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June 25th, 2012, 04:19 AM | #31 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
True! Don't get me started on the BMC! :)
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July 13th, 2012, 03:10 PM | #32 | |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
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July 13th, 2012, 05:45 PM | #33 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
Shoulder cameras are not as flexible and have much smaller markets, fewer people buying means higher price. Just build out the FS700 into a shoulder cam if you want that.
There is a great shoulder camera, its called Alexa. If you want prosumer prices you need form factors that work for the prosumer market. Personally I've been happy with the FS100 form factor, I found very comfortable ways to hold it for handheld and then I can also hold it out around me and at my hip which is a great flexibility to have for getting new angles quickly. I shot a performance the other day where there was no space but i was able to reach my camera into all kinds of places whereas a shouldercam would have been stuck with one shot at one height and wouldve knocked people over if I moved too much. |
July 14th, 2012, 06:38 AM | #34 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
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July 14th, 2012, 09:17 AM | #35 | |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
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So I can understand the frustration that Mike (OP) feels (the top mounted viewfinder has to go) - I just can't understand why he ordered one in the first place - because all those negatives are spelt out in a bunch of different reviews. You buy in spite of those things and adapt. To get as far as ordering one and not even taking it out of the shop and trying it in the field...is puzzling. We've all heard of buyer's remorse - I hope Mike doesn't end up with buyer's envy... Last edited by John Mitchell; July 14th, 2012 at 09:17 AM. Reason: double quote |
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July 14th, 2012, 09:23 AM | #36 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
LOL I encurage everyone, who is unhappy with the 700 to shoot with a real 35mm film camera and ISO400 film for a week. After that you sure gonna love everything on the FS700.
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July 14th, 2012, 10:55 AM | #37 | |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
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The online tests I had read seemed to focus very much on the (impressive) technical aspects rather than the (less impressive) ergonomics.
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July 14th, 2012, 11:52 AM | #38 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
Hope so. Apparently the manufacturers do not realize how strong the demand would be for such a camera. I know many DP's who would jump at the chance to buy a large sensor camera housed in a true ENG body (in that sub 20K price range)...especially doc shooters and people who have used Arri SR3's, XD cams, etc. Hell, Arri should seize the opportunity and make a lower tiered version of the Alexa and mop the floor with Red, Sony, Canon et al. I would be there in a second.
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July 14th, 2012, 12:06 PM | #39 |
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Hypercam 35...
Furthermore, I don't think anyone would go to these lengths...
...without a real demand for a large sensor / ENG ergonomic :) |
July 14th, 2012, 12:36 PM | #40 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
Let me start by saying that I don't think the FS700's ergonomics are good. However, after spending last weekend doing a mixed tripod/handheld, run and gun shoot I have found it to be quite useable even without any extra add-ons. Yes the hand grip is a way off to one side, so the camera will want to sag to the left. But then I never hand hold a camera with just one hand because I get better stability holding it with both hands. Interestingly I found that having my hands wider apart made the camera more stable and less prone to roll. My biggest gripe is the way the viewfinder swivels when you place any pressure on the monocular. On a tripod the viewfinder tilts down just enough so that I can shoot at more or less eye height, it's not ideal but it's not terrible. For high shots I simply used the camera upside down. While the kit lens isn't one I'm fond of, I did find that it performed really rather well in run and gun. I made good use of the one push autofocus and iris just to get a quick exposure and focus starting point. For some of the slow mo walking shots of pilots walking unto the camera I even used the face tracking AF, which did a better job of pulling focus than me! Is it perfect, no it is not, but I did find the overall package quite effective for run and gun compared to my F3 which did surprise me. Like many my primary reason for the purchase is the Super Slow Mo, but I actually found the kit to be closest thing to an EX1 for R&G that I have come across so far.
Like Matt I'm working on a rig for mine. I'm trying to develop a shoulder mount that incorporates a shoulder pad, Sony VCT quick release mounts front and rear 15mm rails and a viewfinder bracket. I hate using noga arms for viewfinders as these always sag and then you get sloppy horizontals. With the right rig I think the FS700 will become my go to camera for R&G. The F3 will still be the camera of choice where quality is paramount, but the FS700 IQ is remarkably close to the F3. Don't forget if you do want a 20x zoom on the FS700 you can always use the MTF B4 to E mount adapter kit to stick a traditional 2/3" ENG zoom on it. If anyone wants to know what the quality of the adapter is take a look at the Duran Duran "A Diamond in the Mind" BluRay or youtube clips. The head shots of the lead singer were shot using one of the adapters on an F3 with a 44x Fujinon lens about 200ft from the stage.
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July 14th, 2012, 12:45 PM | #41 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
Building an ENG style camera body with and S35 imager for that price range isn't the biggest issue. Making a complete package in that price range will be and issue for sure. How much would you be willing to pay for a fully usable kit?
Lets say that camera exists today and consider the potential costs. Camera body (based on mid level 2/3" ENG cameras, under $20k isn't likely) - $27k Servo S35 lens such as the upcoming Fujinon 19-90 T2.9 Zoom Lens - $40k HD viewfinder - $8k Add the bits such as batteries and other misc stuff to round it out and you will be sitting at a solid $85k. So with a camera kit in this price range the market is going to be narrow. It won't appeal to the filmmakers that have embraced the smaller and or modular style cameras of late. Not to mention the S35 cameras have better performance in many areas over 1/2 or 2/3" imager gear. That could lead to erosion of other established product lines. It will have a market but will it have one that is sustainable and one that doesn't cause issues with established ENG equipment lines? I don't see a huge up side here for the vendors. At least not the conventional vendors.
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July 14th, 2012, 02:29 PM | #42 | |||
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
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I don’t think it’s such a stretch to suggest that a manufacturer like Sony could build a decent ENG body around their existing Exmor sensor to retail for around 15K, with another 5K for a good HD EVF. Plus, with an ENG form factor as a starting point, you are automatically saving thousands on the economic juggernaut of overpriced 3rd party accessories that are needed just to get these palmcorders, still cameras and plastic bricks to the point of being usable in a real-world ENG scenario. Quote:
Nearly all the shooters I know lament the ergonomic limitations of their 5D’s, FS100’s and the like. But we have no choice, because producers are demanding the look of these cameras more and more, and then the job of the DP becomes twice as difficult because of the non-professional form factor. It doesn’t have to be that way…or does it? Quote:
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July 15th, 2012, 02:47 PM | #43 | ||
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
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July 15th, 2012, 03:01 PM | #44 |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
I hope they do that! I think the 320 also has an improved DSP over the EX3 which the FS700 would also benefit from if it could provide a 10 bit output. Sony have already used that camera body design for 3 very successful cameras - PMW 320, 350 and 500.
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July 15th, 2012, 04:59 PM | #45 | |
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Re: Not happy with FS700 ergonomics
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I tried almost everything from (realtive) cheap Indian stuff to Zacuto and I'm most happy with my Tilta setup. Frank |
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