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Old February 8th, 2014, 09:18 PM   #46
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

For me Im looking forward to seeing how a good 4k framegrab from the gh4 will print to a 10x8 inch photo.
Thats a real world application for 4k (the pixel dimensions of the gh4 4k footage translates to approx 12 1/2 inches by 7 1/2 inches at 300dpi)
I would love 4k video from a fullframe camera for this reason but the canon 1dc is out of my pricerange.
This could force the price of the 1dc down a bit though.
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Old February 8th, 2014, 10:02 PM   #47
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

For me, my take on the GH4 is a very nice B camera to my EX1R. I really have no intentions of making it my A-cam unless it's the only camera I have available on a shoot. Plus the MFT form factor is less intimidating than a full frame DSLR and my hulking EX1R IMHO.

200mbps I-frame 1080p60 has got to be what won me over. Having the option of 100Mbps also won me over for that specific frame rate.

I wonder if Sony will make a FS200 and FS800, with respective XAVC-S and XAVC Long-GOP only recording, with the FS800 having standard Long GOP only XAVC and RAW options, and the FS200 limited to XAVC-S. Both of these models would completely exclude I-frame, and only the FS800 would support 4K 50/60p and 4096x2160 at up to 30p.
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Old February 8th, 2014, 11:28 PM   #48
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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Originally Posted by Noa Put View Post
.... but fact remains that once you start adding accessories like the batterygrip/xlr 'brick' thing and a external recorder for your 10 bit 4:2:2 recording option the camera becomes a ergonomical nightmare, still having to add a nd filter and the stupid 30 minute recording limit for EU people doesn't help much either but maybe the vocal critics can make that change for the next gh5 version? :)
You are buying a stills camera. It's only a piece of a camcorder. No surprise you have to add ND filters and bricks to turn it into one. 10 bit 4:2:2 requires space and power that the package just may not support. The 30 minute limit is because immmm yep ...... wait for it .... it's a stills camera. That's the EU law. If it records 30 minutes, it's a video camera (according to the EU) and the price goes up. Firmware changes aren't going to address the missing hardware like ND and XLR. But it does address things like Focus Peaking, Zebras and other GH3 flaws like the disappearing display after 10 seconds. Canon and Sony monitor this forum. Panasonic probably does monitoring. Bugs and flaws are noticed. Raves do nothing. If the GH3 flaws are fixed in the GH4, you can thank a vocal critic.
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Old February 9th, 2014, 03:12 AM   #49
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

I"m sure Panasonic didn't improve every single flaw ever mentioned by a critic so who is to blame then? Unless you are a part of their management team, you will never know what goes on behind the screen, therefore thinking that any voice will have an impact is just guessing. I unfortunately know about the eu limit, but accepting it like it is doesn't make you a fanboy either, it's just some stupid law made by a person on top of a big organisation, and the same stupid decisions are made on managment level of every camera manufacturer based solely on making profit or just not caring what real users out there need. Low prized camera's in the dslr section will always be flawed in one or the other way and forums will be filled with users sharing idea's for workarounds, it's in the nature of the beast. Instead of constantly complaining I rather just start using any "tool" out there that suites my purposes best and if that makes me a fanboy that's fine by me, Currently I"m editing a wedding shot with the help of my gh3 and it looks just great, the disappearing of the info on screen didn't have any impact on that and once my budget allows it the gh4 will probably be the next step, with or without flaws
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Old February 9th, 2014, 07:15 AM   #50
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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Originally Posted by Dylan Couper View Post
Anyone know where I can pre-order this? B&H only has it on shipping notification, no pre-order.

My only complaint is the XLR unit... since it's build for video, it could be more ergonomically friendly to videographers. .
The whole camera could be more ergonomic to videographers. Why didn't they take the guts of the GH4 & put it in a proper camcorder body with ND filters, dual card slots etc as a replacement for AF100?
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Old February 9th, 2014, 07:18 AM   #51
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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Originally Posted by Dylan Couper View Post
EF to m4/3 Speedbooster would be the way to go, help counter the small sensor.
If such a device existed it would be great but while there is an EF to NEX Speed Booster & Minolta MD to MFT Speed Booster there is no EF to MFT Speed Booster.
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Old February 9th, 2014, 07:26 AM   #52
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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Originally Posted by Mark Williams View Post
The GH4 has peaking and zebras. Biggest draw back for me is no 4:2:2 in camera. I am trying to stay light weight so external recorder is out. But if it comes in priced under $1500 I will probably buy one.
The G6 has peaking & it's pretty useless & nothing at all like peaking on a proper camcorder. The GH3 like the G6 already has crude zebras but again they are not a patch on zebras in a proper video camera.
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Old February 9th, 2014, 07:26 AM   #53
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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Originally Posted by Noa Put View Post
...once my budget allows it the gh4 will probably be the next step, with or without flaws
I agree 100%, Noa. At the prices we've started to see in Europe - upgrading is a no-brainer for GH3 owners, if only for the focus peaking.

I am not ecstatic over the in-camera 8-bit, but DCI-standard 8-bit 4K will be better than my GH3's 8-bit 1080p. And then there's the 1080p overcranking...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Noa Put View Post
Why didn't they take the guts of the GH4 & put it in a proper camcorder body with ND filters, dual card slots etc as a replacement for AF100?
Good poker players and stock traders ride winners and cut their losses on losers. Smart businesses look at sales figures and do the same thing.

Not to say they won't upgrade the AF100 at some point, but the consumer division has the momentum right now.

Cheers,

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Old February 9th, 2014, 07:32 AM   #54
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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Originally Posted by Nigel Barker View Post
The whole camera could be more ergonomic to videographers. Why didn't they take the guts of the GH4 & put it in a proper camcorder body with ND filters, dual card slots etc as a replacement for AF100?
You should probably thank the fanboys for not getting that :) All joking aside, there still might be a af100 replacement coming up, I would be surprised if Panasonic would give up this model in favor of the gh4 formfactor.
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Old February 9th, 2014, 08:54 AM   #55
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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You should probably thank the fanboys for not getting that :) ....
There's actually some truth to that. I spent 30 years in product development of a large technology company. I've seen this movie many times. Even tho it's the proper form factor for those who know and it's what videographers want, an upgraded AF100 will negatively impact GH3/4 sales. This gives the GH3/4 stills product people power over the AF100 (when was the last time Jan from Panasonic broadcast posted here? ANSWER: March 2012.

In the big picture, this is Panasonic's to lose and will take a gutsy executive to make it happen. Sony and Canon have their more expensive FS and C cinema cameras to protect so the FS100 and C100 will remain crippled. Panasonic doesn't have more expensive cameras to protect; only the GH3/4.

A new Panny AF100 has the potential to be the only low end Cinema camera with ND, good LCD, good VF, 50MBS recording and 422 Codec. These are the things people refer to as crippled aspects of the FS100 and C100. A new AF100 would take sales from FS100 and C100 as well as GH. The low end cinema market segment is theirs to take. But as long as the GH stills people have the revenue power, customer surveys and customer satisfaction numbers, they'll keep the AF people down and milk the GH line for revenue (ergo minimal firmware updates). After a year from release, this is all you got in the 1.2 firmware [insert sound of twirling finger]:
1) "Low Light AF" is added that makes it possible to set focus on the subject in low-lit situations (-3EV).
2) "Silent Mode" is added which suppresses electronic shutter, shutter sound, operation sound and flash emission with a single setting.
3) "Exposure Comp. Reset" is added which resets the setting of exposure compensation to 0 whenever the camera is turned off or the shooting mode is changed.
4) Performance of AF is enhanced in use with H-PS14042 and H-PS45175.
5) Connection problem with Apple Mac computers via Wi-Fi is fixed.

Not even a fix that lets you stop recording over wifi (you can only start it and let it run on a timer). What a joke. From my read, everyone fed up with using DSLRs for video are going to the C100. If Canon upgrade the CODEC, it'll hit GH and FS100 sales hard; except for the fanboys. :-)
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Old February 9th, 2014, 09:56 AM   #56
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

Jan Crittenden now works more in Sales, rather than product development, for Panasonic. This may be why you don't hear from her on these forums anymore.
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Old February 9th, 2014, 11:39 AM   #57
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

Does anyone know yet from any of the new reports if the 10 second disappearing information problem is still there? The consensus was they did that because they were worried about "burn in" with the OLED displays. Still has the OLED displays, supposedly better ones. Or if it is no longer an issue maybe that was BS in the first place. Zebras would not be a problem in that scenario.
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Old February 9th, 2014, 05:19 PM   #58
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ger Griffin View Post
For me Im looking forward to seeing how a good 4k framegrab from the gh4 will print to a 10x8 inch photo.
Thats a real world application for 4k (the pixel dimensions of the gh4 4k footage translates to approx 12 1/2 inches by 7 1/2 inches at 300dpi)
I would love 4k video from a fullframe camera for this reason but the canon 1dc is out of my pricerange.
This could force the price of the 1dc down a bit though.
I think 4K on the 1D C is a 1.3x crop of the full frame sensor.
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Old February 9th, 2014, 05:32 PM   #59
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

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Originally Posted by Ron Fabienke View Post
Does anyone know yet from any of the new reports if the 10 second disappearing information problem is still there? The consensus was they did that because they were worried about "burn in" with the OLED displays. Still has the OLED displays, supposedly better ones. Or if it is no longer an issue maybe that was BS in the first place.
Burn in may be a big problem if it happens on a proper display device such as a plasma TV - but so what in a camera monitor?

The purpose of such is solely to aid viewfinding and control - not for "proper" viewing. It seems pointless to protect it from burn in (assuming that is the case) if it negatively impacts it's main function! A bit like having a high performance car and never driving it above 50mph in order to keep the tyre wear down......
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Old February 9th, 2014, 08:29 PM   #60
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Re: Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

If there's burn in, the LCD is not fit for purpose. Shame on Panasonic. Stills camera designers at play.
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