Disney to go with Blu-Ray

Jason Varner · July 9th, 2006, 01:15 AM

Here in the states it mostly DVD, Beta, and Digibeta(at least at the fesivals I've been to). The problem with migrating to BR is that nobody really has it yet. As far as Beta vs BR HD that's tough. Digibeta is like the ultimate evolution of SD, Blue Ray is going to use a heavy compression like mpeg2 but be HD. I think that if BR supported a format like DVCPROHD I'd choose BR, but it doensn't and for now digibeta looks awesome.

Steven Davis · July 11th, 2006, 05:58 AM

Interesting http://www.samsung.com/Products/DVDP...D_HD960XAA.asp

Heath McKnight · July 11th, 2006, 07:24 AM

Steven,

I saw that at Circuit City a little while ago. Two years ago, they had a DVD player that helped make DVDs with higher bit rates or masted in HD before going to SD look better. Didn't look any better to me (I bought and returned one and the tests were inconclusive to me).

heath

Heath McKnight · July 11th, 2006, 10:18 PM

http://news.com.com/2061-10801_3-609...tml?tag=txt%22

hwm

Jeff Kilgroe · July 11th, 2006, 11:00 PM

Yes, this could bridge the gap just fine.... Ricoh's device isn't a complete player mechanism itself, but does allow for the construction of a player that can re-focus the laser as needed to read HD-DVD, DVD and CD formats in addition to BluRay. It would be up to Sony and Toshiba to both issue licenses for their formats to any device/player that uses Ricoh's new component. If a company can accomplish that (obtain licenses for both formats for a player device), then universal players will become a reality.

...Now if we examine the unpleasant truth, LG as well as two other technology companies have developed universal player mechanisms already and thus far, Sony has refused to grant BluRay licenses to these devices. While it may be against the law for Sony to disallow a license because the device is or could also be licensed for a competing format, that doesn't mean they can't still disallow a license and simply state some other bogus reason like they don't feel it's of sufficeint quality or they don't approve of some manufacturing method of an individual part, etc..

Mike Tesh · July 12th, 2006, 10:52 PM

So in other words we'll have to wait for the Chinese to step up to the plate with universal players as they don't particularly have much interest in licenses.

If that happens it could be just whats needed to push Sony and Toshiba into granting legal licenses.

Heath McKnight · July 25th, 2006, 10:40 PM

http://aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=23971

hwm

Heath McKnight · July 26th, 2006, 09:25 PM

http://home.businesswire.com/portal/...17&newsLang=en

hwm

Zack Birlew · July 27th, 2006, 04:45 PM

Has Bluray won already? Where's the HD-DVD support announcements?

Harrison Murchison · July 29th, 2006, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Felis

Has Bluray won already? Where's the HD-DVD support announcements?

Nope. Sonic will support both.

http://www.sonic.com/about/press/new.../01/hddvd.aspx

Scott Shuster · August 9th, 2006, 07:46 AM

We already learned (here at dvInfo.net) that it is not possible to edit 1080i content and 720p content in the same file in Final Cut Pro. Now, we have a question about what the HD DVDs ("HD-DVD" and "Blu-Ray") can handle in terms of 1080i content and 720p content that are from different FCP files.

Here is our example situation:
We normally rent a second Sony Z1U when we want to do a 2-camera shoot. But now that we have purchased the JVC GY-HD100, renting a second camera has become much more expensive. Not sure why but it costs way more to rent the JVC. So we are thinking, "that's OK: We'll just do the two-camera shoots with two Z1Us, as we did before the upgrade to the JVC camera."

The idea is that as long as our DVD products are standard definition, we can easily create two different files in Final Cut Pro for editing -- one for the 720p work, and one for the 1080i work -- and then place the resulting portions of the production as separate menu items on the same SD DVD. The nature of our work is such that the 'originally 1080i' (Z1U) content can be kept completely separate from the 'originally 720p' content (GY-HD100), as separate menu items on the compressed DVD product.

But what about the future, when we may want to re-issue these products on Blu-Ray or HD-DVD?

If part of a production is shot in 720p and part in 1080i, can these two HD formats be place together as separate menu items on the same HD-DVD or Blu-Ray DVD?

Scott Jaco · August 10th, 2006, 05:39 PM

Hi,

When the time comes to purchase a Blu-Ray burner, what is the best way to export the timeline? Does Compressor offer a solution that isn't as time consuming as H.264?

Since Blu-Ray holds so much more info, I was hoping I wouldn't need to waste so much time sqeezing it down with H.264.

Does DVD Studio Pro support Blu Ray disks?

Scott Jaco · August 10th, 2006, 07:54 PM

Not many replies huh?

So far I've found an "HD-DVD 30min" codec in compressor. It encodes the HD content using mpeg-2 instead of H.264. This should save time. I don't need the heavy H.264 compression sinch I'll have 50GB B/R DVD's to work with.
Still don't know if DVD Studio Pro will support Blu-Ray.

This sure is a fun conversation I'm having with myself :)

Matt Crane · August 16th, 2006, 12:48 PM

I'm not sure, but just commenting:

Wouldn't this be the same or comparable to having the "widescreen" version and full-frame version on a DVD? Or having a DVD that has 60i content and 24p content in 2 different tracks?

Couldn't you just encode 2 different tracks (one as 1080i and the other as 720p) so your menu options point to each track?

Don Blish · September 14th, 2006, 12:18 PM

I received a Sony BWU100A drive two weeks ago…the box (with a very low serial#) arrived without the software disc. The “Cyberlink BD Solution 1.0” was mailed by Sony and I have been experimenting with it.

The drive will, of course, make CD, DVD and BD data discs without problems.

For video, I wanted to put my latest HDV project (1080x1440 30i) of 99 minutes on a disc with chapter buttons and further chapter marks for intervening scenes. The bundled software CAN import, add chapter marks and burn to BD-RE, but the menu making module was omitted for now. The software took my edited .avi file (From PremierePro2.0 + Cineform Access HD) of 87gigs (!) and encoded it to 19.3 gigs on BD-RE – about the same size/data rate as it would be on the source HDV tape. This was using Cyberlink Producer 3.3 – BD Edition, version 3.7.0.2824

The resulting disc played and looked stunning, using the included player: PowerDVD 6.6 BD Edition. When inserted into a Samsung BDP1000 on display at an accommodating nearby retailer, the disc WOULD NOT LOAD, and the machine had to be unplugged before eventually ejecting the disc. Of course, there is no way, at present, to tell if it is the Samsung or, more likely, the Cyberlink software at fault.

I also made a test disc with short segments, (including a resolution chart) in four different formats: HDV-1080x1440 16:9, NTSC-DV-480x720 16:9, NTSC-DV-480-720 4:3 and finally PAL-DV-576x720 25fps 16:9. The PowerDVD software played each in sequence, at the correct aspect ration and with only a half second flicker between each segment. If you were going to do this in a finished project, you would want to fade in and out of black and have no audio running over the transition. This disc would not load in the Samsung player either.

Unfortunately, the “capture” function in PowerProducer would not work on any camera (DV or HDV) or from any mode (DVD or BD). While this port on the moterhboard (TI-OCHI) and its Microsoft driver are flawless in PremierePro, it crashed the entire OS if tried in PowerProducer……But then I was not planning to use that function. Also, it would not import the mpeg2 file Cineform makes for exporting back into the camera. There it just crashed the application, not the OS.

For those of you into the details, here is the logical layout of the disc:
Only folder: BDAV
Sub folders: CLIPINF with a tiny file 00001.clpi
PLAYLIST with a tiny file 00001.roks
STREAM with a file 00001.m2ts of 19.336 gigs for 99 minutes

Cyberlink’s PowerToGo “DeskData” application was used to copy the above disc, and that too played in PowerDVD software but we did not try it in the Samsung. There is no explicit “Copy BD movie” tab.

So, at this date (Sep 14, 2006) you CAN put HDV on Blu-ray, but without a menu but you will have little assurance it will play in a Blu-ray player. I expect Cyberlink, with Sony’s urging, will get these features working soon. I certainly hope we have something better from Adobe soon – we don’t need every advanced feature of BDjava menus working for a first version.

July 11th, 2006, 05:58 AM	#32
Steven Davis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Richmond, VA Posts: 3,065	Interesting http://www.samsung.com/Products/DVDP...D_HD960XAA.asp __________________ What happens if I push the 'Red' button?

July 11th, 2006, 07:24 AM	#33
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Steven, I saw that at Circuit City a little while ago. Two years ago, they had a DVD player that helped make DVDs with higher bit rates or masted in HD before going to SD look better. Didn't look any better to me (I bought and returned one and the tests were inconclusive to me). heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

July 11th, 2006, 10:18 PM	#34
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Could this bridge the gap between HD DVD and Blu Ray? http://news.com.com/2061-10801_3-609...tml?tag=txt%22 hwm __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

July 11th, 2006, 11:00 PM	#35
Jeff Kilgroe Major Player Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Golden, CO Posts: 681	Yes, this could bridge the gap just fine.... Ricoh's device isn't a complete player mechanism itself, but does allow for the construction of a player that can re-focus the laser as needed to read HD-DVD, DVD and CD formats in addition to BluRay. It would be up to Sony and Toshiba to both issue licenses for their formats to any device/player that uses Ricoh's new component. If a company can accomplish that (obtain licenses for both formats for a player device), then universal players will become a reality. ...Now if we examine the unpleasant truth, LG as well as two other technology companies have developed universal player mechanisms already and thus far, Sony has refused to grant BluRay licenses to these devices. While it may be against the law for Sony to disallow a license because the device is or could also be licensed for a competing format, that doesn't mean they can't still disallow a license and simply state some other bogus reason like they don't feel it's of sufficeint quality or they don't approve of some manufacturing method of an individual part, etc.. __________________ - Jeff Kilgroe - Applied Visual Technologies \| DarkScience - www.darkscience.com

July 12th, 2006, 10:52 PM	#36
Mike Tesh Major Player Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Detroit MI Posts: 253	So in other words we'll have to wait for the Chinese to step up to the plate with universal players as they don't particularly have much interest in licenses. If that happens it could be just whats needed to push Sony and Toshiba into granting legal licenses. __________________ ScapeFilms.com \| My Photography \| IMDB Profile

July 9th, 2006, 01:15 AM	#31
Jason Varner Major Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 119	Here in the states it mostly DVD, Beta, and Digibeta(at least at the fesivals I've been to). The problem with migrating to BR is that nobody really has it yet. As far as Beta vs BR HD that's tough. Digibeta is like the ultimate evolution of SD, Blue Ray is going to use a heavy compression like mpeg2 but be HD. I think that if BR supported a format like DVCPROHD I'd choose BR, but it doensn't and for now digibeta looks awesome.

July 25th, 2006, 10:40 PM	#37
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	WB officially on board with Blu Ray! http://aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=23971 hwm __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

July 26th, 2006, 09:25 PM	#38
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	Sonic announces Blu Ray support http://home.businesswire.com/portal/...17&newsLang=en hwm __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

July 27th, 2006, 04:45 PM	#39
Zack Birlew Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 613	Has Bluray won already? Where's the HD-DVD support announcements? __________________ "Babs Do or Babs Do not, there is no try." - Zack Birlew www.BabsDoProductions.com

August 9th, 2006, 07:46 AM	#41
Scott Shuster Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: NYC Posts: 125	1080i + 720p on same Blu-Ray or HD-DVD? We already learned (here at dvInfo.net) that it is not possible to edit 1080i content and 720p content in the same file in Final Cut Pro. Now, we have a question about what the HD DVDs ("HD-DVD" and "Blu-Ray") can handle in terms of 1080i content and 720p content that are from different FCP files. Here is our example situation: We normally rent a second Sony Z1U when we want to do a 2-camera shoot. But now that we have purchased the JVC GY-HD100, renting a second camera has become much more expensive. Not sure why but it costs way more to rent the JVC. So we are thinking, "that's OK: We'll just do the two-camera shoots with two Z1Us, as we did before the upgrade to the JVC camera." The idea is that as long as our DVD products are standard definition, we can easily create two different files in Final Cut Pro for editing -- one for the 720p work, and one for the 1080i work -- and then place the resulting portions of the production as separate menu items on the same SD DVD. The nature of our work is such that the 'originally 1080i' (Z1U) content can be kept completely separate from the 'originally 720p' content (GY-HD100), as separate menu items on the compressed DVD product. But what about the future, when we may want to re-issue these products on Blu-Ray or HD-DVD? If part of a production is shot in 720p and part in 1080i, can these two HD formats be place together as separate menu items on the same HD-DVD or Blu-Ray DVD? __________________ http://stratostream.com -- dance & fitness videos

August 10th, 2006, 05:39 PM	#42
Scott Jaco Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sherman Oaks, CA Posts: 471	How do you burn a Blu-Ray DVD? Hi, When the time comes to purchase a Blu-Ray burner, what is the best way to export the timeline? Does Compressor offer a solution that isn't as time consuming as H.264? Since Blu-Ray holds so much more info, I was hoping I wouldn't need to waste so much time sqeezing it down with H.264. Does DVD Studio Pro support Blu Ray disks?

August 10th, 2006, 07:54 PM	#43
Scott Jaco Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Sherman Oaks, CA Posts: 471	Not many replies huh? So far I've found an "HD-DVD 30min" codec in compressor. It encodes the HD content using mpeg-2 instead of H.264. This should save time. I don't need the heavy H.264 compression sinch I'll have 50GB B/R DVD's to work with. Still don't know if DVD Studio Pro will support Blu-Ray. This sure is a fun conversation I'm having with myself :)

August 16th, 2006, 12:48 PM	#44
Matt Crane Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 58	I'm not sure, but just commenting: Wouldn't this be the same or comparable to having the "widescreen" version and full-frame version on a DVD? Or having a DVD that has 60i content and 24p content in 2 different tracks? Couldn't you just encode 2 different tracks (one as 1080i and the other as 720p) so your menu options point to each track?

September 14th, 2006, 12:18 PM	#45
Don Blish Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Portland OR Posts: 227	Limited Success: HDV to playable Blu-Ray I received a Sony BWU100A drive two weeks ago…the box (with a very low serial#) arrived without the software disc. The “Cyberlink BD Solution 1.0” was mailed by Sony and I have been experimenting with it. The drive will, of course, make CD, DVD and BD data discs without problems. For video, I wanted to put my latest HDV project (1080x1440 30i) of 99 minutes on a disc with chapter buttons and further chapter marks for intervening scenes. The bundled software CAN import, add chapter marks and burn to BD-RE, but the menu making module was omitted for now. The software took my edited .avi file (From PremierePro2.0 + Cineform Access HD) of 87gigs (!) and encoded it to 19.3 gigs on BD-RE – about the same size/data rate as it would be on the source HDV tape. This was using Cyberlink Producer 3.3 – BD Edition, version 3.7.0.2824 The resulting disc played and looked stunning, using the included player: PowerDVD 6.6 BD Edition. When inserted into a Samsung BDP1000 on display at an accommodating nearby retailer, the disc WOULD NOT LOAD, and the machine had to be unplugged before eventually ejecting the disc. Of course, there is no way, at present, to tell if it is the Samsung or, more likely, the Cyberlink software at fault. I also made a test disc with short segments, (including a resolution chart) in four different formats: HDV-1080x1440 16:9, NTSC-DV-480x720 16:9, NTSC-DV-480-720 4:3 and finally PAL-DV-576x720 25fps 16:9. The PowerDVD software played each in sequence, at the correct aspect ration and with only a half second flicker between each segment. If you were going to do this in a finished project, you would want to fade in and out of black and have no audio running over the transition. This disc would not load in the Samsung player either. Unfortunately, the “capture” function in PowerProducer would not work on any camera (DV or HDV) or from any mode (DVD or BD). While this port on the moterhboard (TI-OCHI) and its Microsoft driver are flawless in PremierePro, it crashed the entire OS if tried in PowerProducer……But then I was not planning to use that function. Also, it would not import the mpeg2 file Cineform makes for exporting back into the camera. There it just crashed the application, not the OS. For those of you into the details, here is the logical layout of the disc: Only folder: BDAV Sub folders: CLIPINF with a tiny file 00001.clpi PLAYLIST with a tiny file 00001.roks STREAM with a file 00001.m2ts of 19.336 gigs for 99 minutes Cyberlink’s PowerToGo “DeskData” application was used to copy the above disc, and that too played in PowerDVD software but we did not try it in the Samsung. There is no explicit “Copy BD movie” tab. So, at this date (Sep 14, 2006) you CAN put HDV on Blu-ray, but without a menu but you will have little assurance it will play in a Blu-ray player. I expect Cyberlink, with Sony’s urging, will get these features working soon. I certainly hope we have something better from Adobe soon – we don’t need every advanced feature of BDjava menus working for a first version.