Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Interesting... the $2599 suggested retail price puts this camera squarely in Canon XA20 territory, and not in the realm of the more expensive and just-released Canon XF200 like some have suggested.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

In fact, I have been waiting patiently for a replacement for my XA20- the X70 definitely solves that problem.
It's going to be brutal competition for Canon

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Yes the price point was a happy surprise.
I was ready to replace my JVC HM150 with the XF200 to get the three control rings but when reading about the really nice features like the press-to lock, future 4K and large sensor I begun to wonder how much more then the XF200 I would be.
And then it's less. :)

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

It will be brutal, considering that B&H are asking $2299 for the X70 and not the full-pop MSRP of $2599.00. The only avenues Canon have here are:

a) drop the price of the XA25 (the X70 has a single SDI output, amazingly enough) and the XA20 too,

or

b) drop the price on the just-released XF200 so their customers don't feel it's such a long stretch to get a camera that might be more of a pro camera in terms of function and features.

I really think Sony blindsided Canon with the X70, because Canon don't have ANY 4K-capable cameras in their line-up right now, and none on the horizon.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Well all my delivery is DVD and a few Bluray nothing on the internet or by file !!! 4K for me is ONLY to crop a 1920x1080 from the 4K file. Everyone has their own viewpoint. I think we may see 4K appear quicker than people think.

Ron Evans

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

CVP has released their starting price as one of the first in Europe. It's even under 2K euros ex-VAT. This camcorder really seems much value for the money. £1,590 / € 1990 ex-VAT.

Buy - Sony PXW-X70//C (PXW70C) 1.0 type Exmor R CMOS sensor compact XDCAM camcorder with 12x zoom lens recording XAVC, AVCHD and DV

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Is the rolling shutter that much of a thing? I've been hearing about this crap for years, only ever had a problem with it when dealing with camera flashes.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

It's a very aggressive pricing. Even if the 4k-update would add another €4-500 it will be interesting to see if canon changes their prices for the XA-series and XF200.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

distribution is important, actually makes all the difference. DVD is great, but I don't see any difference between the footage of my old XL1 and ea50 (on DVD), and that takes away all the fun (and meaning) of participating in a discussion about video quality.
4K is the future but then it will depend on the media I'll have available. right now there is only the internet and memory cards for better quality. no other options on the horizon. and don't you think that we should be ready with the media to be used to distribute FIRST? 4K monitors will get more and more available, and back we go to the media used to share the video work: DVD? don't think so. bluray is a ghost , nobody saw it and nobody knows what it is. so it's youtube or memory cards . and that's it. computers are the TV of the future, so is 4K , but the media?

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Will this PMXW-X70 besides the original NP-FV70 also accept the larger NP-FV100 which is now targeted for use with the HXR-NX30?

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

@Anybody that likes super fast left/right pans...

I keep hearing all the complaints about the Ax100 and A7s concerning rolling shutter durring "whip-fast" pans.

Complaints sound like this: "Watch me jerk my Ax100 or A7s to the left.....see that skew?....a CCD sensor would never do that!..."

If whip pans are your thing, than certainly the Ax100 or A7s is not for you.

Me personally? ....I think fast pans look horrible even on cameras with a global shutter. Why do people insist on demonstrating that problem when nobody really shoots video that way in the real world?

Generally speaking flashes are annoying and maybe skew of very fast moving objects inside a stable frame...those can sometimes look bad. However, I think that all this rolling shutter talk is highly exaggerated.

CT

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

little sister from PXW-X70 ... the FDR-AX100E ... yes, run well with the (aditionally purchased)
larger NP-FV1000
_____
Hans

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

The rollingshutter on the ax100 and most likely on the x70 can be very nasty but it depends on how you use the camera, in my case it's not a issue at all, I do slow pans or use static shots but if you plan on shooting football games with this camera it can give you unusable shots, I never would use the camera for these type of events. The rolling shutter is quite bad if you have to pan too fast and it gets worse as you zoom in and follow a object.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I think it should be mentioned that the RS does not seem to be quite as bad in the AX100 if shooting 1080p
(actually comparable to a CX/PJ7xx series, based on what I could see in the viewfinders), so the X70 may look "better" and then it remains to be seen how well the 4K upgrade tweaks things.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

How is rs on those other cams vs an ex1? Ive done a little everything with ex (no sports but fast moves on broll shots), never noticed any "jello" when reviewing footage.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I should have mentioned that as well, I never shoot 1080p, only 4k with the ax100 but from the online samples I have seen 1080p seems much less affected when it comes to rolling shutter. RS in 4K however is another story depending on your use.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

don't have an EX1 or any experience with one, but compared with a PJ760 which generally doesn't seem to generate RS complaints, and in 1080p, the skew visible in the VF was comparable.

In 4K, you definitely want to follow traditional "film rules", not "shake it like ya just don't care". Camera technique becomes more important, and my opinion has always been that with the AX100, if you need "fast motion", the 1080/60p mode should probably be strongly considered if you can't shoot wide and P&C in post.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Sony just posted this video on their youtube channel. this little camera is hitting so many right buttons for events (NDs, dual recording, bigger sensor) convinced it's going to be my next camera. At 3:00 there's a shot of trees with nasty compression but I'm sure it's just youtube.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

That was an incredible video - of course, it was shot by professionals but the images were superb. I don't feel that I will regret selling my PMW 200 and accessories back to B&H in anticipation of receiving the new camera (on preorder) in September. For my purposes (hobbyist) this new camera will be so much more manageable (vacations, family holidays). No more being questioned (or in some instances stopped) about doing a "professional" shoot. Just take off the handle assembly and voila just another handycam! Can't wait.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I am just little confused by this camera, it seems like it has new technology that I would want, I am just not sure how much better it is than my Sony EX1-R..I understand that it may not be better than the EX cameras like the 200 but is it better than mine.

1-How does it compare in regards to light sensitivity?
2-Will the better codecs make it look cleaner than my EX1R footage?
3-Is the lens better?
4-Does anyone know how the iris dial compares to the lens iris on the EX1
5- The Sony EX1R shipped with sort of a flat picture profile and I have tweaked it over time, does this camera have a decent tweaking range?

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I can only compare the AX100 that I had for a month before going back to the EX1r

1 a stop (whole) better than the EX1r
2 pretty much the same, only bigger files with the AVCS (much bigger) EX1r = 35mbps AX100=50mbps
3 no way (the fuji is on another planet)
4 it's a matter of getting used to it, not a big deal (if you have small hands)
5 no. the EX1r was made for post, the AX100 gets it right out of the camera, I can't complain, it does get it right.

notes:
the ND filter on the AX100 are brutal, when they engage it will show in the footage, can't do it in a continuous take
there is no zoom speed adjustment with the AX100 . If you use a lanc remote with a speed adjustment then the minimum speed is not slow enough. The EX1r can be jerky but at least the speed adjustment (in camera) is way better.
in my case I couldn't use the AX100 for work at all, then it also depends on how you distribute (MP4 files, DVD, internet). For my needs the EX1r gets the job done better (much better).

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

It seems to me to be a little like comparing apples with oranges.
I think of the EX-1 as a full-on professional camera with a massive feature set, a highly regarded lens, true manual focus, and etc.
The X70 has very attractive features (in fact, I have one on order), but seems more of a "prosumer" level product.
The one advantage it offers over the EX-1 is the XAVC codec- 4:2:2, 50 mbs, with the promise of 4K to be added later.
Maybe the new PXW-X180- the big version of the X70- might be a more direct comparison to the EX-1.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Thanks

The 180 has three 1/3" sensors -The Sony EX1R has three 1/2 sensors so one sixth bigger
-The X70 has one 1 inch sensor
So which is better?

How much better is the EX1 lens than the X70- I understand that the optical image stabilization of the X70 is better than the EX1R

How many more features does my camera have over the X70-- The X70 seems to have SDI out, picture profiles
There’s a full set of exposure and focus aids including peaking, histogram, zebras etc
The build is solid-seems Pro enough

Because the lens does not have three rings does that make it much harder to work with?

Skipping the checklist of features convo, bottom line with proper picture profile tweaking and good use of exposure would I see a much better looking image out of the X70 than my EX1R in most shooting situations?

Thanks in advance to those who respond

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I work a lot with the EX3, which is almost identical to the EX1/1R. I now own a PMW-300.

A bigger sensor gives you better control over the depth of field. I'm thinking the X70 would be better in that regard.
It is one chip compared to three on the EX models. No Bayer filter needed on the EX cameras. Which will be sharper? When the X70 gets its 4K it should be a lot sharper.

The 3-ring lens will always be preferred over a single ring. It just gives you so much more control over the lens features.

The XAVC-S codec is definitely better than the EX models' XDCAM. 10-bit, 4:2:2 is a fantastic feature.

Both the EX1/1R and the X70 lack a timecode in/out. Bummer.

Between the X70 and an EX model,. I'd go for the X70.

I'd like an X70 as a b-camera to my PMW-300, but I definitely prefer my 300 to the X70.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I just watched the video and the poor quality of that shot jumped out/jarred with me too - otherwise most of the shots look pretty decent HD (for something that's been through the YouTube "mangle").

The studio shots of the finished pieces of glasswork look particularly impressive - considering the cam is only outputting HD resolution at this point in time.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

That would've been my big question. . .if this EX1/3 is considered a "fully featured professional cam" and this cam is considered "prosumer," what makes it so? So far only know of a few drawbacks/things it lacks compared to the larger cams:

-12x (relatively short range ) zoom

-one ring on lens

-iris stops down to 4 at longer end of zoom (though EX1 closes down to 2.8 or something, even though the readout doesn't TELL YOU it does this)

-highlight handling

-small size/looks like toy to some clients, maybe. . .I generally don't deal with these types (I hope).

What else? Other than that, seems as fully featured as the larger cams. . .all the menus/profiles/tweakability you could want. XLR inputs, SDI and HDMI out.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

The 12X zoom does not seem to be a real drawback with this camera because the digital clear image X24 zoom is good as an optical zoom because of the sensor...So it trumps X14 optical on the EX1R

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Is that verified or just from that one review?

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

This guy is not a fan of digital zoom but he admits that it works in the x70

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

The "toy" form factor of the camera would be handy when you just want to look like a tourist, yet you still get the high quality video.

Andrew

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

from the first clips that are around but made by regular people (not pre-approved by SONY to be clear) I see that the X70 does something that at first I thought was a user error but now I see it everywhere: it has the tendency to stamp the focus on the background even when the frame is filled with faces , still stays on the background and it takes a long time to re-focus. That never happened with my previous AX100.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

Most of those times unfortunately I've still needed the tripod, which unfortunately is a red flag to any police or property owners looking to ruin your fun (i.e. all of them.)

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

What I find so bizarre about this camera is that we all know it's essentially a 'beefed up' AX100. No secrets there. So then why the 'special upgrade' to 4K at an extra cost??? We know the 4K must be in there from the get go, so why is Sony playing games with this camera?

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I wonder if it's because they plan to use XAVC (10-bit) rather than XAVC-S?

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

You beat me to the punch - was just going to post the same theory but was doing some research about the uhs2 cards that claim read/write speeds up to 250-280mb/s.

If Sony really wants this to be a professional camera (and they have already indicated that by using XAVC instead of XAVC-S codec) it does not make sense to wait 4-6 months and introduce 4K with the same codec as the AX100 when they could have done that at the get go. IMHO they would loose a lot of credibility if this is just a marketing ploy to get another $500-$700 by "staging" the camera's full features.

My theory is that they are testing/researching using the XAVC codec for 4K and specifying that you need the higher speed cards (which sell in the $250 range for 64GB) . That way we get 4:2:2 and 10 bit for 4K (maybe not 60p due to heat buildup as others have mentioned.).

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

With the x70 they beefed up the HD alot from the ax100 and cx900. I think they are holding off on the 4k as they are trying to beef that up as well.

Also I don't know if you all noticed but looking at B&H "in the box" it says it includes a shotgun mic. Which is nice considering all the new camcorders (Sony, Panny, Cannon, JVC, etc.) don't seem to include shotguns anymore. Hopefully Sony includes a newer & better Shotgun than they have been putting on their camcorders for the last 4 years (XM1).

The one thing that concerns me about this camera is ... Looking at the Sony Website the Minimum Illumination is listed at 1.7 lux. With a 1 inch Sensor you would think it would be better, but then again it needs a lot more light being that it records at such a high resolution (maybe that's why they made that weird lens hood with light holes behind it). My Z5 was at 1.5 lux and the new NX3 does 1.2 Lux ... Will this camera be worse in low light than previous models? If it is worse will the 1 inch sensor at least make up for it creating darker blacks and less noise?

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I temporarily have an AX100 and doing some observations (wouldn't really call it testing) between that and my PMW 200. I have found that the observed light levels on the LCD monitor appear the same for both cameras when I use f2.8 as the lowest setting on the 200. In other situations, I have had to use 3-6 db of gain where I didn't have to with the 200. However, I have not observed any noise on 4K up to 12db gain (and that is playing the clips out thru Edius at UHD settings (4K preview card) to a Dell 32" 4K 10 bit monitor.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I have been impressed with the quality of the internal mic on the AX 100 - on a recent round of test shooting it picked up a small dog barking at least 200 feet away and my talking back and forth with a friend who was 20-30 feet away and without any external hum or wind noise. So, for people who have to go into "stealth mode" (removing upper assembly and shotgun mic temporarily to avoid harassment from authorities or business owners), you will still have decent audio.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I'm wondering if that's not a typo
It says " XLR Handle Unit with Micropone"
Maybe supposed to say "microphone holder"
Also, they list the part/model number for every other included item, but say nothing specific re a microphone.

Re: Sony PXW-X70 announced: Pro XDCAM version of AX100
 

I hope they sell the pxw-x70 eyecup separately as accessory for the ax100, if not I"ll buy a x70, keep the eyecup and sell the x-70 again. :)