I had the macro on for the first portion. I the zoom was in and I hadn't aligned the gg and lens yet.

Macro is similar to what is on this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2977800904&category=29964

I just unscrewed the macro from the w/a. Mine is a little different .45x but same Japan co. It doesn't state the x on the macro.

Tom

Also

Back image is at

http://www.arcsand.com/back.jpg

my bad.

Tom

<<<-- Originally posted by Louis Feng : I have been wondering what stops the camcorder makers to make their lens work the same way as film lens?

If I'm not mistaken a digital camera has the same DOF as film cameras. Can't Sony just use their digital camera parts on the video camcorder? -->>>

the problem is in CCD size. since film frame is aprox. 2,5x bigger than electronic 2/3" professional CCD. so, the DOF is different when the size of CCD is different. all broadcast optics is constructed and work usualy for 2/3" lenses - (read: lenses with mount prepared for 2/3" CCD).

WHEN they construct CCD for whole cameras as big as film frame - the problem will dissapear. of course, none of video equipment producers will just throw their development and research dep. just because we need DOF same as in film. the problem is of course also with the lenses. whey you change your CCD size, you must change the construction of your lenses, so at least 3 major companies will sell then their lenses VERY cheap :)

BUT i.e. arriflex - the maker of most popular 35mm film cameras is working on it. the camera (prototype) is working on proper CCD size - similar to film frame size (bit bigger). and they WILL achieve the same DOF as in film. the arriflex is using normal film lenses.

just a small addition from me.

filip

For Australian visitors to this site here follows a list of some Iplex parts which are worth a look in the event of a 3.5” (95mm) glass disk becoming available for groundglassing. It might be feasable in any event to mount a CD disk on a mandrel and part it down to 95mm OD in a lathe.

Two compact versions of the non-inverting Agus35 could be made. This would include abandoning the
lens tube aligner and returning to the original and simpler method of face-mounting the 35mm lens to the front of the case.

For 7x macro stack or possibly 10x macro if and when it can be sourced :-

Iplex UPVC DWV, DO7210065, 123.100.65, 100X65mm Offset Reducer. for maincase and PD150 mount.

Any plastic pipe that fits the 65mm end of reducer.

Iplex UPVC 65mm DWV, D105.65, 65mm pipe cap. With careful holesawing and filing and face thicknessing, this could be made into a bayonet style mount straight to the PD150. A support stay or rods would need to be added. The lens set
mounts to the 58mm filter thread and clears the inside of the 65mm pipe and cap.

For modified telescope eyepiece lens set adaptor:-

Iplex UPVC DWV, DO7210050, 123.100.50 100X50mm Offset Reducer. for maincase and adaptor which is
to be machined for a snug fit into reducer. Adaptor which carries the lens set, itself screws into 58mm filter thread of PD150.

For both:-

Iplex DIO5100 DWY, 137.100, 100mm UPVC Cap. for front cover, motor mount attachments, lens face mount which can be made integral with the cap with careful holesawing, filing and face thicknessing for Nikon style lenses. For heavy telephotos, a metal mount would be needed. Although the caps are quite thick and firm, possibly a full span metal re-inforcement to prevent downwards sagging would be needed.

Depending upon the type of motor available, a clearance hole might need to be holesawn into the 100mm cap and a smaller cap glued in place over it. The motor and disk in these versions face towards the PD150.

Two 1.5v pen-cell batteries will just fit separately either side of the motor at an angle from the bottom.

Depending upon whether the 3.5” 95mm disks can be had with a smaller centre hole or not, the disk
centre may have to be offset downwards for the hub to clear the image frame.

None of these versions will be ideal for the standard 35mm still camera gate, only the motion picture 35mm widescreen gate, as the smaller disk outer diameter and wider outer edge of the centre hub will confine the image.

I have enquiries pending with Ohara in Japan and Showadenko in Singapore for clear glass substrate
disks.

Ohara cannot supply CD size glass disks in 1mm glass from existing stock. They may be able to supply 3.5” disks with smaller than standard centres.

Why am I chasing glass versus CD disks? My tests so far hint at a superior image with glass. Some
dense bright colours in strong light seemed to bleed together when the spinning CD disk was used. The fixed glass seemed to reproduce the colours a little better. It also may be possible to coat the clear side of the groundglass to reduce internal reflection and scatter from strong pinpoints on the groundglass image.

Wow. Thanks for all your footwork, Bob.

I'm about 1/2 done my latest (third) Agus35 design for my GL1, and by now I'm becoming very exacting with how I dismember and slice CD spindles :) Also, I think I could swim for a good bit in the sea of CDR's I've got here...

You can be sure that when I have it done I will be posting comprehensive pics and a little commentary on a website set up for these endeavors. I have plenty of server space and bandwidth for such a project.

...

Someone recently hit on an idea that I discovered myself -- getting proper flange focal length (the distance from the rear of your film lens and the spinning CD) is very difficult to get, more difficult still to maintain with both surfaces parallel to eachother.

The suggestion that you can keep either the GG or the lens moving is a good idea, and I'm currently working on perfecting the latter...I've purchased a 2" molded aluminum hub from Home Depot that my lens will be affixed to, and with a system of 1/4" screws, metal plates and wingnuts, I plan on rigging it to be adjustable.

However, for those of you trying to put together one of these adapters, what has been your experience? Thinking it over now, I suspect it might be easiest to place the CD motor on some sort of telescoping platform...

- jim

Jim,

I had the same thought. I started looked at breaking apart some Home Depot door hinges and using those to construct a sliding platform along two metal rods extending from the base. If I get lucky, a common rod will be the same size as the hinge post.

Tom

My inclination would to mount the spindle motor on a piece of lexan or any thin stiff stuff, drilled with three holes 120 degree spacing. If making a noise reduction or balance mount, a large holesaw hole through the lexan would suffice to provide the clearance.

Where baseplate to case screws go through, place them as far out from centre as you can go. This will facilitate less tricky adjustment.

Put small compression springs between the lexan and case and use these screws in combination to adjust for objective (SLR Lens) to groundglass back focus and parallelism. Instead of springs you might get away with rubber electrical grommets though these will slump with time. You could also use a huge diameter thin wire spring in the centre around the motor but this would tend to dish the case outwards and the lexan inwards, not good if your nicely black-finished plastic Agus35 is out in the heat.

Hex head (Allen) screws would look cool. When the adjustments are done, lock the screws off with some sealastic.

Tom. It might be my imagination or misinterpretation of your image at http://www.arcsand.com/back.jpg

Are you focussing your camcorder through the centre hole in your CD into the 35mm SLR lens?

For correct relationship between 35mm SLR lens and CD disk see Agus1.jpg on www.dvinfo.net/media/hart

The image can fall anywhere around the CD groundglass zone you want it to as long as it is being projected by the 35mm SLR lens onto it. Your camcorder then aquires this projected image.

If I am getting it wrong please accept my apology and ignore my coments at will.

No. I am projecting onto the cd as described in the discussion. I used the vise-grip platform to extend the motor up and out and the image is projected on the middle to bottom right of the cd.

Must be a weird angle from my still cam. Look at the image from the front. The motor spindle occupies the hole in the cd.

Tom

For those who have lots of CDs now...

I discovered that the fake CDs I had were very poorly made compared to the real CDs (out of balance, wobbly, etc) and decided to try a real cd. I just sanded the label side and it works great and is nearly perfect!

Ryan,

So, you just took a normal CD-R and sanded that? I haven't heard that yet and am still looking for the fake frosted CDs. Several have posted about the Maxwell's and I plan on searching those out as my first attempts at sanding the clear fake CDs were a bit of a disappointment. Please let us know...thanks in advance...

"Normal CDs" are just thin clear plastic discs with a thin filmy layer adhesed to the top.

I have thought about sanding the real CD-Rs because I have enough dud disks laying around.

Some Sony CD-R "Supremas" 25-packs have clear CDs which are the real thing without the metal and top layers but it is a bit of a gamble because others have the molded ones. You can see the guide tracks on the real ones only if you can look inside the pack - not recommended as the retailer will get upset with you.

If you find one, you have to make sure it is the guide track side you use for the groundglass surface. Lightly scratch the surface near to the centre where you won't be looking through with the back of a fingernail. If it is the guide track side, you will see the guide track partially erased or scratched through.

These disks are optically true, spin true and relay a better image than the clear molded ones. You als sometimes get a bit of rainbow flicker with the molded ones across strong contrast boundaries in your image.

So the real ones sanded back from the metal side should also work.

Quick note for Australian builders. If you are using plumbers parts for a large version, the Iplex 65mm caps for quick bayonet lens mounts, machine in a small lathe just fine if the speed is kept low the cutter is sharp and you don't try to take too much at once.

When "holesawing" using the lathe and toolpost, take care to stop the machine as soon as the disk cuts through otherwise it may turn side-on and wedge the cap off-centre.

Easiest method to mount is to expand the chuck jaws from inside against the inner circumference of the cap. Make sure it runs as true as you can get it so that the mount face you machine is 90 degrees to the centreline of the cap so the lens fits squarely with the lens tube and is square to the groundglass.

After its all done and fitted, back focus is set by how far you slide the cap onto the lens tube. By this method you can have several adaptors for different lens mounts.

When a 35mm lens with a 50mm focal length is put on to the camera, what does the DV recorded focal length work out to?

Does a 50mm=5omm or a 24mm=24mm.

Or is it dependent on the DV camera lens?

Make sense?

You're a little unclear in your question. The 35mm lense projects an image on the ground glass. A 50mm lense would result in an image similar to that made in a film camera with a 50mm lense. The camera just records that image. The DV camera has nothing to do with the length.

Thanx Ryan.
Got it. I guess it's time for me to start building.

I just got the recommended pack of Maxwell CD-R's (blue pack) and I got the frosted CD, and let me tell you that it has yeilded better results than my attempts at sanding....it was awesome! I am not even using a fresnel and the image seems to be clear and the DOF is freaking incredible. I am using a Nikon 85mm lens and it is working fine, just a little more zoomed than a 50mm.

Will the fresnel improve the image or is it just for making the image larger on the GG so you don't have to zoom in as far with the camcorder? I imagine the latter...Anyway, on to Bob's suggestions to get rid of the noise. Maybe I can get some tests together tomorrow...we'll see...good luck and happy agusing!!!!

For people still searching for a good magnifying lens...my grandpa had a busted workshop light, one of those that has a magnifying glass with a circular bulb around it, and I was able to extract the lens and it works perfectly.

Seems like pretty decent glass too.

Jeremiah

<<<-- Originally posted by J. Clayton Stansberry :

...Will the fresnel improve the image or is it just for making the image larger on the GG so you don't have to zoom in as far with the camcorder?...

-->>>

Yeah Fresnel will not only magnify but will not distord the image, it magnify and correct it so you just put your dv camera and zoom until no vigneting with no trouble.

I have noticed that i can full zoom and get excellent image by using the SLR camera and DV camera configuration (you put the slr camera and the dv in the slr viewfinder.

Today we started a short film with be used to show up the agus35 comercial capabilities.. we are still waiting for for our roof pentaprims and electronic lens to continue the developing.

Also we want to give compability to XL1s owners.

<<<-- Originally posted by Jeremiah Rickert : ...my grandpa had a busted workshop light, one of those that has a magnifying glass with a circular bulb around it -->>>

Jeremiah,

can you send to someone or make the link to proper page with the picture of that part from the workshop light, just to know what is it about. i didn't understood how it may look.

thanks,

filip

I am in the process of building a project-box agus for my GL2, and came up with this idea for at least getting a preview of shots the right way up/around while you shoot them.

That said, it requires a computer connected to the camera via firewire, and special software. I have tested it with my Mac G5 1.8sp, the software "PixelShox Studio," and a Sony TRV18. Basically the computer-software horizontally and vertically flips the incoming f/w video stream (from the DVcam in CAMERA mode) and displays the results on the computer monitor. The recorded-to-tape footage still must be flipped in post, but now you can have a computer (laptop?) monitor to give you a visual approximation when you shoot/set up shots.

PixelShox is free Video-DJ (VJ) software, and is not available for PC. However there are other PC VJ programs that might (hopefully) be capable of doing the same thing if you are on a PC (check out vjcentral.com).

If anyone is interested, I can give details on how how to use PixelShox to accept the f/w stream, flip/invert it, and display the results full-screen. BTW, PixelShox can also just display the f/w video without flipping/inverting, allowing you to use a mac computer (laptop?) as a kind of field monitor for non-agus setups too.

Note: From what I understand, PixelShox relies heavily on OpenGL h/w acceleration. I'm not sure how usable it is on Mac laptops. I do not own a Mac laptop.

-Isaiah

Have just finished a test on a close-coupled non-inverting Agus35 using the telescope eyepiece lens set I have been carrying on about. With 3/8" taken off my adaptor, closer coupling was possible. The vignetting and barrel distortion went away. ##### ADDENDUM--- AFTER DISMANTLEMENT AND RE-ASSEMBLY, THE BARREL DISTORTION HAS RETURNED AND NO AMOUNT OF RE-ADJUSTMENT HAS MADE IT GO AWAY AGAIN. IN SAFE TV FRAMING IT IS NOT A SEVERE ISSUE. I SHALL FILM SOME MORE TESTS AND ASK CHRIS IF HE WILL POST THOSE RESULTS. #####

The image frame is variable from around the area of the motion picture 35mm widescreen gate which is what the Mini35 does, to about 2/3rds of a 35mm still camera frame.

The test pattern at TV safe framing in adequate light is at the limit of the PD150. There is very slight softening in the corners which sharpens if the centre is softened by shifting camcorder focus.

This Australian plumber's version of the Agus has the case, lens mounts and bayonet mount to the PD150 sourced from PVC plumbers hardware (in two colours, grey and white).

It fits up direct to the PD150 onto the lens hood bayonet fitting. The telescope eyepiece goes into the 58mm filter thread on the PD150 and the lens tube slides on over it. For small lenses up to the 135mm Auto Tamron which I tested today, this would be adequate support in a non-energetic environment.

For larger lenses a base support would be wise as the cutout clearance for the CD groundglass in the PVC lens tube weakens it.

The CD spindle motor came from a deceased CD player.

The lens set came from a 2" 42mm telescope eyepiece which I had bought from a camera store to make up a second NV relay prototype. A 10x single element close-up lens will be way cheaper though it may soften the corners more than the eyepiece does. It also may not permit close coupling right up to the front of the camcorder case.

There are some .jpg joined before-and-after images of focus pulls with Agus35 to PD150 after the firm lens mounts were made from the PVC pipe caps.
The images have filenames which look like agusfs2.jpg or similar. Thanks to kennelmaster Chris for posting them.

The 35mm lenses were 1970s Tamron Adaptamatics of 28mm f2.8 and 135mm f2.8 and a Micro-Nikkor 55mm f2.8. The 55mm and 135mm give good fill of light into the corners. I haven't tried the long lenses yet as they need added support. The 28mm f2.8 has a distinct hotspot in the centre, about 4 f-stops worth. These were all relayed via the 1x +2x +4x Hoya close-up lens stack.

Someone posted that the blue 25 pack of maxell cd-r's came with the frosted CDs. What is the spindle called precisely?

I picked up a blue maxell spindle, and it was $25, and of course when I cracked it open, no frosted CDs. They were called CD-R Pro and they were the only blue spindles at Office Max and Staples.

So....what's the precise name of the CD-R's with the frosted CD?

Thanks!

Jeremiah

For all who are using a discman motor with 2AA baterries, i got some news...

IT WONT SPIN FAST ENOUGH... well, the worst part is that we noticed this after we shoot a whole day.

So, what i suggest is to replace it with a 9v battery, just be sure not to forget to shut it down once the shoot ends.

Bob Hart's latest images are up! See directory at http://www.dvinfo.net/media/hart.

Agus.

If you have another disk and can easily mount it, put that one in and write some numbers and some big, small and tiny marks around the disk. Do some test recording and see if the numbers and marks are clear and move past fairly slowly or can't be seen except as blurry arcs. If they can be seen it means the disk rpm is close to camera frame rate or a multiple or fraction of it.

I find that flickering happens at several speeds as the disc revs up. The discman motor rpm might be close to the camera frame rate or a multiple of it.

Instead of putting more power to the motor you might get away with finding something between 1.5v and 3v by using a resistor and running the motor slightly slower.

good idea,

i will check the footage of yesterday, if it doesnt flicker, may be those words of "at 200mph i got no friends" will be true. Cause damn the disc is spining fast at 9v ....

Agus. Please re-read my post above. I dropped half a sentence out of the first paragraph when I cut and pasted it in so a piece was missing when you read it.

For all, I have just sent Chris a large .jpg file of tests done with the telescope eyepiece as a relay lens. These are also comparison frames of 4:3 and 16:9 through the same 35mm objective lens. The .jpg file is identified by the filename aguswscr.jpg

The good news is, you can use your Century Optics 16:9 anamorphic in front of the 55mm Micro Nikkon f2.8 and probably all the other 50mm or thereabouts SLR lenses. It also works on the Tamron 130mm f2.8 so will likely work on other lenses between 50mm and 130mm. On the 300mm it is decidedly furry but will hold focus on closer objects so may work on the longer lens if more attention is paid to back focus. I had not been too meticulous with it as I was changing lenses back and forth.

A side note - I would not recommend taking your Agus35 into a conflict zone unless you can make it look like something totally benign, like paint it canary yellow or pink or something, definitely not black. It may make somebody nervous and get you shot. A humble public passing by, became a bit agitated and made that comment to me this evening. It apparently looks like an old fashioned Elliot Ness tommy gun sawn off.

Hey guys I need a 37mm macro lens that will work with this setup. What do you suggest?

<<<-- Originally posted by Jeremiah Rickert : Someone posted that the blue 25 pack of maxell cd-r's came with the frosted CDs. What is the spindle called precisely?

I picked up a blue maxell spindle, and it was $25, and of course when I cracked it open, no frosted CDs. They were called CD-R Pro and they were the only blue spindles at Office Max and Staples.

So....what's the precise name of the CD-R's with the frosted CD?

Thanks!

Jeremiah -->>>

Jeremiah,

I also almost made the same mistake. The packages are very similar, but it is the Blue 50 pack that says Maxwell CD-R only...NOT PRO. If you look through the top you should be able to see that there is a different CD on the top that is "fuzzy" rather than clear. I picked mine up at Wal-Mart of all places after not finding it at Best Buy, Office Depot or Target. Good Luck, and you won't be dissappointed when you get it!

<<<-- Originally posted by Mike Tesh : Hey guys I need a 37mm macro lens that will work with this setup. What do you suggest? -->>>

check this site. i think that it will be dificult to find proper +10 macro 37mm. maybr the solution is to buyadapter ring bigger than 37. i beleive that it's easier to find larger macro lens (49,52,58 etc...)

but anyhow - check this site. i didn't checked it properly, but just find it a while ago.

www.2filter.com

Part 1 of a very, very rough tutorial on building an Agus35 for a Canon GL1/GL2 or Sony VX-1000/2000:

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/

- jim

Great job on the tutorial. If thats rough can't wait to see the finished version. Do you plan to leave these pages up? If so do you mind if I link to them from my site?

Paul
http://www.thecountrybulletin.com/dv_dof.com
(Soon as I get time it will be www.dvdof.com)

Jim.

Lots of work obviously went into creating a very comprehensive tutorial.

Commendations are the order of the day here.

Where did you get the parts for connecting the lens and the GL1 Jim?

Folks. Chris has put the 16:9 comparison .jpg up for me at www.dvinfo.net/media/hart. You'll find it as aguswscr.jpg

The images were made with a Century Optics 16:9 anamorphic adaptor offered up to the front of the 35mm type lens. The right side image pair has scratches. Ignore those. I forgot to switch the groundglass on.

Thank you Filip however I was unable to find the lenses there. However I did some searching and found a lens set.

http://www.bugeyedigital.com/product_main/tif-02005.html

Not that expensive and can be used as just a +7, +10 or in combination as a +17

Good for anyone using Sony single chip cameras that have 37mm threading.

My JVC has a 27mm threading but I bought a step up ring off ebay for $5.50.

I found this site through this guys review of the filters:

http://www.pmichaud.com/wiki/Reviews/LensAdapter

Bob Hart,

I am sorry that I have not kept up with all of your posts, but could you drop an answer to if you are using real ground glass or not? Or, direct me to the page where you answered this? I know you have been working on it...thanks in advance.

Clay

Paul and Bob - thank you for your kind words.

I intend on keeping this tutorial up for quite some time, improving it as time allows, but keeping it at the same general locale - http://ideaspora.net/agus35 - so feel free to link away. I wouldn't mind if you mention my name on your page, though - Jim Lafferty - I'm making every effort I can to be recognized as a filmmaker and so every bit counts :)

As for this question:

Where did you get the parts for connecting the lens and the GL1 Jim?

The short answer is Home Depot. The long answer is I can't remember whether it was the plumbing section, or the electrical section of the store, but I spent a lot of time and quite a few trips getting all my parts. For the GL1, a conduit hub measuring 2.5 inches works perfectly -- for SLR lenses, a 2 inch hub works well.

Incidentally, as I'm building my rail system, a heads-up to any of you ambitious enough to make them on your own - Home Depot has a little nook with threaded rails that measure in lengths from one to six feet, with diameters of either 5/16ths or 3/8ths being best for our purposes.

I'm going with 5/16ths and pairing the rails with corner braces from the "hinge" department, some washers, bolts and wingnuts.

Incidentally, I've found that 5/16ths nuts -- for some reason -- do not thread onto 5/16ths rails properly. 5/16ths wingnuts, however, thread through just fine. Hence, you'll see the use of wingnuts with my rail setup...

Here are some images to give you an idea:

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/corner_brace.jpg
http://ideaspora.net/agus35/railjoint.jpg
http://ideaspora.net/agus35/rails_front.jpg
http://ideaspora.net/agus35/rails_front_detail.jpg

- jim

Hey that one looksl ike mine ! heheheh

nice rails dude, they are really useful.

BTW, i solve the flipping problem with a cheap pentaprism...

but if you lose too much lightin the process i solve it putting a telescope mount with prism inside at the end of the little viewfinder in the dv camera.

Agus where did you get the pentaprism from?

And is there any way you could put up a simple little diagram of how yours is put together with the pentaprism?

Thanks

I found a source for REAL glass CD's!!!....well sorta. My buddy is gonna try and get one for me from a recording studio. Apparently they use glass CD's for master cuts of songs so they last forever called a "Glass Master" I should have more info in a few days.

WOO HOO!!

check this out http://www.disctronics.co.uk/technology/manuf/rep_master.htm

John

Sorry Jim, I actually meant the parts connecting the 50mm lens to the adapter and the GL1 to the adapter?

Clay.

My tests have been a mixture of fixed groundglass and rotary CD. The .jpg images "agusday" 1 and 2, and "fixed groundglass" 1 to 5, at the address www.dvinfo.net/media/hart used the fixed real groundglass (microscope slide) and had by far the best resolution in spite of not spinning and being in a very improvised enclosure (Pringles Crisps tube).

I have not yet been able to get hold of a glass disk. The Ohara disk I was chasing is apparently a special glass doped to hold an electric charge and it's green but there are other glass disk products available. The Ohara guy in Japan has been really good at answering e-mails. I have yet to go back to the internal website he directed me to for a look.

John.

The CD glass masters may end up being a bit thick and a bit large, but they may use smaller ones for doing the CD business cards or smaller CD mini disks. Please let us know the outcome.

To all.

Taking things to a ridiculous extreme, I tried a Proskar 2x Anamorphic 16 Cinemascope projection lens on front of the Nikon 55mm. It works quite well.

It apparently looks like an old fashioned Elliot Ness tommy gun sawn off. -->>>

Has a whole new meaning to shooting:)

Howdy from Texas,

Bob's latest images are up...

http://www.dvinfo.net/media/hart

"Attached are the .jpg images of the Agus35 Australian Plumber's Version I refer to. These have not been cropped or manipulated and were created on a document scanner so should be faithful as to dimensions except the pic of the Agus attached to the PD150 which is grossly distorted. Aside for the PD150 the doc scanner is the only other electronic cam I have. There is also a demo of the Tamron 135mm with a shot taken in bright day f16@ASA 200 level
lighting at about 2pm."

Check the date listing for these most recent pics... or Bob might post the specific file names. Hope this helps,

Sorry Jim, I actually meant the parts connecting the 50mm lens to the adapter and the GL1 to the adapter?

That's in the tutorial, man :)

The grey metal coupling is a 2" conduit hub from Home Depot, the mount is a Nikon F mount taken from an F-to-C adapter I got at B&H.

Check the tutorial again -- I added a lot of links today.

- jim

Thanks for doing this Jim, makes alot easier for us hacks.
Looking forward to part 2.