XH Upgrade Wishlist Poll v1

James Hooey · February 24th, 2007, 02:54 PM

I was a little concerned that the A1 does not allow any sort of manual focusing while simultaneously zooming. It's funny though because assuming all the manual dials are servo mechanisms the A1 will zoom and change it's aperture simultaneously so why not zoom and focus?

That would be a feature to add in my opinion.

Daniel Epstein · February 25th, 2007, 10:17 AM

This is a feature the XLH1 is afflicted with as well. Someone in the Canon
Organization let this design flaw go by and it keeps popping up. Apparently they have only one mechanisim to control zoom and focus and when one is trying to use manual focus you are not actually adjusting the lens but the mechanism is. When you are zooming it is already busy so you can't focus and vice versa.

Chris Hurd · February 25th, 2007, 10:40 AM

All digital video camcorders using auto-servo lenses work like this. It's not a Canon thing.

The only manufacturer that lets you zoom and focus at the same time is Panasonic, and only on a couple of models.

Daniel Epstein · February 25th, 2007, 11:00 AM

Well Hooray for Panasonic since they have figured out how to make Auto Focus and Manual focus work on the same lens. As far as I can tell there are only four manufacturers in this part of the market. Sony, JVC, Panasonic and Canon.
Canon had more than a few years to see what Panasonic did with similarly priced cameras and dropped the ball. I don't know of any video/ filmmaker who would want the Canon Focus Zoom lens design compared to the Panasonic one in this instance.
It doesn't mean the overall package is bad but it is one of the least professional aspects of the Canon cameras.

Mike Teutsch · February 25th, 2007, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel Epstein

Well Hooray for Panasonic since they have figured out how to make Auto Focus and Manual focus work on the same lens. As far as I can tell there are only four manufacturers in this part of the market. Sony, JVC, Panasonic and Canon.
Canon had more than a few years to see what Panasonic did with similarly priced cameras and dropped the ball. I don't know of any video/ filmmaker who would want the Canon Focus Zoom lens design compared to the Panasonic one in this instance.
It doesn't mean the overall package is bad but it is one of the least professional aspects of the Canon cameras.

It's not about figuring out how to do it, it is a matter of cost, size and weight. Besides most pros would not be trying to zoom and focus simultaneously. I think even with a separate motor for both, that any camera would have a difficult time using its autofocus while zooming, except maybe while on a tripod and rock steady. Would that be correct Chris?

With the lens adjusted correctly, you would stay in focus while zooming anyway.

Mike

Alex Leith · February 25th, 2007, 12:03 PM

Catagorically, the Sony FX1 and Z1 CAN zoom and focus at the same time.

Canon A1 will autofocus and zoom at the same time, but no manual focus and zoom.

There are two types of shots where simultanious zoom & focus is needed - dolly zooms (the "vertigo" effect); and the travel show standard - a zoom pull focus from a scenic background to a foreground presenter.

James Hooey · February 25th, 2007, 06:36 PM

ding! ding! ding! zoom/pull focus...my original concern all along about the focusing issue. As for being able to autofocus while zooming I think it's not what you may think.... I have tried very slow zooms with autofocus engaged and it does not seem to update focus until after the zoom has stopped.

I'm certainly not suggesting that this shortcoming will come up often....these shots are not often used but still....it's like.....come on?

So if a firmware were to allow this to happen THAT would top my list for updates. Then everything else....

Daniel Epstein · February 25th, 2007, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Leith

Catagorically, the Sony FX1 and Z1 CAN zoom and focus at the same time.

Canon A1 will autofocus and zoom at the same time, but no manual focus and zoom.

So does that leave Canon as the only manufacturer at this level which doesn't allow you to manually focus and zoom at the same time?

As for when this is useful try shooting a live event where you are constantly following action and reframing.

Pavel Sedlak · February 26th, 2007, 11:02 AM

you can try give option "LCD color and VCF without color together" :-) , thanks.

Glen Elliott · February 26th, 2007, 10:01 PM

Wow Chris where's the "all of the above". Some of these things I didn't even know the camera couldn't do in it's current state. I'm still trying to learn it.

It's my first Canon camera since I started out in video. I switched early on from a GL-1/XL-1s combo for a VX2100/PD170 combo for low light performance (weddings).

So far I'm very impressed with the A1 so far.

Tomas Chinchilla · March 7th, 2007, 11:29 AM

Ok, so these conversations are good, but let's get back to the question at hand:

IS CANON COMMING OUT WITH A FIRMWARE UPDATE OR NOT?

Daniel Browning · March 9th, 2007, 01:14 PM

I would like the option of four separate histograms (R, G, B, and luminance) or one combined. And the option of large or small.

Robert Garvey · March 19th, 2007, 07:34 PM

I would like to be able to select the Custom Preset 'by name' in the menu and activate it at that point, rather then having to remember what number it was assigned to and then use the silly buttons on the side.

Piotr Wozniacki · March 20th, 2007, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Garvey

I would like to be able to select the Custom Preset 'by name' in the menu and activate it at that point, rather then having to remember what number it was assigned to and then use the silly buttons on the side.

Or better still - have just one button (assigning something more important to the other), and be able to cycle with it through all presets including OFF and displaying their names (not just numbers) on the LCD/VF.

Chris Hurd · March 22nd, 2007, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Garvey

I would like to be able to select the Custom Preset 'by name' in the menu and activate it at that point, rather then having to remember what number it was assigned to and then use the silly buttons on the side.

That's why we offered "Display active C. Preset name (record and playback)" as one of the poll options, but really I don't think activating a preset should be buried in the menu. The last thing I want to do when calling up a preset is to open the menu and dig for it. The buttons on the side make much more sense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piotr Wozniacki

Or better still - have just one button (assigning something more important to the other), and be able to cycle with it through all presets including OFF and displaying their names (not just numbers) on the LCD/VF.

No, you really do need two buttons; one to cycle and one for on / off. If I want to turn on a preset, or turn it off, I want a dedicated button for that. I don't want to cycle through a bunch of presets just to find the "off" setting. The way it's set up right now makes sense, with the exception of the blinking "CP Off" for a few seconds, which takes some getting used to. Even better is the ability of the Custom Key #2 to works as a "CP Backward" button. That three-button combination is very easy to work with: scroll backward, on / off, scroll forward.

View Poll Results: Which four (4) features should be added to the XH series camcorders?
OIS On / Off mappable to Custom Key	118	51.75%
XLR On / Off mappable to Custom Key	61	26.75%
Default Shutter speed in 25F of 1/50th	24	10.53%
Additional Shutter speeds (1/33rd and/or 1/40th)	21	9.21%
Option to display Shutter values in degrees	3	1.32%
Preset maximum Gain value for AGC	48	21.05%
Add intermediate steps in Gain (+9db, +15db)	46	20.18%
F. Asst. Mag. on displays / analog out during Rec.	26	11.40%
Allow Peaking and Zebra together	95	41.67%
Customize Peaking color and intensity	35	15.35%
Flip image in viewfinders (and maybe to tape, outputs)	63	27.63%
Move AE Shift function from menu to iris ring	26	11.40%
Histogram On / Off for Video (record and playback)	49	21.49%
Display active C. Preset name (record and playback)	55	24.12%
Display lens info (focus and zoom) on playback	18	7.89%
Display remaining battery time in real minutes	72	31.58%
Function setting for Long Push of "End Play" button	2	0.88%
Soft clipping / limiter in Manual Audio mode	63	27.63%
Allow digital zoom in Standard Definition recording	5	2.19%
Option: AF off during zoom (prevent focus pulsing)	59	25.88%
Photo buttons as optional Custom Keys	16	7.02%
Slower speeds for Focus Position preset transitions	44	19.30%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 228. You may not vote on this poll

February 24th, 2007, 02:54 PM	#61
James Hooey Major Player Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Bruce Pennisula, Canada Posts: 316	manual focus while zooming I was a little concerned that the A1 does not allow any sort of manual focusing while simultaneously zooming. It's funny though because assuming all the manual dials are servo mechanisms the A1 will zoom and change it's aperture simultaneously so why not zoom and focus? That would be a feature to add in my opinion.

February 25th, 2007, 10:40 AM	#63
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	All digital video camcorders using auto-servo lenses work like this. It's not a Canon thing. The only manufacturer that lets you zoom and focus at the same time is Panasonic, and only on a couple of models. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

February 25th, 2007, 12:03 PM	#66
Alex Leith Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Northampton, England Posts: 500	Catagorically, the Sony FX1 and Z1 CAN zoom and focus at the same time. Canon A1 will autofocus and zoom at the same time, but no manual focus and zoom. There are two types of shots where simultanious zoom & focus is needed - dolly zooms (the "vertigo" effect); and the travel show standard - a zoom pull focus from a scenic background to a foreground presenter. __________________ Alex

February 26th, 2007, 11:02 AM	#69
Pavel Sedlak Major Player Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Prague Czech Republic Posts: 263	another one ... you can try give option "LCD color and VCF without color together" :-) , thanks.

February 25th, 2007, 10:17 AM	#62
Daniel Epstein Trustee Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,267	This is a feature the XLH1 is afflicted with as well. Someone in the Canon Organization let this design flaw go by and it keeps popping up. Apparently they have only one mechanisim to control zoom and focus and when one is trying to use manual focus you are not actually adjusting the lens but the mechanism is. When you are zooming it is already busy so you can't focus and vice versa.

February 25th, 2007, 11:00 AM	#64
Daniel Epstein Trustee Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 1,267	Well Hooray for Panasonic since they have figured out how to make Auto Focus and Manual focus work on the same lens. As far as I can tell there are only four manufacturers in this part of the market. Sony, JVC, Panasonic and Canon. Canon had more than a few years to see what Panasonic did with similarly priced cameras and dropped the ball. I don't know of any video/ filmmaker who would want the Canon Focus Zoom lens design compared to the Panasonic one in this instance. It doesn't mean the overall package is bad but it is one of the least professional aspects of the Canon cameras.

February 25th, 2007, 06:36 PM	#67
James Hooey Major Player Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Bruce Pennisula, Canada Posts: 316	ding! ding! ding! zoom/pull focus...my original concern all along about the focusing issue. As for being able to autofocus while zooming I think it's not what you may think.... I have tried very slow zooms with autofocus engaged and it does not seem to update focus until after the zoom has stopped. I'm certainly not suggesting that this shortcoming will come up often....these shots are not often used but still....it's like.....come on? So if a firmware were to allow this to happen THAT would top my list for updates. Then everything else....

February 26th, 2007, 10:01 PM	#70
Glen Elliott Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 2,898	Wow Chris where's the "all of the above". Some of these things I didn't even know the camera couldn't do in it's current state. I'm still trying to learn it. It's my first Canon camera since I started out in video. I switched early on from a GL-1/XL-1s combo for a VX2100/PD170 combo for low light performance (weddings). So far I'm very impressed with the A1 so far. __________________ Glen Elliott Cord 3 Films

March 7th, 2007, 11:29 AM	#71
Tomas Chinchilla Major Player Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 212 Images: 8	Ok, so these conversations are good, but let's get back to the question at hand: IS CANON COMMING OUT WITH A FIRMWARE UPDATE OR NOT? __________________ Tomas A. Chinchilla \| CANON XH A1, HV20 & HC3 \| Retired Cams: GL2, HC1, FX1, Z1, \| Final Cut Studio 2

March 9th, 2007, 01:14 PM	#72
Daniel Browning Major Player Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 949	Histogram I would like the option of four separate histograms (R, G, B, and luminance) or one combined. And the option of large or small.

March 19th, 2007, 07:34 PM	#73
Robert Garvey Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Western Australia Posts: 100	I would like to be able to select the Custom Preset 'by name' in the menu and activate it at that point, rather then having to remember what number it was assigned to and then use the silly buttons on the side. __________________ Robert Garvey Photographer www.garvey.com.au