At the risk of repeating information in the same thread, the GL1/2 can only focus in macro mode when completely zoomed out, which means the projected image will definitely not be filling the frame.

So yes, it can focus that close, but not in any way useful to what you're doing here. It will still need the lens.

I call it the Agus35 Mark III.

http://www.sillydaddy.com/Agus35_MarkIII.html

I Haven't shot any video with it yet, I need to close the sides and build a way to mount it to my video camera and maybe paint it.

I'm thinking a bellows would look really cool and make it look like a professional piece of equipment.

Also a cover over the motor and battery would help make it look nicer.

A few of notes,

I used the bolts so I could adjust the distance from the lens to the GG. The double nuts are tightend agains each other but not tight toward the front. This lets the bolt spin.

I used Blind Nuts/T-Nuts on the back. I cut the barbs off and smoothed them down. I then put them through the back and used some hot glue to hold them.

Once I got the distance right, I put nuts on the part of the bolts that protruded from the back and tightened them to hold it all in place.

The cost so far....

$1.50 for the 1/8" hardboard
$3.00 for the bolts, nuts and washers
$0 for the CD motor and spindle, The player was broken ($12.00 for a new player)
$0 for the GG, It was lying around in an empty CD spindle.
$2.50 for Battery Holder

Have anyone even tried to put the fresnel before the GG ? i havent have any success, so i put it after it using a magnifying lens.

Ok, here are some new pics of the adapter.

http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter01.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter02.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter03.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter04.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter05.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter06.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter07.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter08.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter09.jpg
http://altoque.tv/35mmAdapter/adapter13.jpg


BTW... tom, let me tell you that you need to close that box, or the outside light will ruin the image, you need to make a camera obscura, and all the GG have to be covered... (no peeking !)

If using a GL2 I think a macro lens or fresnel lens will necessary because I put my frosted cd right up to the lens, and it doesn't completley fill it as you can either see the center piece of the cd or the outer edge. Anyone got any links to a macro filter for the GL2 please?

How about these?

Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000050M6M/ref=nosim/camerasandcameras-20/103-4001806-7861433)

Porters Camera Store (http://porterscamerastore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=07-1961&Category_Code=F2A)

Agus,

Two questions: How did you attach your GG to the spindle? That's an awfully large hole to close... How did you keep it perfectly parallel to the lenses?

I'm redesigning mine. Pics up shortly.

- jim

I've just dismantled an old cd player and taken out the motor, but my queston is where do i put the wires??? i cant seem to get it to run

Noah,

Cut the positive and negative wires leading to the motor (red and black) and make sure you leave the wires long enough. Then, you need to connect them to a switch or directly to a battery pack (both can be purchased at Radio Shack). The battery pack will also have red and black wires, connect those together. For the switch, connect the two red wires to the switch, then the black ones together (I think). They also have a switch that allows for connecting the negatives to it. Hope that explains it.

Clay

Almost got the full package now. Got some fresnel lenses this morning. Can't wait to give this bad boy a try.

Anyone know if its safe to run a CD motor from a 9v battery?

And is the fresnel lens purpose to increase the image size that is projected onto the cd?

Thanks

the cd motor runs to fast in my opinion with 2 AAA batteries which is like 3 volts... so to answer your question on the 9 volt battery, its a negative. 1 triple A would probably the best case but not the easiest to pull off... 2 AAA is probably worth settling for

Thanks.
I'm still having a problem finding a macro adapter that will work with the GL2. Been looking all morning with no luck.

Any recommend any?

what people refuse to understand is that a normal macro adapter DOES NOT work. What most people are using is a cheap wide angle lens made for the smaller cameras. if you rip the lens off it has a special macro magnify lens inside that works. However for people like me and you who own a prosumer camera with a 58mm attachment this sucks because all we can do is put the smaller wide angle adapter on the camera and zooom in so that we don't see the ring from the adapter. This causes some zoom issues, as when you have the adapter working you are zoomed in a bit and when you move the camera it then reacts like a camera that is zoomed in a bit. And if you have ever tried to move a camera while zoomed in you know the remendous shake and control issues. I have been to numerous camera stores and explained that i needed such a lens for a 58mm camera and they say no such lens exists... it would have to be made special order and we're not even going to discuss how much a special order lens would cost to be made.

The problem lies in that the macro lens is not made to be zoomed into and you need to zoom a little to get rid of the black edge areas on the Ground glass projection.

I am thinking the magnifying glass (fresnal) plastic sheet people in this threat have bought from wallgreens will solve the problem and for only 5 bucks... I have bought one but my working 35mm adapter i no longer together... but it appears like it should do the job. If I am wrong please correct me.

Thanks peter, I shall be testing with my fresnel lens. Does the fact that it has circular grooves in it matter?

I have not built a unit with it yet... but by placing it infront of my camers lens and putting stuff infront of it, I didn't see any of the grooves... That doesn't mean they wernt there.... this wasn't a full test. I got the magnalens last night....

I think whoever suggested the lens a few pages back would have said something sooner if you could see the grooves...

but again I'm just assuming.

Century Optics makes a $210 +7 macro (they call it an "achromatic diopter") fitted for the 58mm threading of the GL1/GL2. There is also a cheaper version -- $70 -- a larger version of the kind of lens Agus is using, on eBay.

I have and can report good experiences with the Century Optics lens.

I'm also of the opinion that a CD motor will not work -- it doesn't spin at a high enough rate.

- jim

Jim -

I was told by more than 2 camera stores that the century would not do what we are looking for it to do...

and what are your experiences with the cd motor which make you think it is not fast enough?

Please share!

Well, I called Century and spoke to a woman who seemed very informed about their lenses. This was before I bought it, mind you, though now having had it for a few days I can assure you that with the achromatic diopter rated +7, you will be able to place your camera within inches of the source of focus and zoom to fill frame. In fact, the higher the rating of the diopter's power, the closer you HAVE TO keep your DV cam to your target image. +2 lets you get about a foot out; +7 forces you to close the ditance to under 4 inches.

I put together a quick-n-dirty Agus35 last week, housed in a Radio Shack project box and it failed for more than one reason. I suspect that its largest failing was in spinning the disc at a high enough rate as to maintain a satisfactory image. What I got at the time was footage that looked to have been heavily gaussian blurred, with foreground details surrounded by a halo of fuzz, and background details falling off into a mess of noise.

Yesterday, I started a new design, based around Agus's latest pics, which give some insight into his success:

1) He uses a motor with high rotation
2) He's got everything about the adapter placed within inches of the DV camera's lens, which I imagine helps to maintain a high degree of the original image.
3) He said that his GG was sanded with 600 grit, originally, but now reveals that he would have preferred 1000 grit or higher.

With that said, here's the progress of my new Agus35:

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/front.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/rear.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/motor.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/assembled.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/motordetail.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/sanded.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/finished.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/finishedmount.jpg

http://ideaspora.net/agus35/finishedrear.jpg

Computerwise, I am a technical luddite and have not the knowing of some probably simple things.

If someone can tell me how and where to upload a .pdf or turbocad .tcw file which can then be found here, I will put up a diagram of an adaptor for PD150/VX2000, which contains two telescope eyepiece lenses I put together to aquire and frame within an 18mm diameter circular intensifier tube display.

This is too small for the Agus35 and will only demonstrate a principle. As a zoom-through device it works fine with the PD150 and requires only a minor camcorder refocus for different zoom settings.

It required low to average hobby level machining skill to build on a small Taiwanese lathe taking about six hours.

Alternative lenses of a lower magnification might be available as trade parts for some other application and might be usable in an altered arrangement of my adaptor.

Bob,

E-mail Chris Hurd at chris@dvinfo.net. He has the ability to post your file (if a decent size) to the forum.

Clay

Has anyone had any luck building this for the DVX 100 or set it up with the Acromatic Diopter and a sort tube to place the lens in?

Jim - how is your new adapter working?

Hey Jim,

I can't see any ground glass on your pictures!!! New design? :)

Hey guys, how is it going... i am seeing plenty of Agus35 adapters being built lately, and that make me really proud :) !!!

OK, for the ones that are using the CD motor, it is awesome it locks up perfectly with zero vibration, also those fakes cds that comes sanded from factory are also 100% perfect.

Currently i am solving the problem that soon you will be into, that is how to put the adapter into the camera, and actually work with it. so i am making a support base, using only electric lamps parts, that cost almost nothing.

Now, i am working really hard now to make a comercial version, which will cost less than 1k, complete with support base, metal rods, and the image will come up perfectly, it wont be necesary to flip it up. Also, this new adapter, will be hermetic, so no dust will ruin the image (problem that we dont have cause there are no mirrors and the GG is spining always. Then let me tell ya, that we are planning to build it for small size cams, like my TRV18 to the GL2, we dont want to make it to the XLS1, cause its lens is too big and we actually dont have one :)...

DVX100 seens like a problem too, cause of the size of the lens, SO, i will need soon any volunteer that can give us the size of the lens diameter (not the lens size, but the whole thing) so we can calculate how to make most cameras to fit to the new adapter.

So, we need only the Size and model of camera, please send an email to agus@altoque.tv, send your name, cause it will be saved then in case you want our adapter and will make a special price !!!

Ok, hope all the adapters that you are building works like mine, cause it is GREAT !!!!! and soon you will have an option to buy a comercial version (make of steel and good plastic) which will flip the image, and make no vigneting and will be all calibrated so there will be no distorsion of the image.

Originally posted by Peter Sciretta : Jim - how is your new adapter working?

It isn't, for the moment. I'm waiting on a Nikon F mount adapter from B&H before proceeding, and also on some advice I was hoping to get from Agus on mounting my GG to the spindle...

So, Agus -- you say you're using a CD motor now?

- jim

yeah, and it works great, also the speed is really good, dunno why they said that it wasnt.

Those using the CD motor, what batteries are you using and how many to get the speed right? 2 AA, 2 AAA, 3AAA?????

hello there,
i'm mailing from poland.

i can't beleive that i finally found the group which is co fascinated with this adapter. since i saw original pro35 adapter, i spend lot of hours drawing and thinking about it - how to build my own adapter - and then, yesterday - i found this marvelous gruop. i must say that i didn't sleep after reading ALL posts here.

congratulations to all of you!

my special hello to agus as a pioneer in this field!

what can i say more, but - I'M IN !!!!!

filip

"Now, i am working really hard now to make a comercial version, which will cost less than 1k, complete with support base, metal rods, and the image will come up perfectly, it wont be necesary to flip it up."


...and when will it be available? Roughly. Hope to see the final result of the clip. :)

Agus,

Please make mine a black XL please.

- don

Agus... just an amazing thread here... lot's a smart people have joined in, i'm still gathering parts and pieces for my XL1S version but things are looking good, in the meantime, we need an Agus35™ logo to put on our projects-that's to make them official.... Maybe something we can print out and "stencil" on with a spray can or air brush. I done tons of them, so if you need any help feel free to email me at dinor@hotmail.com...

onward!
D

...and just like that...you are famous!
Wow!!!

I'll take a couple stickers, a black Large shirt, and a membership into the fan club!
Great idea Dino! I'll definitely stencil it on mine (once it's done of course).

hey people, sorry to leave you guys hangen. I went on vacation. I will post some footage tommorow. Right now im tired.

John

John - can't wait to see some footage...

Agus - what brand cds did you find the "allready frosted cds" in???? A bunch of people have tried asking you this question a couple times... and you have yet to answer... I have gone through

fujifilm - 30 pack (1gg disc) bought at radio shack

philips - 30 pack (1gg disc) bought at Best Buy, was cheap and came in a 50 spindal case.

Unknown Brand 100 pack $20 at best buy included 4 gg discs

But none have been pre frosted... so what brand are you finding these gems in?

On the topic of macro lenses, wouldn't something like this work?

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=11209&is=REG

It's a 58mm +10 B+W brand macro lens. I don't know if it's really 58mm or if it's a 37mm lens threaded for 58mm, but if it's really a 58mm lens, it'd be quite useful for this, especially since it's +10 like that, you'd be able to have a very thin adapter by having the GG so close to the camera.

Agus

If you're planning on making and selling a pro version of the Agus35, are you still going to release the plans on how to make the amateur version?

Can anyone else post the plans on how it's done? There's lots of photos but it would be nice to have some detailed descriptions of what to do ie how much sanding of the fake cd must be done, how to line up what the 36mm lens sees withe the camcorders lens etc etc

Well done to all the guys who are helping this thread move forward!

Regards

Terry

I just sanded a cd with 600 grit paper (I used 300 before on a previous cd) and no matter how much I sand the cd with the 600 grit the image projected is not as good as the 300 grit... what am i doing wrong?

Hi Guys

I've just been to a glaziers and asked about having the fake cd made out of glass and was told that it could be made out of 4mm Satin glass. It will cost about £6 to have it made.

I asked if it could be made about 1-2mm and was told that it wasn't possible to cut glass any shallower than 4mm.

Does anyone know if this type of glass would work?

Regards

Terry

I'm thinking that maybe the glass would be too heavy for a cd motor. If you have a more powerful motor however it might work

To: Terry Wright. I don't think your satin glass is going to work. First up you've got a balance problem, then there's the power issue as mentioned in another response. The satin glass that I know also transmits too much light, is not finely opaque enough to adequately work as a projection screen as fine ground glass or etched glass would.

To: Everyone. Here's one slightly out of what you US folks call left field. Some years ago I thought I would do a conscientious thing and clean a rear projection screen on a Teleray motion picture film viewer.What I didn't know was the frosted glas wasn't. Instead it was a fine mist coat of something which cleaned off instantly very nicely.

I ended up using a piece of plastic shop bag stretched tightly over the glass sheet. It had a few wrinckles but did the job.

A piece of shop bag, Mitre 10 Hardware and Officeworks shop bags as used in Australia seem best, more opacity, less variation in thickness.

Pressed between two clear CD disks it seems to display an image without too much flare but still not as good as a ground glass. I arrived at this through ransacking my imagination on how to achieve a uniform coat of wax on the surface of a clear disk then thought of pressing it between two and giving it a few seconds or more in a microwave to melt the wax. Getting rid of the bubbles is a real cow.

Another good opaque material is the motor vehicle registrations stickers were have here, unfortunately in too small a piece. I have not got round to finding the source as I diverged from the project onto something else.

(The original project was to devise an oscillating groundglass for the film plane of any 35mm SLR camera, motor to fit in the space where the film canister goes but then I realised there would have had to have been too much electronic trickery to keep the glass moving in phase with the scanning frame rate of the camcorder and vibration would have been an issue, so I did not go there.)

I've just received my 8x10" ground glass that I purchased on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=29981&item=2968796829

Now to find someone who can precision cut it into an 7" circle and drill hole in the middle.

I have to say I think this will work much better than a scratched cd.

Hey Agus, sounds like you have perfected the adapter. Can you post some new footage of your masterpiece? Inside and outside with natural light? I have all the materials for the adapter and plan on building one for the Panasonic DVX100. I am just concerned with the size of the ground glass that may be needed for projection. Also a question which hasn't been addressed which is will it work with an anamorphic adapter? Thanks.

I dont know which packs of cds will bring the already sanded disk, i just found it while i was looking something else in my room, but i call for a friend that buys tons and tons of cds in spindle and also had a few...

i only bought Imation, Samsung, and some other brand, so tried up those brands.

about the anamorphic adapter, well nope it wont work, you need some adapter that either replace the SLR lens, or put it in front.

I will try to put some pics of the new footage as soon as possible

This is an email that I received from the P&S people.

"Our Mini35Digital image converter works with anamorphic lenses. You can simply attach the lenses onto the converter and then you will be shooting in anamorphic. Good anamorphic lenses that we can recommend are the Elite lenses available from Slow Motion, USA"

I think there is a possibility that it might work. Theoretically if the anamorphic was the outer lens projecting into your main lens then the adapter would be projecting a squished image, which can be un-squished in post. The image size would be the same as if we didn't use the anamorphic. This is just my theory. Any additional input would be greatly appreciated.

Geez, I hope this doesn't turn into a "Why are quality Anamorphic Lenses so expensive???" thread!

You would have to adapt the lens in front of the adaptor and relay lens with the anamorphic adaptor or use a full-on anamorphic len$. To clarify, everything needs to be done before the spinning glass image plane, unless you are using a cam with true 16:9 chips - but then you wouldn't have the need for an anamoprhic adaptor, unless you wanted "pseudo 2:35:1"

- don

hello there,

i think that usable GG can be cutted out from simple/single protective BOX for CDs/DVDs as used in rental video stores.
as i remember - you can find them also frosted.
(cannot check it rigth now in video rental - it's 3a.m. here in poland)

maybe i'm wrong, maybe the GG from the protective box is just too thick, but... - it's just a thought.

filip

Ok,

here are some news, for all the interested, i have decided to release a commercial version of the adapter, made with good hard material (alluminiun and plastic)

It will also include the support base with 15mm rods, using standards measures for compatibilty with other cine accesories, a matte box, and of course the adapter.

Now, i need some help here...

we are still working on flipping the image, seens like it is hard to find a solution, that will not raise the costs to high, cause listen to this... we want to sell the whole system for under 1k !!

Also we want to give compability for all kind of lenses, so you wont need to buy adaptors for each type of lenses, we will provide the pieces.

Ok,

so we need some creative ideas for flipping the image, and please we need some pictures of your cameras, Taylor sent us his pics of the DVX with complete measure of the lens. We need this info to give as most compability to all type of cameras as possible so you wont need to buy aditional items to make it work.

For XL users, let me tell ya it is a tricky camera, and we dont have one to try it up. but we will try also to give compability to it as well.

So,

please any ideas, post them here, and all images and size measures of your cameras please send them to agus@altoque.tv

Thanks for all your support, and we will be working our ass as hard as possible so we can bring the first version in January if possible at a very very low introducing price.

the whole system will be really cheap and the we guarantee 100% perfect picture with no vigneting at all.

BTW we shoot some new footage with a improved version which could be considered the BETA version (sorry no pics for now and video still rendering with film effects)

Very good news.

The Bolex H16 groundglass viewfinder path might be worth studying. Objective lens>>>90degree prism>>>groundglass(on one face of prism)>>>lens>>>90degree prism or mirror>>>eyepiece diopter>>>

It is however, a long path and on a 35mm scale might be unwieldy. With this method, the rotating groundglass disk would have to be mounted horizontally.

Hi Agus (and everyone),


Wouldn't it be best to simply find a way to attach the camera upside-down? That way, you don't have to worry about adding new optical devices inside the AGUS35...

Congratulations for your ideas BTW.

Cheers,


Emmanuel

I think the best (i.e cheapest and most easily effective) way to flip the image would be to attach a mirror setup to a flipped LCD screen (in mirror mode).

- jim

agus, thanks for the info.

about flipping the picture. i thought about turning the lcd display about 150 degrees just before the camera starts flipping the picture again. then put a mirror in front of the lcd and the picture should then only have the horizontal flip but is not upside down anymore and can be viewed when standing behind or beside the camera. the final flipping horizontal and vertical can then be made in post.

about camera measures: could you please post the camera models you allready have the measures of, so people dont send the same modelmeasurments again and again.

does anyone have a website where all the pictures and infos are collected?

does anyone know how many diopters the conversion lens must have to use the pd-150/vx-2000 with the agus35 i only own a +4 lens but that was not enough.

Thomas