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-   -   Canon XH batteries / battery thread (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/canon-xh-series-hdv-camcorders/72441-canon-xh-batteries-battery-thread.html)

Scott Keyworth February 13th, 2007 01:31 PM

ElipZ 10K battery - specs
 
The ElipZ 10 K battery is a 10,500 Mah battery. The largest Canon battery is 5400 Mah.

The watt hours of each battery is: ah X nominal voltage (7.2)
ElipZ 10.5 X 7.2 = 75.6 wh
Canon 5.4 X 7.2 =38.88 wh

You can expect approximately 2x the runtime out of the ElipZ battery. Or you can power BOTH the AH1 and the 10w ElightZ on camera light for the same amount of time as the Canon battery.

Scott Keyworth
Anton/Bauer

Barry Gribble February 13th, 2007 01:50 PM

I just did a shoot this weekend with the Impact Canon BP-970 compatible, which I think is 7200 Mah I think. We ran a full 8.5 hour day with the cameras on most of the time, and recorded two full tapes and never had to switch batteries.

That said, the Elipz is a pretty tough sell for the bulk it adds. Certainly the difference may show up on a 12 hour day, I'm not sure.

Philip Hinkle February 16th, 2007 12:10 PM

Generic Battery removal...another fix
 
I got my A1s this week and already have a number of generic batteries from my GL2s that I hoped to use. 2 of the generics worked great and came out easily. I had 4 others that were a little sticky but not too bad but bad enough that I didn't want to use them except as a last resort.

Last night I lay awake unable to sleep and an idea hit me. Velcro!

There is room in the battery compartment when it is closed. I had some heavy duty stuff laying around. I put a little one inch piece on the back of one of my "sticky" batteries. Opened the door and grabbed it with the other side of the velcro....out slides the battery with no problem. Keep a little piece in your pocket and the batteries come out anytime with no problem....I guess I have a few extra batteries I can use now.

Just an idea....sometimes those night time ideas work out.

Chris Hurd February 16th, 2007 12:19 PM

An excellent tip -- thanks for sharing this, Philip!

Alastair Brown February 16th, 2007 02:53 PM

Yep...good idea!

If you put the opposing velcro on your lens cap, then it would double as a puller . And...if you put another spare bit somewhere, it would keep you lens cap safe as well.

Philip Hinkle February 16th, 2007 03:06 PM

Even better idea with the lens cap.

Ahhh.... velcro...is there anything it can't do?
:-)

Brian Brown February 16th, 2007 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Philip Hinkle
Ahhh.... velcro...is there anything it can't do?
:-)

Well, for the few things that Velcro can't do, duct tape and bailing wire will! ;-)

Alastair Brown February 16th, 2007 03:35 PM

Can you post images on here?

I think we should start a best lens cap velcro location competition!

Alastair Brown February 16th, 2007 03:37 PM

Hang on...I just think I won!

If you stuck another piece of velcro on one lens of your glasses, then the cap could pop on there ,and serve a dual purpose, doubling up as a sun shade!!!!!!


Go on....beat that!

Alastair Brown February 22nd, 2007 06:01 AM

I got a couple of Generic non OEM BP-945's off of E-Bay.

They are actually higher capacity than the old ones I first tried, but are physically smaller. The old ones totally filled the available cavity. The new ones leave a gap of approx 1cm at the top, and slide in and out without issues. They measure 71 X 38 X 58.00MM and are 7.2v and 6600mAh capacity.

Pascal Napo February 22nd, 2007 11:18 AM

Hi everyone,

Just bought the XHA1 (amazing camera, very pleased with it btw) after several years using the GL2 (XM2). Same thing here, I had a non canon 941 battery with it which did not fit my XHA1. I almost stick it and began to freak out ! The size is 2 millimeters lager than the battery compartment. Too bad it doesn't make it !


Pascal

Barry Richard February 22nd, 2007 11:42 AM

I have a generic 970 (power2000 I think) that I got on ebay for about $70

It completely fills the XHA1's battery well, yet slides in and out freely

(I'd heard about batteries becoming jammed before getting it, so I was concerned --- but its worked out.

I can only hope it still will be ok if the battery becomes hot and expands.

It would have been better if the XHA1 had used a rear external battery latch like Sony has, its a MUCH better and simpler design

Alan Craig February 25th, 2007 02:18 AM

oversize batteries
 
I have two non canon BP941 Batts that would not fit A1 . Got round the problem by carefully sanding down the two long sides top and the two radius's they now slide in and out perfectly. So if youv'e got the bottle its one solution. if you do try it be patient and sand the sides evenly.

Chris Hurd February 25th, 2007 02:27 AM

Thanks Alan... but those 941's are antiques, practically... do they still hold a charge for you?

Those go way back, to the original XL1 days. Welcome to DV Info Net,

Alan Craig March 4th, 2007 06:27 AM

Hello Chris I am glad to say that they do still hold a full charge and I like to get my money's worth out of anything I buy. I originally bougfht them for my XM2 I will of course be using new ones for my A1. The old ones are still good for backups setting camera up prior to event

Regards Alan

Jim Duggins March 21st, 2007 04:10 PM

Impact Batteries in the A1?
 
I'd read something about large non-Canon brand batteries sticking in the A1's battery compartment. There is a huge price difference between Impact ($129.99) and Canon BP-970 ($164.99) batteries at B&H.

Anybody have any experience with Impact batteries, specifically the larger-sized BP-970s in the A1?

Kevin Amundson March 21st, 2007 04:37 PM

I ordered a Impact 970 from B&H last week and when it arrived the plastic package it came in was already open and the battery was cracked! I couldn't believe it. I called B&H and they just told me to return it and they would ship me a new one, But please I paid full price for a new one and it's broken.

Scott Cantrell March 21st, 2007 05:10 PM

I am unsure of the Impact Batteries, but TapeWorks provides Lenmar batteries as an option other than the Canon. Check them out at http://www.lenmar.com/
I have customers that have purchased the LIC970G 7.4V 7200mAh
Lithium-Ion battery instead of the Canon BP970 and they mentioned that the Lenmar battery works just as good if not better than the Canon Version. And they purchased the Lenmar at a better price ($99.95 from TapeWorks)

Scott Cantrell
TapeWorks Texas Inc - HDVinfo Sponser
866-827-3489
scott@tapeworkstexas.com

Bill Busby March 21st, 2007 05:49 PM

I have the Lenmar LIC-941's & they're made just a tad too big & do get stuck. The easiest remedy though is to place some gaffer tape on the back & use enough to make yourself roughly a 1/2" pull tab. I'd amagine the LIC-970G's are the same. It takes maybe a second longer to extract it. Big deal :)

It's a goofy fix, but I'd rather the small inconvience than to pay a lot more for a Canon brand.

Bill

Jim Martin March 21st, 2007 06:20 PM

There are places to go cheap, and batteries and tape are not the ones. Be smart and spend the money on Canon batteries.

Jim Martin

Robert Garvey March 21st, 2007 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Duggins (Post 645735)
I'd read something about large non-Canon brand batteries sticking in the A1's battery compartment. There is a huge price difference between Impact ($129.99) and Canon BP-970 ($164.99) batteries at B&H.

Anybody have any experience with Impact batteries, specifically the larger-sized BP-970s in the A1?

I got two of the larger ones from B&H and boy they seem to last for ever!

I do not see any problem with the fit as reported by some others when using the larger batteries.

One bat. did arrive cracked but it is too much of a hassel for me returning from West Coast Australia. I super glued it up with no problems. Two of these cheaper high capacity batteries plus the camera original will give you days in the field away from power. I am not sure how many cycles they will last, but at the price...

Dan Wilder March 22nd, 2007 12:08 AM

I ordered one of the large Impact batteries with my camera. It just about fills the entire cavity in the A1 but slides in and pops out just like the stock Canon battery. We'll see how it lasts.

One thing the puzzles me a little is that the Canon battery that comes with the A1 has five contacts on it. The Impact battery only has two. So far it seems to work and charge the same but I'm curious what the other three contacts are for on the Canon battery. Anyone know?

-Dan

Bill Busby March 22nd, 2007 12:28 AM

I always thought that extra contacts on batteries like you mention are for diagnostics, such as capacity, more accurate time remaining, voltage, etc. But even though the A1 itself has these contacts in the battery compartment, there's no indication anywhere that they are implemented.

Bill

Dan Wilder March 22nd, 2007 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Busby (Post 645939)
I always thought that extra contacts on batteries like you mention are for diagnostics, such as capacity, more accurate time remaining, voltage, etc. But even though the A1 itself has these contacts in the battery compartment, there's no indication anywhere that they are implemented.

Thanks, Bill. I also thought they might be for a fast charger since the contact pads are larger. In any case, the battery works great. My impression so far is that the A1 does not go through batteries like my DVXs do. This battery and the stock Canon battery should be enough to cover most events I do. Time will tell as to how many charge cycles it will handle.

-Dan

Jeff Nelson March 24th, 2007 11:51 PM

Thanks for this thread, and for the message about the gaffer's tape. Just bought a Lenmark battery, used it tonight for the first time, it went in a little weird, and got stuck. Just got it out with the gaffer's tape, and am taking it back on Monday. I have the Canon battery and an Impact knockoff, which has worked fine since I got the camera. But I will not be getting another Lenmark battery...

Jim Duggins March 25th, 2007 12:23 AM

The Impact BP-970s work perfect for me and are $40 cheaper than the Canons at B&H.

James R. Leong March 25th, 2007 02:59 AM

For tight batteries, get some ScotchBrite, not the cheaper dollar store stuff and lightly sand down the housing until it slides in more smoothly. It's smoother than sandpaper.

Leila Alkadi March 25th, 2007 09:14 PM

original Canon battery died after just 2 months of use, will Canon replace it?
 
The original Canon battery that came with my XH A1
died after just 2 months of use, will Canon replace it?
I probably only used it 4 or 5 times, as the back-up
to the other two large batteries that I have... It won't
charge, and my voltmeter indicated 0.0v... which is
kind of odd. (the other big batteries all showed the
proper amount of voltage)

I'm asking becasue I can still remember a couple of years
when Canon refused to replace my old GL-2's battery.
(but it was already 1 year and 1 month after purchase)

Just wondering if I should bother at all...

Thanks!

Chris Hurd March 25th, 2007 09:33 PM

It seems like you're having poor luck with Canon lately... you're the one who returned an HV20 after only an hour of using it. Nevertheless, the warranty on the battery is the same as the camcorder... twelve months... so they should replace it. There's only one way to find out, and that's by contacting Canon USA directly, at 1-800-OK-CANON.

Since you're in the best position to answer your own question, perhaps you can report back and tell us what you find out. Good luck,

Erik Norgaard March 26th, 2007 12:13 PM

Actual battery lifetime BP-950/970
 
Hi:

I have searched the forum, the question has been asked, but no one seems to have monitored the battery lifetime. The only numbers are Canon's official claim of 5 and 7 hours for the BP-950 and 970 respectively.

On a normal day, how long can you go without a recharge?

I know, that on a normal day, you likely do not shoot continuously, depending on the project, it may be more interesting: How much footage do you get on a full battery.

Thanks, Erik

Alex Leith March 26th, 2007 02:49 PM

I have a (non-canon) 6600 mAh battery, and I can get a good 5 to 6 hours continuous filming out of it. (6 tapes)

Josh Green March 26th, 2007 02:52 PM

My BP970
 
I had a BP970 in my Canon XhA1 last weekend and I got more than 8 hours out of it. I couldn't believe it!

Gert Kracht March 26th, 2007 05:41 PM

I have a A1 for almost a month now. Yesterday i made recordings at the first Dutch Podcast Event. Three tapes filled in almost 4 hours and after that I did some filming in the neighbourhood of Amsterdam and Schiphol airport. After that i played a full tape before the camera said: 'Hey, this battery is almost empty. Please exhange'. Around 5 hours was the total amount of time.

I want to buy a 970, expecting to use it a whole day. Somewhere in June we leave for London to do some recordings at a concert on the 'Battersea Barge' and with any luck (they are hard to get over here) I will have it. Otherwise I'm going to get another 950.

I'm very well pleased with the 'user time' of the battery's.

One tip: I try to use them as long as I can. I charge them on the original device from Canon and use it until it's almost empty. With Lithium Ion there is a simple rule: You can recharge them for xxx times. (xxx=?). Every time you recharge the battery is ONE. So if you recharge it, when it's at 50%, that still counts as 1 complete charge.
I read that xxx is about 300-400 times. But that amount was not meant for the Canon battery.

I have used the Lithium-Ion battery's of my Sony camera for almost 7 years now and they still run a looooong time. I realy hope the new ones do too.

Succes,

Gert

Erik Norgaard March 27th, 2007 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gert Kracht (Post 649011)
One tip: I try to use them as long as I can. I charge them on the original device from Canon and use it until it's almost empty. With Lithium Ion there is a simple rule: You can recharge them for xxx times. (xxx=?). Every time you recharge the battery is ONE. So if you recharge it, when it's at 50%, that still counts as 1 complete charge.
I read that xxx is about 300-400 times. But that amount was not meant for the Canon battery.

I have used the Lithium-Ion battery's of my Sony camera for almost 7 years now and they still run a looooong time. I realy hope the new ones do too.

Thanks, so it seems that Canon's promises are in actual working conditions, about 1 working hour pr 1000mAh of battery.

Regarding recharging: The old NiCa rechargeable battereries had memory, you had to charge it completely first time or they would never reach 100%, and they have a memory effect which meant that you have to discharge the battery completely before recharging to maintain maximum capacity.

With Lithium-Ion batteries this is different. You can fastcharge the battery to 80-85% of capacity, but the remaining must be slowcharged to avoid overheating. Lithium-Ion does not suffer a memory effect meaning you do not have to discharge the battery completely before recharge, nor do you have to charge it completely before use. They will very slowly degrade to about 80% of original capacity, then capacity will drop rapidly.

I found this link on Lithium-Ion battery care (see tips at bottom):

http://www.batteryuniversity.com/parttwo-34.htm

See also Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_ion_battery

What is interesting is that Li-Ion batteries age from the time of manufacture, not just from number of charges. To avoid this loss, it is recommended to store batteries at 0C/32F at 40% charge.

For this reason, these pages recommend that you do not get a second battery unless you really need it. If you need to shoot 10hs a day and cannot get a recharge, get a second battery, else recharge when possible.

Cheers, Erik

Don Palomaki March 27th, 2007 04:07 AM

Quote:

The old NiCa rechargeable battereries had memory, you had to charge it completely first time or they would never reach 100%, and they have a memory effect which meant that you have to discharge the battery completely before recharging to maintain maximum capacity.
More specifically, the battery cells may may suffer a ~10% voltage drop at the "memory point", and this may be enough to fool voltage sensitive things, like a camcorder, to think the battery is discharged, signal same, and shut down. The charge is in the battery, you just can't get it with voltage sensitive devices. (Note that the battery reconditioner can get it out because it uses a lower voltage cut-off point.) The reson for the voltage drop is reported to be a chemical phase change in one of the components in the cell. In typical camcorder batteries, this effect maybe induced by over charging (e.g., leaving the battery on trickle charge afte it has reached full charge).

Deep cycling tends to cure it because it consumes the phase-changed chemical and on the subsequent recharge it returns to the higher voltage phase.

Erik Norgaard March 27th, 2007 04:56 AM

I get a bit confused here because you quote my part regarding NiCa batteries. I mentioned NiCa merely because recommendations for these batteries are often repeated for Li-Ion, but these do not apply. If your comment regards NiCa batteries, then this is not relevant for camcorders since these use Li-Ion batteries. Could you please clarify?

Some sources did recommend deep cycling once every 30 charges for batteries that are frequently charged. As I understand, this does not change the capacity of the battery but rather the reported capacity, such that you don't experience batteries run out prematurely. Is this the effect you refer to?

Cheers, Erik

Eric Weiss March 27th, 2007 10:37 AM

in my experience, canon batts live longer and last longer than the cheaper brands.

Clemente Gauer March 29th, 2007 12:30 PM

There is a very good article about LI-Ion batteries at Apple's website:

Check it out:

http://www.apple.com/batteries/

Greetings

Gauer

Eric Weiss April 2nd, 2007 09:44 AM

I have a lot of BP-945's.
Anyone using these with the A1?

How long do you think a BP-970 will run an XL1-S?

As stated above. It's always best to stick with Canon batts.
They run longer and last longer.

Russ Speiser April 2nd, 2007 10:50 AM

Just used an A1 with the 950 battery on saturday for a shoot that started at 2:30pm and stopped 11 hours later (obviously not continuous shooting). Used one battery, went through at least 4-5 tapes (I wasn't in charge of tapes). Near the end, I started putting it to standby to save battery life.

Russ


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