Erik, recording in slo-mo in camera gives better results than slowing down with your editing program.

To slo-mo a clip in vegas, put your cursor on the right hand edge of a clip, press and hold ctrl on the keyboard, now of you look closely you'll see a little ~ sign next to the cursor, now just drag to the right to extend the clip (speed up) or drag to the left to squash the clip (slow down).

Paul.

Actually, it's the other way around, Paul :)

Ha ha. Yes Piotr you're correct.

Just testing to see if everyone's awake !!

Thanks for correcting me.

Paul.

Has anyone noticed how quick the sd cards reformat ?
When i format the sony sxs card it says 0%, 23%, 74% done.
When i format the sd cards transcend 8gb and sandisk extreme 3 8gb the display says 0% then done, in an instant, even when the cards are full.

The only ereor i got was from the sandisk, it hung on 0% when i tried to reformat it, nothing would work on the cam, the display stuck at 0%, even when i switched the camera switch to off,or removed the card, the cam wouldn't switch off, i had to remove the battery in the end.
When i switched cam back on and reinserted the sandisk card it reformatted ok.
Maybe just a glitch, or connection problem.
One time i put an sd card in the cam and it didn't show up, so i took the card out and rubbed the connections and then it showed up when inserted.

Paul.

An Update:

Just to clear up my findings using the AFT card, I have succeeded in getting it to fail along the lines that Steve reported earlier.

All my tests so far were using battery power, I've run some tests on mains power unit and am able to duplicate some of the errors - this all appears to be heat related, so the AFT is to all intents "unreliable" the card appears to create write errors when it gets too hot.

I've also found that it produces read errors into my laptop (Patriot and Transcend cards)
when transfering thru the express port on my laptop. The SDHC card reader in the laptop
produces no errors.

AFT - NOT GOOD

sorry for the misguided initial tests.

Paul

Kensington card reader and transcend class 6 8gb.
Interval record, 1 frame per second, can't recall how long but i ended up with a 3 min clip, no problems.
Also did a short fast-mo, 2 frames per second for about 10 mins, again, no problems.

I've also done short clips and long clips spanning cards, no problems.

Are users still putting cards in this order of preference
1. sandisk extreme 3
2. sandisk ultra 2 ( can get 16gb for £42)
3.transcend (can get 16gb for £26)

Is anyone having problems with transcend 16gb ?

Thanks.
Paul.

User Reviews at Amazon.com USA seem to indicate that the Kensington card reader won't work with a MacBook Pro.

Amazon.com: Customer Reviews: Kensington 33407 7-in-1 Media Reader for Expresscard Slot for Memory Stick, Multimedia Card, xD-Picture Card

I don't own a MacBook Pro, but I imagine some here may.

John

As I have reported earlier I had so much problems with the Kensington adapter and Transcend 16gb card that I don't use it. Se my earlier posts.

I own a macbook pro, and while it might be a pain in the ass for the kensington not to work,
you can always move the video via a usb2 card reader, or a Firewire one. I can't get
my SxS cards to mount on my desktop unless I push them in by hand, the Lexars work fine.

Watch out for conterfeit cards

eBay Australia Guides - FAKE SanDisk Ultra Secure Digital Cards Exposed

Have you had problems only during overcrank ?
Or during normal HQ recording also ?

Thanks.
Paul.

Which is exactly why i might pay a bit more for my sd cards but i can buy them over the counter from a shop about 1 mile from my house.
I can't see the point in trying to save a bit more by buying online or from ebay or whatever.
We've gone from £500 for a 16gb sony card down to £25-£40 for a 16gb sandisk or transcend.
What's the point on trying to push savings even more.

Paul.

Why take a chance,
The SanDisk 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s (with the Kensington adaptor) works with NO errors in HQ mode just like the twice expensive new Extreme III 30MB/s version. I've seen the 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s for less than $70 USD.

The SanDisk 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s was just confirmed on "another" forum to work equal to the 4GB Ultra II 15MB/s. It was also reported to overcrank to 40FPS without any errors.
Not that I suggest to overcrank with this SDHC card, but the abilty to overcrank to 40FPS without errors shows us that the card has decent headroom and is safe for all HQ modes.

Right now, unless we find an equal expresscard adaptor that allows the EX1 memory door to close, the working combo is:

kensington 7-in-1 reader
SanDisk 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s OR the "more expensive" SanDisk 16GB Extreme III 30MB/s version



I'm looking forward to hearing if the new SanDisk 32GB Ultra II 15MB/s works.. I'm willing to bet it will.

Also,
Why bother worrying if the Kensington will work in your PC,
just grab an $8 SDHC reader and use that.

I've got one on pre-order, and I'll post results whenever it arrives.

Whe is the ultra 2 32gb due out ?
And how much ?

Paul.

I heard any day now and they sell for $150 USD !

thought you guys might be interested in this:

SanDisk, Extreme III CF + SDHC. 8GB CF $6.67, 16GB CF $15, 4GB SDHC $13, 8GB SDHC $17 when you buy 3 @ ADORAMA

thats sandisk extreme iii 8GB SDHC for $16 . probably because they are releasing new cards soon or something.

That is the older Extreme III SDHC version, not the new 30MB/s version. No one has tested these with the Kensington

Maybe it's worth testing - $24 for an 8GB card is pretty sweet. Also, the rated 20mb/sec is higher than the Ultra II cards, correct?

Seems like sponsor of this forum carries all of it:

Kensington reader:
Kensington | 7-in-1 ExpressCard Media Reader | K33407US | B&H

SanDisk 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s:
SanDisk | 16GB Ultra II Secure Digital (SDHC) | SDSDRH-016GR

SanDisk 16GB Extreme III 30MB/s:
SanDisk | 16GB Extreme III - 30MB/s Editi | SDSDX3-016GR-A31

I could not find SanDisk 32GB Ultra II 15MB/s yet.

I have been following this thread for a while and really appreciate everyone’s contribution. I am generally very computer literate and ok at still 35mm slr film & digital photography. However, I am a complete video newbie. (I have recently acquired an EX3 and while I can pick up the mechanical & electronic aspects fairly easily, as you all know, the "art" of video making is another story.)

My review of this thread and the Convergent Designs threads prompted three thoughts and questions. Any comments or responses would be appreciated. They are:

1. Has anyone tried Sandisk’s express card reader in the EX1/3 - SanDisk Multi Card - Card adapter ( MMC, SD, MS Duo, MS PRO Duo, miniSD, MMCmobile, microSD, MMCmicro, SDHC, miniSDHC, MS Micro, microSDHC ) - ExpressCard/34? It sells for approximately $16.00 – US and, from the comments made by users on various websites, it appears to generally be both pc & MAC compatible.

2. Has anyone tried to use an esata or esataII express card to connect a hard drive to the EX1/3 – (not Sony’s setup)

3. With regard to hacking the camera – I noted that Convergent Designs stated that it was using a sony chip in its new hd-sdi compact flash recorders and that the chip was the same one that is used in Sony’s new 50 – 422 camera (I forgot the model number). I am curious to know if that chip is also in the EX1/3. If so, a piece of code might be able to be written to activate 50-422 recording to sxs cards from the ex1/3. (Someone joked about this, but it might be doable if the proper encoding chip is in the camera and the code in Sony's new camera were examined carefully.)

As to items 2 & 3, if I get any responses that warrant a new line of discussion, I will move it to another thread. Also, if those two questions should have been posted elsewhere, I apologize for posting them here. I did so because this group seems to be technically savvy and interested in experimenting with other storage alternatives and methods which might be used to get more from the cameras.

Thanks in advance for any responses.


Regards

Eli H. Schmukler

MSAC-EX1 adapter
 

Just got a MSAC-EX1 Memory stick duo adapter. Now I am waiting for a 30mbs. Duo Pro memory stick to see if if works with EX1 or the EX3 - do not know if the EX1 in the last of the production name has any reference to the PMW-EX1.....

In overcrank I got an error message after a few seconds. But in HQ and SD it recorded fine in camera with no error messages, but when I tried to open them in the computer almost every other clip (I was doing long recordings) was corrupted and couln't be restored. Had to reformat the card. It's interesting that others have no problems with the same setup.

Yes, the Transcend SDHC cards are NOT as fast as the two "suggested" SDHC cards that have been mentioned.

Hi Marten

I've repeatedly recorded full cards of the Transcend 16GB / Kensington Adapter with no corruption problems at normal speed HQ. I have a Mac and use the XDCam Transfer version 2.7. I don't open the files directly from the BPAV folder, but after the XDCam Transfer has 'wrapped' them in whatever way it does from the original MP4 files.

At what 'overcrank' settings caused problems? My limit for the Transcend was 720P-24P 38 FPS.

What are you using to view the MP4 files and how does your software tell you the file is corrupted?

I did not try the esata cardm but I did try an el cheapo USB 2.0 and a Belkin FireWire 800 express card adapter.

The USB did absolutely nothing, While the FireWire 800 threw up an incompatible memory message, and no work around was found.

If they have opened the USB connect, this option should work, but it could be a matter of finding the one adapter of the hundreds available that works?

Also, my gut tells me that *IF* Sony were to catch on and release an inexpensive option, it would be with their own Memory Stick Pro-HG Duo cards. I also think they would offer a lower bit rate from the EX with this.

Sony could really turn this in to something great.

First of all work with SanDisk and find out how to address the coding for their new Extreme III 30MB/s SDHC cards to allow the cards to be used to their full potential

The max data rate needed for HQ at the highest overcrank 60FPS is 100 mbps; therefore the memory must be able to have quick access and sustain 12.5MB/s.

Next, have their own expresscard media adaptor manufactured that allows the EX1 memory door to close. Actually they could probably just work with another manufacture with some quick changes and rebadge it.

Hey thanks. I tried it just now.. looks ok I guess. :)

This combo will not work with the EX1.

First of all work with SanDisk and find out how to address the coding for their new Extreme III 30MB/s SDHC cards to allow the cards to be used to their full potential

I bet Sony could double or triple their EX sales if they take this route!

I couldn't copy the files with the OS. Also tried the EX clipbrowser. Also the corrupted mp4 file could not be deleted, had to reformat the card.

I haven't tested the exact overcrank FPS, I couldn't do 50FPS.

I'm glad it's working for others, my setup is not reliable. I'm thinking of buying an UltraII card to try.

Even more satisfactory would be to bring out "SxS lite". Physically etc they would be SxS cards - but with the performance more along the lines of the SDHC cards you've been looking at, lower than "true" SxS. And, obviously, at a (much) lower price than "true" SxS. From Sonys point of view they could guarantee a (lower) level of service.

Users with big budgets would still want the standard SxS cards for speed of downloading etc, but for many "SxS lite" would be good enough - same as the SDHC cards plus adaptor - whilst still being far cheaper than full spec cards. They would also bring the day of solid state being able to be used in a shoot, give to client mode much nearer.

I foresee 50Mbs being the next big step for Sony in cameras like the EX, as they now have it on the PDW700, and I'd hope any "SxS lite" to at least be capable of guaranteed performance at that bit rate. Do you think your SDHC/adaptor would be capable of that? The question isn't just academic, as I believe there will be an SxS adaptor for the PDW700.

An interesting thread, with some great work. Well done.

David, that's a good idea regarding SxS lite cards.

I'm just hoping Sony wakes up that the expresscard/SDHC combo would greatly increase their sells on their EX XDCAM series.


I've seen sustained write and read speeds exceeding 30MB/s using USB 2.0 drives.
Since the new SanDisk Extreme III SDHC is capable of 30MB/s, Sony could work this out quickly. The top data rate needed for the current EX series is 12.5MB/s.

What's wrong with Sony simply bringing down the prices of their current, fast SxS cards to match the Kensington+Sandisk Extreme III... plus a bit of a premium since they still are a bit faster to support S&Q modes.

Say, $299 for a 16Gb SxS card, in current prices.

I hear you.
I guess it depends on current manufacturing costs.
$900 is just WAY to much for these 16GB cards.

In no-competition environment, sure they can set prices based on costs.

But since the alternative solution (thanks to you and others who pioneered it!) is only about $170, market rules will apply. (Unless Sony is looking for a part of the bailout package, hehe...)

By the way, current street price of 16Gb SxS card is not $900, it's $740 at B&H:

SanDisk | 16GB ExpressCard Pro Media | SDX-VS-016GR | B&H Photo

(just click "add to shopping cart" to get that lower price.)

I own this card, it is made by Sandisk (second S in SxS moniker), and it works exactly like Sony ones, no issues/errors of any kind.

So we are asking for, roughly, 2x reduction against the current prices, which are grossly inflated in the first place. If not Sony, I'd definitely expect Sandisk to make the move.

And, as the cost of other fast Sandisk media goes down, I'd expect SxS cards to track it and also get lower yet.

By the way... I don't remember if this adapter was ever tested and if it worked or not?

SanDisk | ExpressCard Adapter | SDAD-109R | B&H Photo Video

I believe it was tested. If not, I'm not sure if we want to test it based on the review on the site you posted. It appears it does not have the push/push media slot, so the SDHC card will stick out like the Kensington.

Just done another round of tests with some new transcend 16Gb class 6 cards and the kensington adapter. No issues at up to 48fps S&Q. Perhaps Marten has a fake card, all my Transcend cards have worked perfectly with HQ mode. Spanned, timelapse, short clips, long clips, I can't break them in HQ mode.