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#91 |
Inner Circle
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Apple Valley CA
Posts: 4,874
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The more I work with the camera, the better I like it overall, and I guess the most important comparison of stills would be against any other video cam out there... and in that respect this is "the best", at least for now!
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#92 |
Trustee
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York
Posts: 1,945
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Yeah Dave, if you had seen the stills I captured from my HF10 before I sold it, you'd realize how on the mark you are.
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#93 |
Regular Crew
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Miami, Fl
Posts: 40
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I don't know why my findings are different but in comparing the SR12 to the HF100 (I got both in a store that allows 5 days no restocking) the canon is a lot less noisy in low light when using cine mode at 60i. In these conditions, the 30i and 24p studder, and the motion is nowhere near as good. Maybe I am doing something wrong, but I don't think so. The SR12 does keep focus a little better. I will let you know more results I get them.
Regards, Mario Last edited by Mario Salazar; April 13th, 2008 at 08:47 PM. Reason: mistake |
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#94 |
Trustee
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York
Posts: 1,945
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Mario, I'm not sure what the Canon does in cinemode, but when I tried it I didn't care for the results (I only tried it outdoors, not under low light conditions). It really flattens out the contrast, even though IMO the HF10 contrast is too high at default. I also saw a loss of detail in cinemode, so it could be this loss of detail that's resulting in less noise in low light.
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#95 | |
Regular Crew
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Posts: 165
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Quote:
All of these cameras have similar pixel sizes (within 20-30% or so). Cameras differ in their processing, but you can't get around physics, so you either get an image with less noise but the low contrast detail has been removed, or an image with the noise passed through but where the noise is bigger than the low contrast detail anyway. I haven't been able to see one yet, but what the Canon might be doing in Cine mode, is modifying the exposure so that a dark scene actually looks dark on the video, as it was to your eyes. The scene will look dark, as it was in reality, but there will also be less amplification of noise. |
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#96 |
Regular Crew
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Miami, Fl
Posts: 40
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I have not tried Cine in day time yet. Will do so today and probably report back tuesday night (Finals are killing me). I will also review what I have shot. Dave you may be right. Ken you may also be right. There is still much to review. I wish I had more time to do so.
Until then... Regards, Mario |
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#97 | |
Tourist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 2
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Quote:
And here's one with cinemode in daylight (60i): http://vimeo.com/871449 Last edited by Luke Maguire; April 14th, 2008 at 04:56 PM. Reason: Forgot 2nd link to outdoor cinemode video |
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#98 | |
Regular Crew
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Posts: 165
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Quote:
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#99 | |
Trustee
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York
Posts: 1,945
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Quote:
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#100 |
Tourist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 2
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The effect is achieved using a progressive frame rate (and since the frame rate is lower you get better exposure). The cinemode makes sure the gain is not cranked up.
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#101 | |
Trustee
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York
Posts: 1,945
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Quote:
Hey Luc, did you move from Washington to Phoenix? ;) |
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#102 |
Regular Crew
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Miami, Fl
Posts: 40
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I must be in Bizzaro world because my finding seem to differ from what I have read and seen on other sites. I did some daytime trials. The photograph of either do not impress me, but that is not what I am using this for. The HF10 seems to IS a bit better to me, but its colors are all out of wack. It flattened greens and made my cherry hedge look like it had christmas lights instead of the little cherries, i.e. the reds where incredibly pronounced, unnaturally so.
The SR12 took more realistic video that looked like real life, the cannon not so much. A very flat look indeed in the green spectrum and the reds were HOT! I will try to turn the gain down on the sony and test it out if I have a chance. Unfortunately I don't know if the price difference justifies the sony. I got the HF100 for $668 at a B&M store around here. I could not believe it. The Sony SR12 was $1150!!!! I know I can get it cheaper elsewhere but I have credit at this place and I have until January to pay it off, so I think I will go to this place to make my purchase. I want to check out the HV30 to see how it compares. Next trial, trying to render this crap and watch it on my AMD64 3300 with 3 gigs of memory and a X1600pro. Wish me luck! ;-( Regards, Mario |
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#103 | |
Regular Crew
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Posts: 165
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Quote:
In bright lighting, the eye does compensate for different average illumination levels, but it also has a sense of absolute brightness at low levels of illumination and there is a point where a scene is dark enough that it actually *looks* dark to the eye. Most of the time, I like to capture that feeling in the image. Auto exposure systems in still cameras have the same issue - they try to make every scene 18% gray - I usually have to compensate the exposure in dark settings if I want the photo to have the feeling of the original dark scene. |
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#104 |
Inner Circle
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Apple Valley CA
Posts: 4,874
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Mario -
No surprise for me on the "hot" reds with Canon - I saw it with my HV20, and I've seen it more than once with Canon cameras. SR11 seems to have one of the best and most natural color balances around, even better than the 7 series, which was pretty faithful on colors that usually seem to get "altered". I almost always set AE shift a couple clicks to the minus side, although using the exposure function via the control wheel has been working well too. Zebras often show this to be needed for "best" exposure anyway. While this is somewhat limited manual control, you can get used to it and make it work well under most conditions. That's a nice price on the HF, but I'll bet you'll end up with the Sony <wink>. |
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#105 | |
Trustee
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: New York
Posts: 1,945
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Quote:
Edit: OK, I see you were talking about the image stabilization. As a sidenote, it's kind of weird there seems to be no way to delete a post. |
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