PDX10 -- various questions

Tommy Haupfear · January 1st, 2004, 09:26 AM

I'll pass on the tub of ice cubes but I'm also interested in what others have to say about the onboard light.

Below is a link of all the on-camera light kits offered by B&H but I have no experience with them. Maybe someone can shed some light on the subject (forgive the pun).

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=&pn=1&ci=4375

Tommy Haupfear · January 2nd, 2004, 11:40 AM

Lambis, I think we might have better luck over in the Photon Management forum here on DVinfo.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisp...?s=&forumid=41

Lambis Stratoudakis · January 2nd, 2004, 11:45 AM

Thanks Tommy

I will put my question on the Photon Management. I was only thinking that maybe some som use the PDX10 have some tips

Lambis

David Korb · January 4th, 2004, 10:46 PM

I had to shoot 2 guitars today so I set up the pdx10 and an Olympus 2100 UZ...frankly I didn’t get the results with the 4+ year old Olympus I wanted and stuck with the one mega pixel Sony stills...for those who may be interested in the still picture capabilities of the pdx done strictly by an amateur, there posted here

www.wiktel.net/dkorb/karvin.jpg

www.wiktel.net/dkorb/gibson.jpg

Heres the settings i used

3 light sources 4@500 watt quarts halogen(shop lights) bounced everywhere...100 watt westinghouse screw in florescent overhead...daylight in front from large window... adjusted the curves in Photoshop, just the white balance and I crushed the blacks a bit, observe the feathers in the corner cause they were white!, shrank the photos to fit in window by about 30 percent
The raw image had more saturation on the pdx10 but more noise than the olympus
sharpness turned all the way down plus one
wb set 1 click + (not sure why)
ae shift factory centered
agc limit off (don’t know what it duz)
manual focus
manual exposure
zebra @ 100 since there were no human subjects
the background is army surplus wool blanket
I’m goinna sell these 2 guitars and buy an Olympus E1 for stills, 14 guitars are 13 to many
And for those professionals here…feel free to post criticism (please)

Ronald Lee · January 5th, 2004, 03:54 AM

Hi,

I'm about to get a PDX10. Also will have a "normal" assortment of accessories (lenses, extra batteries, etc...) and am wondering which Pelican is good for me, i.e. what is the smallest size that will fit the camera and the gear?

At this point I may also get a ME-66 shotgun mike, which likely won't fit in a small to medium Pelican, but I can get a separate case for it.

Links to a page where I may buy them are:

http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/searchtools/search.asp?mnf=1663

David Korb · January 5th, 2004, 07:19 AM

it works now

Shawn Mielke · January 5th, 2004, 01:33 PM

Sony puts out the LC-PD100TH, for the PDX10, and the LCH TRV950, for the 950, having the same body that the PD has. I know that places like Safer Seas customizes Pelican cases, though they don't carry the PDX10 itself.

Mike Sanchez · January 6th, 2004, 02:55 AM

Nice stark black background. There is one area with a hot highlight in the lower left of the guitar but, in one way of looking, that highlight adds to the starkness of the photo.....ok in this one.

Turn down sharpness completely and, with as much lighting as you had, the TRV950 will be essentially noise free almost to its resolution limit. Even one click of sharpening above default is too much if noise is an issue.

Sharpen in Photoshop (unsharp mask for quick outcomes) (or better, MATLAB, using their image processing toolkit with FFT) once the still is captured at zero sharpening on the TRV.

On another website a poster named ccbatson provided me these parameters in pshop unsharp mask.

Amount: 175
Radius: 0.8
Threshold: 1

I think 175 may be too aggressive if you are really sensitive to noise but will work well if you plan to print the image on a printer.

Auto-gain up is the analog gain on the CCD array sensitivity upstream of the A/D conversion. Turning it off ensures the lowest noise outcome.

Tommy Haupfear · January 6th, 2004, 06:12 AM

Great pics and especially to be taken with a digital camcorder.

Here is one I took with my former PDX10.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-...5/pdx10(1).jpg

David Korb · January 6th, 2004, 10:06 AM

Thanks for your input Mike…I really don’t want to set up that shot again so I will give the Carvin guitar one more shot in Photoshop…it’s the only editor I can afford. I didn’t even think about the unsharp mask and I believe I may look real hard at the blue channel perhaps soften it up. The noise didn’t concern me as much in the darker Gibson guitar but the Carvin needs some attention…especially after I looked at Tommy’s photo…make me feel better Tom and tell me that was just a lucky shot!!!

The difference between a carpenter with a camera, and a photographer with one, might be likened to the difference between, tossing a bullet…AND SHOOTING ONE!

Btw Tom, I looked at your web site(nicely done) and I’ll bet you love that Panasonic…had there been one available in the states last year I would have opted for the mx5000 version.

Lambis Stratoudakis · January 7th, 2004, 10:14 AM

Many Europeans who want to order a camcorder from the U.S. or Asia sooner or later face the same problems.
a) Guarantee.
Most shops selling these cameras have a U.S. or 90 days guarantee. You can buy an additional mark guarantee which they claim to be an international guarantee, but what happens when something goes wrong? Do we have to send the camera back to the U.S. or can we leave it to an authorized camera in the country where we are?
There are some shops for example in Hong Kong which exchange domestic warranty card for an international one That’s great!!

b) Payment.
In many European countries, like in Sweden where I happen to be, banc transfer is very inconvenient since the banc administrational fees are extremely high, and you meet a lot of obstacles until your money has reached the receiver. I speak of own experience. So payment by banc card (visa, AmEx etc) is least to say to prefer.

c) Grey market camcorders.
Naturally you will tell me to buy from our sponsors and of cause if the above wasn’t an issue I would. It would be good if there were a list of ”blacklisted” sellers (grey market sellers)
Everyone knows that Sony PDX 10 come with a 2 year silver support warranty (at least in Europe).
(Take a look att: www.creativevideo.co.uk/pdf/sony_silver-support.pdf )
So I’ve asked a company selling the Sony PDX 10 in England if they offer this support.
The answer they gave me was:
We are selling without silver support (not of great help if you read the small print!).
Are they grey market sellers?

One problem that I have: I want to order a camera from the U.S. I’ve got a friend over there who will visit me soon. Now, I would like to order the camcorder, make the payment from my visa card (so that I also will become the registered buyer) and have it delivered to my friend. But I’ve been told that from the B&H that it’s not possible.

Anyway, any reaction on this theme? I hope that our sponsors will help their potential European buyers and simplify the selling/buying.

Regards Lambis

Vlad Manning · January 23rd, 2004, 03:45 PM

You won't get any real coverage at 5 metres, but the only on-camera lights that won't have subjects squinting -or running from you- in lower light situations will be the lowest wattage ones, like the tiny 3 watt light Sony makes for their Handycams. Model VL3 or somethingthat sounds like that. It runs off the cameras power through the Sony hotshoe, so i Believe your pdx10 will run it.

Optimistically figure on lighting out to 3m, or less if you diffuse it for a wider spread, which will help you avoid the center hotspot.

Marco Leavitt · January 24th, 2004, 11:36 AM

Using an on-camera soft box will let you use a lot more wattage without blinding people.

Maurizio Panella · February 17th, 2004, 03:29 AM

Hi all, I'm a DSR390 user and I'm thinking to buy PDX10 like second little camera. My questions: with 390 I use an Anton Bauer light directly connected to the camera, so the light dont need a battery. Do you know if it's possible with the PDX10 too?
And I'd like to know if PDX10 can use the portable hd DU1.
Thanks in advance, Maurizio.

Boyd Ostroff · February 17th, 2004, 07:23 AM

The "hot shoe" on the PDX-10 is used for the XLR adaptor box. The box itself has a shoe mount, but it doesn't provide power. Aside from that, with the little QM-91 as the largest available battery, you probably wouldn't want to power a light from the camera. But read back through this forum for a bit, there was some earlier discussion of camera-mounted lights.

Keep in mind that the PDX-10 is actually a very small camera (it will seem tiny if you're used to a DSR-390). It's quite a bit smaller and lighter than a PD-150 as well.

January 4th, 2004, 10:46 PM	#79
David Korb Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: n.w. minnesota Posts: 35	2 stills done with pdx10 I had to shoot 2 guitars today so I set up the pdx10 and an Olympus 2100 UZ...frankly I didn’t get the results with the 4+ year old Olympus I wanted and stuck with the one mega pixel Sony stills...for those who may be interested in the still picture capabilities of the pdx done strictly by an amateur, there posted here www.wiktel.net/dkorb/karvin.jpg www.wiktel.net/dkorb/gibson.jpg Heres the settings i used 3 light sources 4@500 watt quarts halogen(shop lights) bounced everywhere...100 watt westinghouse screw in florescent overhead...daylight in front from large window... adjusted the curves in Photoshop, just the white balance and I crushed the blacks a bit, observe the feathers in the corner cause they were white!, shrank the photos to fit in window by about 30 percent The raw image had more saturation on the pdx10 but more noise than the olympus sharpness turned all the way down plus one wb set 1 click + (not sure why) ae shift factory centered agc limit off (don’t know what it duz) manual focus manual exposure zebra @ 100 since there were no human subjects the background is army surplus wool blanket I’m goinna sell these 2 guitars and buy an Olympus E1 for stills, 14 guitars are 13 to many And for those professionals here…feel free to post criticism (please)

January 5th, 2004, 03:54 AM	#80
Ronald Lee Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 435	Which Pelican case is good for the PDX10? Hi, I'm about to get a PDX10. Also will have a "normal" assortment of accessories (lenses, extra batteries, etc...) and am wondering which Pelican is good for me, i.e. what is the smallest size that will fit the camera and the gear? At this point I may also get a ME-66 shotgun mike, which likely won't fit in a small to medium Pelican, but I can get a separate case for it. Links to a page where I may buy them are: http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/searchtools/search.asp?mnf=1663

January 5th, 2004, 07:19 AM	#81
David Korb Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: n.w. minnesota Posts: 35	sorry bout the dead link it works now __________________ If at first you dont succeed...well so much for skydiving

January 5th, 2004, 01:33 PM	#82
Shawn Mielke Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Santa Rosa, California Posts: 745	Sony puts out the LC-PD100TH, for the PDX10, and the LCH TRV950, for the 950, having the same body that the PD has. I know that places like Safer Seas customizes Pelican cases, though they don't carry the PDX10 itself. __________________ Breakthrough In Grey Room

January 6th, 2004, 02:55 AM	#83
Mike Sanchez Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Rochester, NY (USA) Posts: 54	Nice stark black background. There is one area with a hot highlight in the lower left of the guitar but, in one way of looking, that highlight adds to the starkness of the photo.....ok in this one. Turn down sharpness completely and, with as much lighting as you had, the TRV950 will be essentially noise free almost to its resolution limit. Even one click of sharpening above default is too much if noise is an issue. Sharpen in Photoshop (unsharp mask for quick outcomes) (or better, MATLAB, using their image processing toolkit with FFT) once the still is captured at zero sharpening on the TRV. On another website a poster named ccbatson provided me these parameters in pshop unsharp mask. Amount: 175 Radius: 0.8 Threshold: 1 I think 175 may be too aggressive if you are really sensitive to noise but will work well if you plan to print the image on a printer. Auto-gain up is the analog gain on the CCD array sensitivity upstream of the A/D conversion. Turning it off ensures the lowest noise outcome. __________________ New to Video but Learning Fast. Sony TRV-950 Canon ES-970 Canon Elan Canon AE-1 Canon Z-135 Yashica Mat124G

January 1st, 2004, 09:26 AM	#76
Tommy Haupfear Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 1,415	I'll pass on the tub of ice cubes but I'm also interested in what others have to say about the onboard light. Below is a link of all the on-camera light kits offered by B&H but I have no experience with them. Maybe someone can shed some light on the subject (forgive the pun). http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...=&pn=1&ci=4375

January 2nd, 2004, 11:40 AM	#77
Tommy Haupfear Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 1,415	Lambis, I think we might have better luck over in the Photon Management forum here on DVinfo. http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisp...?s=&forumid=41

January 2nd, 2004, 11:45 AM	#78
Lambis Stratoudakis Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malmö, Sweden, Crete, Greece Posts: 49	Thanks Tommy I will put my question on the Photon Management. I was only thinking that maybe some som use the PDX10 have some tips Lambis

January 6th, 2004, 06:12 AM	#84
Tommy Haupfear Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Greenville, SC Posts: 1,415	Great pics and especially to be taken with a digital camcorder. Here is one I took with my former PDX10. http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-...5/pdx10(1).jpg

January 6th, 2004, 10:06 AM	#85
David Korb Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: n.w. minnesota Posts: 35	Thanks for your input Mike…I really don’t want to set up that shot again so I will give the Carvin guitar one more shot in Photoshop…it’s the only editor I can afford. I didn’t even think about the unsharp mask and I believe I may look real hard at the blue channel perhaps soften it up. The noise didn’t concern me as much in the darker Gibson guitar but the Carvin needs some attention…especially after I looked at Tommy’s photo…make me feel better Tom and tell me that was just a lucky shot!!! The difference between a carpenter with a camera, and a photographer with one, might be likened to the difference between, tossing a bullet…AND SHOOTING ONE! Btw Tom, I looked at your web site(nicely done) and I’ll bet you love that Panasonic…had there been one available in the states last year I would have opted for the mx5000 version.

January 7th, 2004, 10:14 AM	#86
Lambis Stratoudakis Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Malmö, Sweden, Crete, Greece Posts: 49	Some thoughts of a European buyer. Many Europeans who want to order a camcorder from the U.S. or Asia sooner or later face the same problems. a) Guarantee. Most shops selling these cameras have a U.S. or 90 days guarantee. You can buy an additional mark guarantee which they claim to be an international guarantee, but what happens when something goes wrong? Do we have to send the camera back to the U.S. or can we leave it to an authorized camera in the country where we are? There are some shops for example in Hong Kong which exchange domestic warranty card for an international one That’s great!! b) Payment. In many European countries, like in Sweden where I happen to be, banc transfer is very inconvenient since the banc administrational fees are extremely high, and you meet a lot of obstacles until your money has reached the receiver. I speak of own experience. So payment by banc card (visa, AmEx etc) is least to say to prefer. c) Grey market camcorders. Naturally you will tell me to buy from our sponsors and of cause if the above wasn’t an issue I would. It would be good if there were a list of ”blacklisted” sellers (grey market sellers) Everyone knows that Sony PDX 10 come with a 2 year silver support warranty (at least in Europe). (Take a look att: www.creativevideo.co.uk/pdf/sony_silver-support.pdf ) So I’ve asked a company selling the Sony PDX 10 in England if they offer this support. The answer they gave me was: We are selling without silver support (not of great help if you read the small print!). Are they grey market sellers? One problem that I have: I want to order a camera from the U.S. I’ve got a friend over there who will visit me soon. Now, I would like to order the camcorder, make the payment from my visa card (so that I also will become the registered buyer) and have it delivered to my friend. But I’ve been told that from the B&H that it’s not possible. Anyway, any reaction on this theme? I hope that our sponsors will help their potential European buyers and simplify the selling/buying. Regards Lambis

January 23rd, 2004, 03:45 PM	#87
Vlad Manning New Boot Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: US Posts: 19	You won't get any real coverage at 5 metres, but the only on-camera lights that won't have subjects squinting -or running from you- in lower light situations will be the lowest wattage ones, like the tiny 3 watt light Sony makes for their Handycams. Model VL3 or somethingthat sounds like that. It runs off the cameras power through the Sony hotshoe, so i Believe your pdx10 will run it. Optimistically figure on lighting out to 3m, or less if you diffuse it for a wider spread, which will help you avoid the center hotspot.

January 24th, 2004, 11:36 AM	#88
Marco Leavitt Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Albany, NY 12210 Posts: 2,652	Using an on-camera soft box will let you use a lot more wattage without blinding people.

February 17th, 2004, 03:29 AM	#89
Maurizio Panella Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Reggio Emilia Italy Posts: 63	PDX10 infos request Hi all, I'm a DSR390 user and I'm thinking to buy PDX10 like second little camera. My questions: with 390 I use an Anton Bauer light directly connected to the camera, so the light dont need a battery. Do you know if it's possible with the PDX10 too? And I'd like to know if PDX10 can use the portable hd DU1. Thanks in advance, Maurizio.

February 17th, 2004, 07:23 AM	#90
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	The "hot shoe" on the PDX-10 is used for the XLR adaptor box. The box itself has a shoe mount, but it doesn't provide power. Aside from that, with the little QM-91 as the largest available battery, you probably wouldn't want to power a light from the camera. But read back through this forum for a bit, there was some earlier discussion of camera-mounted lights. Keep in mind that the PDX-10 is actually a very small camera (it will seem tiny if you're used to a DSR-390). It's quite a bit smaller and lighter than a PD-150 as well.