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-   Sony XDCAM EX Pro Handhelds (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-pro-handhelds/)
-   -   SDHC substitute for SxS cards (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/sony-xdcam-ex-pro-handhelds/130757-sdhc-substitute-sxs-cards.html)

Matthew Hurley December 16th, 2008 09:39 AM

Workable?
 
Has anyone tested this card?

Micro Center - Signature 16GB SDHC Class 6 Flash Card

Steven Thomas December 16th, 2008 09:40 AM

Yes I have..
The card is to slow. It had media restore errors.
But, for the life of me, I can't remember if I was using the AFT which I determined
gave the media restore errors.
So it may work? But, I doubt it will overcrank anywhere near 40FPS. This means it would have
to sustain datarates near 8.5MB/s.

The safe bet is to stick with the Ultra II 15MB/s cards for a bit more $$.
It's safer to stick with the SDHC cards that have the headroom to allow some overcrank; otherwise,
you could be "hanging on the edge" of the card working in HQ mode.

See:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/933609-post88.html

Brian Rhodes December 16th, 2008 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew Hurley (Post 979073)

I have tested this card stick with the Trandsend or SanDisk Trandsend cards are about the same price.

Newegg.com - Transcend 16GB Secure Digital High-Capacity (SDHC) Flash Card w/Compact Card Reader S5 Model TS16GSDHC6- S5W - Flash Memory

Steven Thomas December 16th, 2008 10:38 AM

Brian, what does this imply?

Does it work with the Kensington?
If so, what's the highest it can overcrank at 24P?

Brian Rhodes December 16th, 2008 04:05 PM

I got a change media error I return the card to Fry's.

Alexander Kubalsky December 17th, 2008 03:46 AM

Can anyone tell me the difference between the Sandisk ultra II 15/mbs 16GB Class 2
and the similar Class 4 version? The Class 4 one is all I can find in Tokyo.

Alex

Steven Thomas December 17th, 2008 06:33 AM

Never heard of a Ultra II 15MB/s Class 2.
Please point us to it.

Alexander Kubalsky December 17th, 2008 08:12 AM

You mean Class 4 is the one you havent heard of right?
The Sandisk card mentioned at the top of this page are Class 2. The C mark with a 2 in the centre and available from BH for around $45US. The ones Im finding in Akihabara Tokyo are Class 4 and about double the price.

There are also 30mb/s and 40mb/s cards out here. Has anyone tried these more expensive cards? Would they be suited for overcrank? A 40mb/s 16GB goes for around $250US.

Alex

Steven Thomas December 17th, 2008 08:48 AM

No, I meant what I wrote.

I've never heard of the Ultra II 15MB/s class 2. I've only seen (and own) the class 4.

Perrone Ford December 17th, 2008 08:58 AM

Yep, same here. 2 16gb class 4 cards for me.

Erik Phairas December 17th, 2008 08:07 PM

I have continued to test the Ultra IIs at 720x30p with 60fps overcranking without a single failure... just for the record. Real world testing, not unrealistic stuff like filling a card with slo mo for no reason.

Steven Thomas December 17th, 2008 10:31 PM

Yes, you can overcrank 30P at 60FPS, not 24P.

Erik Phairas December 17th, 2008 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Thomas (Post 980091)
Yes, you can overcrank 30P at 60FPS, not 24P.

I just think that is awesome though. Sorry to keep bringing it up but it basically means I will never need a SxS card as I don't like shooting in 24p. :)

Alexander Kubalsky December 18th, 2008 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Thomas (Post 979676)
I've never heard of the Ultra II 15MB/s class 2. I've only seen (and own) the class 4.

I see. Thanks guys. picked up the Class 4 Ultra II yesterday and works fine. Its so awesome to have this cheap alternative now!

Dean Harrington December 19th, 2008 02:49 AM

Alex ...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander Kubalsky (Post 980672)
I see. Thanks guys. picked up the Class 4 Ultra II yesterday and works fine. Its so awesome to have this cheap alternative now!

Where are you picking them up?

Alexander Kubalsky December 19th, 2008 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean Harrington (Post 980724)
Where are you picking them up?


A small shop on the main street in Akihabara. 9000yen which is about $90US. Maybe I could get them cheaper if I order online but needed it now.

Giroud Francois December 19th, 2008 07:53 AM

the 16 gig ultra II sells here for about $40

Craig Seeman December 19th, 2008 08:23 PM

I finally seeing placed taking preorders on the Sandisk Ultra II 32GB. It looks to be about $150-$160 depending the dealer. These seem to be legit dealers but I'm not sure if the DVInfo sponsors are taking orders yet.

Michael Palmer December 24th, 2008 05:51 PM

MxR/SDHC
 
I just received my MrX readers and I am happy to say they work as expected with 16 gig Transcend class 6 SDHC cards. This is awesome.

Michael Palmer

Craig Seeman December 24th, 2008 07:22 PM

Did you pay for the expedited shipping?
I ordered airmail (slower method) since I'm still waiting for Sony Teaneck to tackle the camera. It seems the circuit board for the battery drain issue was on back order. They'll have it Friday (3 weeks after I brought in the camera!). I expected that so I didn't have a rush for the camera.

I'm looking to hear more reports on the Sandisk 32GB.

Tip 'o the xmas grog to Ross!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Palmer (Post 983571)
I just received my MrX readers and I am happy to say they work as expected with 16 gig Transcend class 6 SDHC cards. This is awesome.

Michael Palmer


Michael Palmer December 25th, 2008 02:59 PM

Yes, I paid for the extra fast shipping. I must report that 5 of the 6 MxR's are very tight and slipping the SDHC card into it has a lot of drag, and 4 of the 6 don't reject the card all the way and they need a little help. I also had 1 MxR allow me to remove the SDHC card while in the camera.


So the EX1 needs a new battery board to fix the drain issue? I wonder what Sony will say about my firmware update if bring my Ex1 in for this battery issue.

Michael Palmer

Michael Palmer December 25th, 2008 03:08 PM

I know I don't post here much but when does the New Boot title change and to what?

Mark Krichever December 25th, 2008 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Palmer (Post 983800)
Yes, I paid for the extra fast shipping. I must report that 5 of the 6 MxR's are very tight and slipping the SDHC card into it has a lot of drag, and 4 of the 6 don't reject the card all the way and they need a little help. I also had 1 MxR allow me to remove the SDHC card while in the camera.


So the EX1 needs a new battery board to fix the drain issue? I wonder what Sony will say about my firmware update if bring my Ex1 in for this battery issue.

Michael Palmer

Would you, please describe in details how does it manifest itself this battery discharge issue. For any battery self-discharge is normal. The question I have what is your observation on rate of battery discharge (%%charge vs. time) being inserted into EX1 vs. released from camera battery?

Ross Herewini December 25th, 2008 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Krichever (Post 983809)
Would you, please describe in details how does it manifest itself this battery discharge issue. For any battery self-discharge is normal. The question I have what is your observation on rate of battery discharge (%%charge vs. time) being inserted into EX1 vs. released from camera battery?

Hi Mark,

The battery discharge problem was from the earlier EX1, where if you left BPU-60 attached to the battery it would be almost completely drained by the next morning from a full charge.

Sony replaced the board on my camera and problem fixed. It was done under warranty.

Mark Krichever December 25th, 2008 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ross Herewini (Post 983816)
Hi Mark,

The battery discharge problem was from the earlier EX1, where if you left BPU-60 attached to the battery it would be almost completely drained by the next morning from a full charge.

Sony replaced the board on my camera and problem fixed. It was done under warranty.

Thanks Ross, I will check my camera, because I have a habit to remove battery after shooting.

Michael Palmer December 25th, 2008 03:33 PM

The only thing I could tell you is that I found a fully charged large battery would be drained down to zero in about 30 hours or less. I don't have a clue as to why this happens, I just found out the hard way and helped spread the word last year when I started working with my EX1 last December.

Brooks Graham December 25th, 2008 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Palmer (Post 983807)
I know I don't post here much but when does the New Boot title change and to what?

Evidence indicates that it's at 25 posts. ;-)

I'm working hard to get there myself.

Mark Krichever December 25th, 2008 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Palmer (Post 983821)
The only thing I could tell you is that I found a fully charged large battery would be drained down to zero in about 30 hours or less. I don't have a clue as to why this happens, I just found out the hard way and helped spread the word last year when I started working with my EX1 last December.

What is your camra S/N?

Michael Palmer December 25th, 2008 10:35 PM

100999 on the Ex1

Ross Herewini December 26th, 2008 03:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Palmer (Post 983800)
Yes, I paid for the extra fast shipping. I must report that 5 of the 6 MxR's are very tight and slipping the SDHC card into it has a lot of drag, and 4 of the 6 don't reject the card all the way and they need a little help. I also had 1 MxR allow me to remove the SDHC card while in the camera.

Michael Palmer

Hi Michael,

I just scrolled up and saw you post.

Here's deal, the labels we had printed mean that sometimes with manufacturing variations, some of the cards are microns thicker, some of the cameras are microns smaller. We then added a label which was thicker than our specification, as it sticks out slightly from the card, by only a couple of microns, but we are dealing with pretty small tolerances here even on a good day.

We had to make decision on which thickness of stainless steel best suited our application, and we finally went for a higher grade knowing it might cause these problems, but considered it worth it for the additional robustness afforded. Sorry about that.

The work around is, could you please remove the label on the one that is the tightest fit, and see if that makes a difference. We have found that in our newest camera this works every time. We have in the meantime had a new set of labels printed for Monday, so if removing the labels works we'll send out replacements to anyone who is having a problem.

As a further note we are also investigating printing directly on the card itself, so we can get rid of this problem, but haven't been happy with the results so far. ( Well ok they smudged like an inkjet on steel ). But I am confident the print guys will come up with a solution.

BTW. Removing the label will not void your warranty.

Michael Palmer December 26th, 2008 10:44 PM

Tight Fit
 
Ross,
First off I want you to know how much I appreciate your dedication to making this possible.

Your MxR reader fits great into the EX1 and EX3 cameras I have, it is the SDHC cards fitting tight into the MxR just to clarify what I was commenting on. The SDHC cards I have are the TRANSCEND 16 GIG (CLASS 6) SDHC and they are the only cards I have tried into your MxR reader. 4 of the 6 MxR readers I have are fit very snugly and when I eject the cards they will not fully eject the SDHC cards. I even found I could push on the SDHC cards while inside the Camera and I could remove them. I was really just commenting so others would secure the SDHC cards properly into the MxR before inserting it into the camera.

It is great to hear you choose higher quality materials for this product.

Thanks again for producing it.

Michael Palmer

Mark Krichever December 27th, 2008 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael Palmer (Post 983943)
100999 on the Ex1

This s/n looks like beginning of EX1 production. My camera has s/n S0101 107050. It explains no battery drainage.
Thank you for letting me know.

Craig Seeman December 27th, 2008 03:35 PM

The first camera I had (Dec '07) was replaced in Feb '08 with s/n 103861 and it exhibited the battery drain issue. My experience was much as Michael describes.

I generally don't leave the battery attached to the camera but there have been times when I noticed the train even during long transit from location to location during the day when I was less inclined to take the battery off.

That and once leaving the batter on overnight was enough to convince me this was an accident waiting to happen. I did not want to start buying additional batteries to cover a fault in the camera.

Ironically when I brought the camera in to Teaneck NJ for the firmware upgrade and battery issue dealt with, the Sony person who took the camera mentioned they had a huge backlog of cameras coming in for the firmware upgrade but very few mentioned the battery drain issue. Meanwhile the camera was being held up about two weeks due to a backorder on the circuit board used to fix the battery issue.

Hence, I waited for Sony to do the firmware upgrade so I'll probably start testing cards at the end of the week.

Michael's post does bring up something interesting about the tolerances of the cards. I wonder if there's a difference between Transcend and Sandisk SDHC cards. Maybe all this is why Sony bailed on 3rd party card certification. Maybe this is the argument for an all in one (prebuilt) card but I think Ross brought up that issue with regards to the economy of scale (SDHC cards needed to purchase).

Paul Kellett January 1st, 2009 01:34 PM

Anyone tried these yet ?
 
OCZ 16GB Slate Series Express card - OCZEXPSLT16G - www.microdirect.co.uk




Paul.

Hal Protter January 4th, 2009 01:11 PM

I tried the adaptor
 
The adaptor and the Express flash card worked wothout problems in my EX-1.1

Steven Thomas January 4th, 2009 01:58 PM

What adaptor and what flashcard?

Robert St-Onge January 6th, 2009 07:37 PM

I don't understand this but the Sandisk Ultra II 15MB/s class 4 cards are now class 2.
I purchased a dozen of them at BestBuy Canada only to find out that they are all class 2.
I had purchased some from B&H and BestBuy a couple of months ago and they where all class 4. But now B&H shows a thumbnail with a class 2 card: SanDisk | 16GB Ultra II Secure Digital (SDHC) | SDSDRH-016GR

Anyhow, I opened one and tested it and it works pretty well. I was also able to shoot 720 24p slow motion at 48fps without any errors. I also filled up the card, while deleting a few clips once in a while and it seems to be as reliable as the class 4 cards. I used it with my Kensington adapter, should be getting my MxR Expresscard Reader soon!

Ted OMalley January 6th, 2009 08:13 PM

I thought it was mentioned that the speed of the Ultra II's actually exceeded the Class 4 that they were branded with. It seemed that they left it at Class 4 for to help differentiate it from the Extreme III's. I wonder if, with the huge popularity of the Ultra II's (thanks to all of us!), if marketing didn't decide to give them a demotion.

Wouldn't be the first time marketing departments changed strategy to correct sales and sway popular opinion.

Just a thought, since I had my 'conspiracy theorist' hat on!

Alex Raskin January 7th, 2009 08:45 AM

This is the right Sandisk Ultra II card, works fine.

Also 2x cheaper than in Robert's link.

Craig Seeman January 7th, 2009 09:35 AM

And here's 32GB version which I bought
Amazon.com: SanDisk Ultra II SDHC 32GB Card: Electronics
Granted it's much more expensive.
Note the dealer is J&R which I live near so I picked it up in person.
I just can't resist the thought of four hours of recording with no thought to change cards. It means not having to go into my pockets or camera bag in dark locations.


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