Magic Lantern 0.1.5 release

Tim Polster · July 8th, 2009, 03:59 PM

This project sounds exciting and thanks for your efforts.

One question:

Is there any hope/possibility of ever getting a clean full resolution signal sent live out of the HDMI port?

Chris Barcellos · July 8th, 2009, 04:53 PM

I am guessing you are talking about live capture, with a card. So far, what I have seen coming of the camera doesn't seem like a full resolution HD through the HDMI port during capture, whether or not it is in proper aspect ratio. Of course, so far I have only viewed on a 19inch Dynex from Best Buy, and haven't tried it direct to my better HD monitors.... I will give it a look tonight.

Tim Polster · July 8th, 2009, 05:28 PM

Right now the feed is not full resolution but just asking if the M.L. can address this or is Canon the only hope.

Jon Fairhurst · July 8th, 2009, 05:44 PM

In general, Tramm can affect the control of the hardware and the overlays, but he can't change the processing of the video path. At least not yet.

It's possible that there is a bit that could be twiddled to stop the HDMI output from resizing to 480i, but that could be risky. My guess is that Canon downgrades the output to give the processing power to the h.264 encoder. Maybe they restricted the resolution to fight a heat problem.

In any case, Canon chose to downgrade the HDMI output during recording for a reason, and it's not just to keep people from recording uncompressed video from the sensor. We can do that by simply not pressing the record button. (To remove the focus box, enable face detection, or push it out of the way and record roughly 2:1 aspect video.)

Chris Barcellos · July 8th, 2009, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon Fairhurst

In any case, Canon chose to downgrade the HDMI output during recording for a reason, and it's not just to keep people from recording uncompressed video from the sensor. We can do that by simply not pressing the record button. (To remove the focus box, enable face detection, or push it out of the way and record roughly 2:1 aspect video.)

This is same conclusion I came to, after just running some more testing just minutes ago.

I Magic Lantern, there is a fairly clean HD signal before hitting record, and if you clear the screen you may get what you are looking for. Though I am not sure what aspect ratio you will actually get.

If it can be done, Tramm will do it though.

Tim Polster · July 8th, 2009, 10:24 PM

My thoughts were towards not recording with the 5D but recording to a Nano Flash.

If it is possible to output a full resolution feed at all then this would be a great alternative.

This method would not need to have the 5D recording, so is there a chance this could work without another firmware update?

Sorry, I own the camera for stills but have not had the time to try any video with it.

Thanks

Chris Barcellos · July 8th, 2009, 10:44 PM

Tim:

Like everyone else, you will be doing firsts here, if you can get it going. All you will need:

1. I assume you have the Nano.

2. A mini HDMI to standard HDMI cable

3. A copy of latest Magic Lantern firmware, 0.1.5, and learn how to load it.

You could set camera up the way you want it in the config file. I would leave of zebras and crop. Crop doesn't quite mark right on HDMI out at this point anyway.

You have to set up Live View to videon and Still, and be sure to select the movie view over exposure simulation. Other wise you will have auto on.

If you need help with getting it going, PM me, and I will try to help.

Tim Polster · July 8th, 2009, 10:52 PM

Hello Chris,

Thanks for your interest.

I have a Nano on order. Don't know when I will get it, but it should be in a few weeks.

So I can not test this yet but I wanted to see if it was worth pursuing.

Sounds like it is.

Right now, is the HDMI video signal full resolution, uncompressed sent live out of the camera?

The M.L. update can turn the screen graphics off but the full video image does not get sent out? Is this correct?

I will be happy to forge new territory when the Nano arrives!

Jon Fairhurst · July 8th, 2009, 11:25 PM

Tim,

The HDMI stuff is a bit off topic, but here goes:
* The HDMI output generally reflects the image on the LCD display.
* Playback from the card is 1080 widescreen
* When not recording or playing back, the output mirrors the LCD, which is 4x3, so you get a cropped pillar box display. That means that the output is not full width 1920. It scales down by throwing away lines and pixels, so the aliasing is really bad. It is uncompressed though, so you don't get block artifacts, but the aliasing kills it for me.
* The focus box blocks the image, but you can push it out of the way and get a clear 2:1 image or so. You can definitely get 2.35:1 unobstructed. I hear that if you turn face detection on, it removes the box.

Since this is a sticky for 0.1.5 firmware, any questions about current HDMI operation should be on another thread, rather than this one.

Jon Fairhurst · July 8th, 2009, 11:37 PM

Tramm,

I've confirmed that the audio gain is incorrect on the first take. The gain is correct on the following takes. Also, the first second or so of all the takes gets a quick blast.

As mentioned earlier, when capturing audio, just do a quick dummy take after loading the firmware, then do your real takes. You can see when the audio settles down on the audio level monitor.

Tramm Hudson · July 9th, 2009, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Polster

Right now, is the HDMI video signal full resolution, uncompressed sent live out of the camera?

I believe based on code, but have not been able to verify, that the output is only 960x540. This may be incorrect with the HDMI output and I plan to run some extensive tests this weekend to determine the resolution.

Tim Polster · July 9th, 2009, 09:42 AM

Thanks.

Tramm, I sent you an e-mail to take the conversation off of this thread.

Phil Bloom · July 14th, 2009, 03:42 PM

Installed it...worked a treat. VERY impressed!

Philip Bloom Blog Archive Magic Lantern 5dmkII firmware. Brings loads of great features to the camera

Steve Cahill · July 14th, 2009, 05:45 PM

What is the value in the .cfg file to have Zebra's enabled? 0= not enabled does 1=enabled? Would be nice to have a FAQ on the settings values for the .cfg file or better yet #more descriptors for the possible values in the cfg file.

# Zebra levels
# Zebra draw = 0 off 1= on
# Zebra.level = 61440 default more transparent = ?????
zebra.level = 61440
zebra.draw = 0

Default .cfg file below:

# Zebra levels
zebra.level = 61440
zebra.draw = 0

# Edge detection (too slow for real use)
edge.draw = 0

# Crop marks for 2.35:1
crop.draw = 1

# Audio data
# mgain is according to this table:
# 0 == +0 dB
# 1 == +20 dB
# 2 == +26 dB
# 3 == +32 dB
# 4 == +10 dB
# 5 == +17 dB
# 6 == +23 dB
# 7 == +29 dB
audio.mgain = 4
# dgain is in dB.
audio.dgain = 12 # dB
# mic-power is boolean. Turn it on if you are using an electret mic
audio.mic-power = 0

# Enable liveview automatically?
# Turn this off if your card has trouble booting or
# with HDMI output connected at boot time. You will need
# to hit the Live-View button in a few seconds after booting
enable-liveview = 1

# Disable the powersave so that the LiveView never shuts off?
# WARNING -- this can cause problems with your sensor!
# DO NOT LEAVE THE CAMERA ON CONTINUOUSLY.
disable-powersave = 1

Jon Fairhurst · July 14th, 2009, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Cahill

What is the value in the .cfg file to have Zebra's enabled? 0= not enabled does 1=enabled?

Correct. 1 is enabled and 0 disabled for all binary values.

July 8th, 2009, 04:53 PM	#17
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	I am guessing you are talking about live capture, with a card. So far, what I have seen coming of the camera doesn't seem like a full resolution HD through the HDMI port during capture, whether or not it is in proper aspect ratio. Of course, so far I have only viewed on a 19inch Dynex from Best Buy, and haven't tried it direct to my better HD monitors.... I will give it a look tonight. __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

July 8th, 2009, 05:44 PM	#19
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	In general, Tramm can affect the control of the hardware and the overlays, but he can't change the processing of the video path. At least not yet. It's possible that there is a bit that could be twiddled to stop the HDMI output from resizing to 480i, but that could be risky. My guess is that Canon downgrades the output to give the processing power to the h.264 encoder. Maybe they restricted the resolution to fight a heat problem. In any case, Canon chose to downgrade the HDMI output during recording for a reason, and it's not just to keep people from recording uncompressed video from the sensor. We can do that by simply not pressing the record button. (To remove the focus box, enable face detection, or push it out of the way and record roughly 2:1 aspect video.) __________________ Jon Fairhurst

July 8th, 2009, 10:44 PM	#22
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Tim: Like everyone else, you will be doing firsts here, if you can get it going. All you will need: 1. I assume you have the Nano. 2. A mini HDMI to standard HDMI cable 3. A copy of latest Magic Lantern firmware, 0.1.5, and learn how to load it. You could set camera up the way you want it in the config file. I would leave of zebras and crop. Crop doesn't quite mark right on HDMI out at this point anyway. You have to set up Live View to videon and Still, and be sure to select the movie view over exposure simulation. Other wise you will have auto on. If you need help with getting it going, PM me, and I will try to help. __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

July 8th, 2009, 11:25 PM	#24
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	Tim, The HDMI stuff is a bit off topic, but here goes: * The HDMI output generally reflects the image on the LCD display. * Playback from the card is 1080 widescreen * When not recording or playing back, the output mirrors the LCD, which is 4x3, so you get a cropped pillar box display. That means that the output is not full width 1920. It scales down by throwing away lines and pixels, so the aliasing is really bad. It is uncompressed though, so you don't get block artifacts, but the aliasing kills it for me. * The focus box blocks the image, but you can push it out of the way and get a clear 2:1 image or so. You can definitely get 2.35:1 unobstructed. I hear that if you turn face detection on, it removes the box. Since this is a sticky for 0.1.5 firmware, any questions about current HDMI operation should be on another thread, rather than this one. __________________ Jon Fairhurst Last edited by Jon Fairhurst; July 9th, 2009 at 10:49 AM.

July 8th, 2009, 11:37 PM	#25
Jon Fairhurst Inner Circle Join Date: May 2006 Location: Camas, WA, USA Posts: 5,513	Tramm, I've confirmed that the audio gain is incorrect on the first take. The gain is correct on the following takes. Also, the first second or so of all the takes gets a quick blast. As mentioned earlier, when capturing audio, just do a quick dummy take after loading the firmware, then do your real takes. You can see when the audio settles down on the audio level monitor. __________________ Jon Fairhurst

July 8th, 2009, 03:59 PM	#16
Tim Polster Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 2,231	This project sounds exciting and thanks for your efforts. One question: Is there any hope/possibility of ever getting a clean full resolution signal sent live out of the HDMI port?

July 8th, 2009, 05:28 PM	#18
Tim Polster Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 2,231	Right now the feed is not full resolution but just asking if the M.L. can address this or is Canon the only hope.

July 8th, 2009, 10:24 PM	#21
Tim Polster Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 2,231	My thoughts were towards not recording with the 5D but recording to a Nano Flash. If it is possible to output a full resolution feed at all then this would be a great alternative. This method would not need to have the 5D recording, so is there a chance this could work without another firmware update? Sorry, I own the camera for stills but have not had the time to try any video with it. Thanks

July 8th, 2009, 10:52 PM	#23
Tim Polster Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 2,231	Hello Chris, Thanks for your interest. I have a Nano on order. Don't know when I will get it, but it should be in a few weeks. So I can not test this yet but I wanted to see if it was worth pursuing. Sounds like it is. Right now, is the HDMI video signal full resolution, uncompressed sent live out of the camera? The M.L. update can turn the screen graphics off but the full video image does not get sent out? Is this correct? I will be happy to forge new territory when the Nano arrives!

July 9th, 2009, 09:42 AM	#27
Tim Polster Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Arlington, TX Posts: 2,231	Thanks. Tramm, I sent you an e-mail to take the conversation off of this thread.

July 14th, 2009, 03:42 PM	#28
Phil Bloom Trustee Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: London UK Posts: 1,939	Installed it...worked a treat. VERY impressed! Philip Bloom Blog Archive Magic Lantern 5dmkII firmware. Brings loads of great features to the camera __________________ Philip Bloom Cinematographer, Director, Filmmaker www.philipbloom.net

July 14th, 2009, 05:45 PM	#29
Steve Cahill Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 321	magiclantern.cfg What is the value in the .cfg file to have Zebra's enabled? 0= not enabled does 1=enabled? Would be nice to have a FAQ on the settings values for the .cfg file or better yet #more descriptors for the possible values in the cfg file. # Zebra levels # Zebra draw = 0 off 1= on # Zebra.level = 61440 default more transparent = ????? zebra.level = 61440 zebra.draw = 0 Default .cfg file below: # Zebra levels zebra.level = 61440 zebra.draw = 0 # Edge detection (too slow for real use) edge.draw = 0 # Crop marks for 2.35:1 crop.draw = 1 # Audio data # mgain is according to this table: # 0 == +0 dB # 1 == +20 dB # 2 == +26 dB # 3 == +32 dB # 4 == +10 dB # 5 == +17 dB # 6 == +23 dB # 7 == +29 dB audio.mgain = 4 # dgain is in dB. audio.dgain = 12 # dB # mic-power is boolean. Turn it on if you are using an electret mic audio.mic-power = 0 # Enable liveview automatically? # Turn this off if your card has trouble booting or # with HDMI output connected at boot time. You will need # to hit the Live-View button in a few seconds after booting enable-liveview = 1 # Disable the powersave so that the LiveView never shuts off? # WARNING -- this can cause problems with your sensor! # DO NOT LEAVE THE CAMERA ON CONTINUOUSLY. disable-powersave = 1 __________________ Regards Steve