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-   -   Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding? (https://www.dvinfo.net/forum/techniques-independent-production/537015-frameforge-worth-buying-storyboarding.html)

Paul R Johnson November 5th, 2019 06:31 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
When you make a decision, it may well be wrong - but it is YOUR decision, so yes, take ownership, accept responsibility and make your own mind up. Only ask other people when you have to. Can you not see these people consistently give you bad advice? Grow a set, man up, and stand tall - and if you are in charge, act like it?

Ryan Elder November 5th, 2019 06:59 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Yeah I guess I am just afraid I will get carried away with my own confidence and make a movie people don't want to see, if I decide what is right, and everyone else is wrong, if that makes sense.

Paul R Johnson November 5th, 2019 07:53 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
It's understandable - but that's what every movie and tv producer faces. I mentioned Thunderbirds and they gave the movie to Jonathan Frakes to Direct - and he made an appalling job of it, completely missed the huge fan base, he didn't listen to Gerry Anderson and they had no working relationship and the movie was simply awful. He bounced back.

Brian Drysdale November 5th, 2019 08:24 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan Elder (Post 1954563)
Yeah I guess I am just afraid I will get carried away with my own confidence and make a movie people don't want to see, if I decide what is right, and everyone else is wrong, if that makes sense.

You have to know why you're making the movie. There are successful films which people in the industry didn't get, but there was an audience for. There was also some very talented people working on it,


Pete Cofrancesco November 5th, 2019 11:04 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan Elder (Post 1954563)
Yeah I guess I am just afraid I will get carried away with my own confidence and make a movie people don't want to see, if I decide what is right, and everyone else is wrong, if that makes sense.

The problem you’re facing is mainly due to lack of experience and some level of aptitude. When I do a type of work I know inside and out, I have the confidence and knowledge to evaluate suggestions. When I’m out of my comfort zone I don’t know if I should listen to suggestions. If something unexpected happens or there is an issue then it’s likely I won’t respond correctly. On a professional set you could differ to someone on your team because they’re competent. On a low budget production you can expect uneducated suggestions and dealing with impossible situations with bad to worse options.

Understanding what makes sense to the viewer is second nature. One of the primary aspects of a director’s job is making judgment calls. If you’re not good at that... Again goes back to what others have said about honesty assessing what you’re good at. The general impression from most of us is either you’re not ready to be a director or you don’t have the aptitude for it.. You don’t seem to fully appreciate the difficulty and stress of being a director.

Ryan Elder November 5th, 2019 09:36 PM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Oh okay. Well I could make all the decisions myself, and decide on what the rules are, it's just without relying so much on advice from experienced people who have been at it a lot longer, I am afraid that I will do it wrong and fail.

However, all you experienced people had to be beginners sometime, and still make your first feature sometime?

Josh Bass November 5th, 2019 10:44 PM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Not necessarily. Many people on here are not filmmakers, per se. At least not directors and/or writers. Many of us work in other crew positions on others’ films or not on films at all.

Ryan Elder November 5th, 2019 11:04 PM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
That's true. I was also told if I want to have to break in with a movie and hopefully find a market for it, that I should maybe just produce it and leave it up to another director.

But another filmmaker told me it was a bad idea, cause if you are producing it, you don't want another director to take control of it then and possibly cause problems, and that it's best to direct it yourself, so you have the most control.

What do you think?

Pete Cofrancesco November 5th, 2019 11:07 PM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan Elder (Post 1954563)
Yeah I guess I am just afraid I will get carried away with my own confidence and make a movie people don't want to see, if I decide what is right, and everyone else is wrong, if that makes sense.

I do legal, live events, and all sorts of small projects. I once fancied making a movie, but I divested myself after helping a colleague film part of a movie. While I enjoyed the experience I had my fill. We started at 3pm and wrapped near midnight filming two short scenes that would run only few minutes. Reading Ryan’s further reinforced my decision. I wouldn’t want to give up a year of my free time to film a mediocre to bad movie no one will watch. I’d have more interest contributing to Youtube channel, doing tech reviews, something short and fun. While I have a lot of knowledge and experience I have no desire to pursue a career as a filmmaker.

Paul R Johnson November 6th, 2019 01:24 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
I have my son's Netflix account on my TV. bored the other day I thought I'd watch a movie. None appealed to me at all, bar the ones I already watched years ago. There will be a few like me worldwide - so trying to make a movie to appeal to everyone is futile. You will have a target audience for your product - you make it for them!

Brian Drysdale November 6th, 2019 02:34 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryan Elder (Post 1954580)
Oh okay. Well I could make all the decisions myself, and decide on what the rules are, it's just without relying so much on advice from experienced people who have been at it a lot longer, I am afraid that I will do it wrong and fail.

However, all you experienced people had to be beginners sometime, and still make your first feature sometime?

When directing a commercial feature film for the first time, you will have an experienced crew with you; this will be insisted upon by the funders. Usually, the first timers will have had more experience in either theatre or the film or TV industry than you currently have, they may have worked as either a director or head of department. They usually have an editor, someone who has a separate set of eyes, who can "rescue" the film, regardless of how crazy the director is.

The problem seems to be that you seem to be unsure of the basic mechanics and are obsessing on them.
Perhaps you should be more obsessed by the story, the characters and their world, these usually provide all the answers as to where you place the camera etc, not copying other films.

Paul R Johnson November 6th, 2019 05:01 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
In theatre, Directors can come from so many origins that second guessing them is often impossible - one said to me "well - what else is there that you don't know?" when I didn't turn up at a meeting I'd not been asked to and used as the excuse "I didn't know you called a meeting".

I find the most interesting times are when the Director is from an acting background, has no clue how easy or simple technical things are and say things like "At this point there's a big explosion, the wonderful sound designer will make everyone jump off their seats, the lighting will sort of go 'wow' and everyone gets blinded, and the music hits a huge crescendo while tons of glitter descends from the ceiling while the cottage collapses. The Heads of Lighting, Sound, Stage and the MD all look at each other - all having read the same script and seemingly all missed this very critical element. None want to be the one to break the news that this is going to be somewhat tricky - and then they all turn to me with an expectant look of 'you tell him'. The best solution is when the Director is also an executive producer with a large bag of gold. Seeing grown adults realising that this is the cue to realise the Directors vision, amazing things happen.

Worst is when the Director is an arse, who has no real power, certainly no money, and all these people simply say NO!

I've just seen the completed project I was involved with at one of the big UK movie studios. My entire scene, that I worked so hard on, that took me two days work - has been cut. Who knows if it was time, the edit decisions, or importance to the completed thing? I don't even get told. I got paid. That's probably all that really matters. I have no compelling need to see things to their conclusion. That need kind of left me. I was working on one when the Director got a recall to the states. There had been bad weather and shooting was cancelled. He was working on a new production when they recalled him, with a first class air ticket and he went, because the recall clause was in the contract that earned him mega bucks. The project he abandonned paid less, so he got on a plane. Needless to say, he won't get any more Directing roles from this production company - but again, it's a job and you do what you have to do. Ryan's need to make movies is a 'passion' not a job. Maybe that's what we can't quite fathom out what he's up to?

Josh Bass November 6th, 2019 05:12 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
I understand him, to some degree, having been him (maybe will again).

Brian Drysdale November 6th, 2019 05:31 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Having made passion films, i.e, ones that have no commercial plans or value, their making usually comes down to bloody mindedness and being willing to take risks. When I made an 8mm feature length Bond type movie when I was 16/17 I don't recall being aware of the 180 rule, but somehow I never broke it during the filming. It still has the biggest scene in any film I've worked on - an air attack on a secret mountain base in the Swiss alps.

I was amused to see "The Right Stuff" using similar techniques to those I used with my Airfix models.

Ryan Elder November 6th, 2019 06:51 AM

Re: Is FrameForge worth buying for storyboarding?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul R Johnson (Post 1954589)
In theatre, Directors can come from so many origins that second guessing them is often impossible - one said to me "well - what else is there that you don't know?" when I didn't turn up at a meeting I'd not been asked to and used as the excuse "I didn't know you called a meeting".


I find the most interesting times are when the Director is from an acting background, has no clue how easy or simple technical things are and say things like "At this point there's a big explosion, the wonderful sound designer will make everyone jump off their seats, the lighting will sort of go 'wow' and everyone gets blinded, and the music hits a huge crescendo while tons of glitter descends from the ceiling while the cottage collapses. The Heads of Lighting, Sound, Stage and the MD all look at each other - all having read the same script and seemingly all missed this very critical element. None want to be the one to break the news that this is going to be somewhat tricky - and then they all turn to me with an expectant look of 'you tell him'. The best solution is when the Director is also an executive producer with a large bag of gold. Seeing grown adults realising that this is the cue to realise the Directors vision, amazing things happen.

Worst is when the Director is an arse, who has no real power, certainly no money, and all these people simply say NO!

I've just seen the completed project I was involved with at one of the big UK movie studios. My entire scene, that I worked so hard on, that took me two days work - has been cut. Who knows if it was time, the edit decisions, or importance to the completed thing? I don't even get told. I got paid. That's probably all that really matters. I have no compelling need to see things to their conclusion. That need kind of left me. I was working on one when the Director got a recall to the states. There had been bad weather and shooting was cancelled. He was working on a new production when they recalled him, with a first class air ticket and he went, because the recall clause was in the contract that earned him mega bucks. The project he abandonned paid less, so he got on a plane. Needless to say, he won't get any more Directing roles from this production company - but again, it's a job and you do what you have to do. Ryan's need to make movies is a 'passion' not a job. Maybe that's what we can't quite fathom out what he's up to?

Oh that's interesting, why would they all look at each other, if it was difficult to pull off in that case? The explosion and glitter were not in the budget? Or is the music and sound a problem too in that case?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Drysdale (Post 1954588)
When directing a commercial feature film for the first time, you will have an experienced crew with you; this will be insisted upon by the funders. Usually, the first timers will have had more experience in either theatre or the film or TV industry than you currently have, they may have worked as either a director or head of department. They usually have an editor, someone who has a separate set of eyes, who can "rescue" the film, regardless of how crazy the director is.

The problem seems to be that you seem to be unsure of the basic mechanics and are obsessing on them.
Perhaps you should be more obsessed by the story, the characters and their world, these usually provide all the answers as to where you place the camera etc, not copying other films.

Yeah I feel I am obsessed with the story and their characters, it's just I was asking more technical questions on here, cause this site seems to be more directed at that, and most of the critiques I got, were on the technical side, more than the story side, I thought.


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