just split the input to the two XLRs and you have a hot channel and a safe one.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Okay thanks, but I was told before by others, not to do this, because using a splitter, cuts the signal in half and it's not good for the signal, cause you loose decibels this way, I was told. I was also told it's not good for the mic either to do this, so is using a splitter, a good idea therefore? Cause if I loose decibels, than I have to turn up the gain even higher then. I don't want to do anything that is bad for the mic if it is to, of course.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Not true. Microphone splitting is a widely used technique across all areas of professional audio.

Whomever you are getting advice from seem profoundly clueless about audio. Recommend staying away from them.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Ryan - you seriously have a bunch of advisors who seem to know very, very little about audio. I've been splitting audio for a very long time now. I have quite a few snakes - one has a three way 24ch transformer coupled split, I also have two others where the stage box end has a male and a female connector in parallel, with a further multicore out wired across them. Nowadays, I use a Behringer X32 and a Midas M32 both being fed from the Midas 32 channel stage box in digital. There is no difference I can hear between the lossless digital split and the passive splits. The physics says there is a loss. The practical upshot is that you simply never notice. On occasions, we've had one show with the passive splits feeding an OB truck, who de-rig and clear during the second show. They pulled out their cables and no gain adjustment was needed between the two shows.

If you cannot solder, buy a Y splitter, they cost nothing really - so a damn useful bit of kit for the tool box. The only rule with splitters is a simple one. Only ONE device supplies phantom, not two. However, it's easy to get wrong, and I've never had an issue with this. Audio folk do need a bit of physics/science, and your friends probably took an art class rather than science. It brings me back to the standard of education sadly. All those people who like to have a gain reduced safety track have to feed one mic to two inputs somehow? A splitter. My cameras for years have had a switch to feed the camera mic to one or both channels - it's just a link switch - another splitter.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

It doesn't harm the mic at all and you lose very little signal. XLR mic splits are a common way to record a music event or to send the signals to a mixer for the audience and a separate mixer for the band stage monitors. Sometimes a single mic (e.g. lead vocal) is split to two channels for separate processing for audience and stage. The worst case scenario is that occasionally a console will do unwanted things if it sees phantom power from another console, but that's rare. Another risk is ground loop when the two ends of the split are on different A/C power, but if you're just splitting into two channels on one device those problems won't happen.

I own a couple of 16-channel splitter snakes. I've never had a problem using them.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Given the somewhat difficult working conditions that has been presented it would be handy to have more options available, like a safety track for example. Sure, the discussion has turned to splitters but just want to give a plug for the safety track because I think it would be really handy.

Speaking of handy, how about another recorder? While everyone has their preference, this Tascam DR44-WL has worked very nicely for me. Has two stereo inputs, records safety tracks, and is easily controlled with a smartphone. As I write this, eBay currently has a used one for Buy-it-Now open box US$193.30 or new for $205 (free shipping).

[Edit: forgot to mention, it can be operated from a distance via a smartphone application (iPhone in this case). Works well it in combination with a plant mic. Operate Start/Stop, gain adjustment remotely]

With a second recorder one can record the plant mic, hook up a lavaliere, or what have you.

Can’t have too much kit!

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Oh okay thanks, but I don't think I would need a second recorder if I already have the splitter, but maybe. It depends on if I have another person to operate it or not, but if it's just me doing the sound mixing and the booming, I cannot operate another recorder successfully I don't think. I think I would need another person for that...

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

But arent you directing too? That’s going to be very tough (if not impossible) to split your attention and do both well. Sounded like you already had planned for a separate DP...I’d advise getting a separate sound guy as well. Then you wouldnt have to worry about any of this (other than that person’s competence)!

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Oh in the past, I was forced to do my own audio on my own projects, if shorthanded. I look for other production sound mixers/boom ops, but there do not seem to be near as many of them around compared to cinematographers it seems. The two guys I talked to who recorded music bands were possibly interested they said, but they were the ones who wanted to plant mics all around the room, and create surround sound while shooting.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Hmmm. That's quite the wrinkly pickle. I guess you're better off doing it yourself with proper technique than using folks who have no idea what they're talking about.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

I can hopefully find someone better. It's just most audio people prefer to use lavs as well, but they do not have enough for all the people I have, and I would rather just use the boom mics I have, rather than lavs, which have caused me problems in the past, but also do not have enough of usually. But it's hard to find someone who is good at booming, so I've done it since I've done it for other filmmakers before.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Let them record a production like that and make them edit/mix it down to a professional-sounding track. If they have any sense they will quickly see why that is a bad idea.

Plant mics were popular back in the 1930s when a microphone was the size (and weight) a bowling ball. There is no logical motivation for that kind of compromise here in the 21st century.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Yeah that's what I thought, the only time I saw a plant mic used was in the movie Singin' in the Rain, which was hidden inside an actual plant.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Having made a film with surround sound, I would do it all in post. You have so much control that it's a dream laying the sound; going back to the 1930s for mic techniques is not really the way to go. It's extremely limiting, I've done it once when shooting on a low budget one man band corporate video on health and all the action has to be pinned down.

Read Walter Murch and others on sound design. Trying to get good surround sound whilst shooting will eat into your shooting schedule,so get good clean mono dialogue sound tracks (use radio mics if needed) and a separate stereo atmos track for each location and do the rest later. The sound recordist can pick up many of the spot effects etc when you've left the location or elsewhere in the location on the day or during breaks, otherwise you'll have to stop rigging/ setting up/ rehearsing every time they want to record something. However, schedule time for them to do this and other foley work.

Building up all the effects etc is really a fun job and you can really enhance a production with an imaginative sound track..

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Have you ever done TV? You have a recorder on a strap around your neck, you have maybe a couple of its clipped on to the participants and maybe a boom to manage. Perversely possible. You don't have a hand on each control. You set the levels, then work the boom. You are NOT mixing, that's for later. You are just capturing sound, as cleanly as you can. The other day somebody was looking for a carrying solution for multiple receivers, the recorder and all the odds and ends. This is perfectly normal, everyday activity for audio people. You are making everything into a huge mountain, which is isn't. You just need proper planning.

I recently did a job where I had to do everything. There simply wasn't any budget for paying 3 cameras and one audio guy. The project was speculative. I had no idea if it would be viable. They wanted old fashioned DVDs as the end product. I recorded 9 audio tracks in the end, and five video cameras, two which were about 30m apart, so I was recording audio totally unattended, while I ran back and forth changing angles. Wore me out but with all the fixed cameras the result was ok. Could have been much better with proper cameramen of course, but for weeks nothing much happened then an order arrived after they saw the five minute clip I sent them. All the money is mine, nobody else to pay so turned out to be totally workable. Audio was no issue whatsoever set and forget. I perhaps guessed maximums a bit OTT, so clipping was never going to happen. Easy to mix and balance.

Ryan I think we are all trying to tell you that you need to stand back a step, review your past work, identify problem areas that were terminal and those that weren't, then use your experience and common sense, and stop letting audio idiots tell you how to do your job. Develop the knowing nod - where you appear to listen and contemplate, then reject the advice and do it your way.

Re: Should I be using multiple mics to record dialogue and sound effects?
 

Okay thanks. As for recording atmos sound, why do I need to record that in stereo? I've been recording it in mono before with no problems, but what's the reason to record it in stereo?

Before I just used a shotgun on mono and that was it. Any surround sound mixing was done after.

As for using lavs in addition to the boom, I didn't use lavs to save money, especially in scenes where there multiple actors, that would require quit a bit of lavs, so I just boomed from actor to actor only and went with that instead.