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Old April 11th, 2008, 11:30 AM   #316
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If we would have SDI out
taking this
http://www.magma.com/products/pciexp...-02360-33).pdf
an SDI card in and an Apple laptop with Finalcut Pro we are ready

a bit more expensive
taking this
http://www.v3hd.com/overview.html
again an laptop Win or Apple we are ready

could it be
could be happy with 10 bit SDI
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Old April 12th, 2008, 04:27 AM   #317
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going crazy reading all the stuuf
ok took it from wiki
The Canon XL H1 Records to HDV.
However, the XLH1 does have an exciting option that none of the other prosumer HD cameras have: a pre-compression HD SDI output. This allows for the exact same signal that is being sent to the HDV codec for compression to be outputted to an HD SDI device through a BNC cable on the side of the camera. Uncompressed recording it can also be sent to a computer via an HD SDI video card such as those offered by AJA and Blackmagic and then recorded completely digitally onto a hard drive for editing or higher quality compression.



Is there any DIY project HD SDI can be send to a SDI Video card
in the magma express box and then pumped in a laptop
my preference am Ibook

Can be portable
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Old April 12th, 2008, 11:01 AM   #318
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Ok, let's concentrate on what we have and what we can do to make it better. The camera doesn't have SDI out, but Sumix will add more in-camera compression modes.

So far the only problem that we have is compression. I don't think the need to use a computer attached to the camera is a problem because SI2K Mini users all around the work do it every day.

For me, 1.8:1 10bit lossless compression sounds great. Maybe an option to record with visually lossless comp so clips are not so heavy? So the only real problem would be RAM recording with long takes, but if we're already compressing, longer takes can be recorded.

So... To make it short: I think as soon as we have the new software update from Sumix we'll be able to test this cam with a real project.

According to Farhad, we'll have to wait till May though. We'll keep on doing more tests while we wait.
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Old April 12th, 2008, 01:21 PM   #319
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here a clip form red (another clip from th peter jackson short) http://jannard.com/images/movies/crossings.mov

one can notice how whites have a red tone (no pun intended ;) ) sumix seems to have the same issue, why is that? is there a way to solve the problem?

not all the shots have the problem, but the ones where the planes are flying and there are clouds there can be seen
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Old April 12th, 2008, 05:58 PM   #320
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Biel, The red tone is just a color correction issue. The samples you have seen from Sumix camera have not been color corrected. We are experimenting with automatic color correction using a Macbeth color chart and least square matching of all colors. The results are pretty exact. We even applied the algorithm on a professional scanner and improvement in color reproduction was surprising. You would expect scanner companies do precision color matching. Some example will appear on our site this week.
I would think that because so many variables affect colors, including lens and filters, exposure, sensor temperature, deBayaring algorithms, etc. that at the end it will be up to the person doing the post processing to use some art of his own.
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Old April 12th, 2008, 07:33 PM   #321
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i do belive sumix color is just great, and the whole camera it's huge! don't get me wrong in that but, if pure white is not white but redish, that in luma speaking it's not pure white but lighter grey, so it's not a color problem but an intensety one, isn't this an issue? that would be like if the camara couldn't represent pure white! at least not correctly
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Old April 12th, 2008, 07:58 PM   #322
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biel Bestue View Post
i do belive sumix color is just great, and the whole camera it's huge! don't get me wrong in that but, if pure white is not white but redish, that in luma speaking it's not pure white but lighter grey, so it's not a color problem but an intensety one, isn't this an issue? that would be like if the camara couldn't represent pure white! at least not correctly
Please see attachment the sensors spectral response. Red is quite stronger. Without color correction red dominates.
On the intensity issue, we have designed a better IR cut filter with half the thickness (1mm) and anti reflection quoting for blue green. This new filter with corresponding spacing rings will be shipped to our customers in about one month. Intensity must be improved by 20-30% on the high end of the spectrum.
Attached Thumbnails
Sumix 2/3" 1920x1080 CMOS-3562-3560-spectral_response.jpg  
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Old April 13th, 2008, 06:17 AM   #323
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I did post this a decade ago in some Wayne thread
http://www.theshiveringearth.com/VC25PTechTSE.htm

Film making I do not believe in pixel wars,
but something real, DOF, film look, no cpu wars.

Instead of dealing with rolling shutter artifacts
a mechanical Shutter works since decades
in any 16mm or 35 mm film camera.

What we do need is a way to synchronize
no rocket science i do guess.

A CMOS with resolution, a format as lossless as possible
and an output for example my fetish Mac Laptop is happy with
could be SDI.

Some basics on the camera white balance and so on,
the rest will be a pure post issue.
A case of a scrap tube camera will have
the shoulder mount and shape, there are thousands around.

35mm lenses are around, rail systems and follow focus kits too.
A 35mm optical view finder or 16mm was good enough and still is
for Indie and blockbuster productions, a smallish flat screen monitor,
to have a better look to the scene.
A look through the lens will tell you how light is for real
nothing else, millions of DV cams are proofing this as light is never balanced.
Light is the second big issue, maybe the biggest to show feelings, sound comes next.
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Old April 16th, 2008, 09:37 AM   #324
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CineForm Neo HD seems to have trouble handling large file size AVI files from the Sumix camera.

~600mb files work just fine, but anything above 2gb fails. Here is the error:
http://www.dreamstonestudios.com/per...Link-Error.jpg

The files play through virtualdub and mplayer. The error states that the format is not supported, when smaller files of the same format work.

I emailed CineForm about 3 days back and they still have not replied. I'm a bit concerned, for a product that costs so much I hope they have decent customer support and will at least bother to respond.
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Old April 17th, 2008, 09:14 PM   #325
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I would prefer an open source lossless compression over cineform

what would be great would be to make the sumix REDraw compatible, their anouncement of redray is stunning (2h of 4k in a dual layer dvd) but maybe they would ask for royalties

do the files that generate sumix contain meta-data like "film speed" shutter, EV, and things like these?
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Old April 17th, 2008, 09:33 PM   #326
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Still have not heard nothing from CineForm support.

CineForm will cost an additional $1,000 on top of the Norpix software.

I would be interested in hearing about alternatives, especially open source. What are our options?

And are they efficient enough for real time encoding or will we need even faster hardware?
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Old April 17th, 2008, 09:51 PM   #327
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While this is not directly related to compression, I thought that Adobe's CinemaDNG announcement at NAB was very interesting....

http://www.adobe.com/aboutadobe/pres...CinemaDNG.html
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Old April 18th, 2008, 08:26 AM   #328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Lipats View Post
I would be interested in hearing about alternatives, especially open source. What are our options?
http://www.diracvideo.org/
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Old April 18th, 2008, 02:39 PM   #329
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the actual hompege of the dirac project

http://dirac.sourceforge.net/

i can't find if it's lossless

for what it says in the about page:

http://www.diracvideo.org/about_dirac

Quote:
Dirac is an advanced video compression format designed for a wide range of uses, from delivering low-resolution web content to broadcasting HD and beyond, to near-lossless studio editing.
is cinemaDNG lossless? is there any information about it?
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Old April 19th, 2008, 04:38 AM   #330
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Hallo
maybe vented a million time
http://compression.ru/video/ls-codec/index_en.html
seems to be on hold since a bit
bon the dirac an following the links
looks very promising.

Having in mind what Red does an the other ones
we should talk of a way to get the sumix
ready for filmmaking
and not dreaming of 3D cams and total lossless

Adobe on the other hand is planing, thinking of some flavor
of open format related to way to expensive buffs as Dalsa, Red and so on even Panasonic.
It can't be real open GNU software as Adobe is tied to Apple and Windows.

What we do need is some hold on, beware, I do have only a stupid female brain, doing blonde output
a control for the camera functions,
the parameters to get white balance
or any knee parameters yo like to have,
via the smallest industry 104 card
written on a stupid flash card millions are out.
Star stop is nothing else
as sending it at 10 bit best resolution small money can buy
to an laptop. Preview via an LCD has not to be full resolution
and an optical view finder to have direct control over light and the scene, very old fashioned but
I guess there is no better way to have an idea what's going on on scene.

otherwise
we start to dream about what a 10kx16 k sensor
and a port doing via usb my expresso coffee as well
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