You can do this with generated media, compositing, and 3D parent track motion but it’s a lot of work are you really have to be well versed in 3D track motion to pull it off. It would be much easier to use a 2D animation program or hire an animator to do it.

~jr

When you say 2d do you mean simply sliding a fixed object across the screen or can I have say 4-6 versions of the same object with the stick legs in different positions so I can change them out in succesion to make it appear that the bird is walking. The bird itself is 2 dimensional.

Jeff

I have found that if I IMPORT from the DVD and mpg file is created that is fine. But on one DVD I decided to just bring over the VOB and although it played - the sound started out ok and then progressively got out of sync as the clip plays.

Any ideas as to why that would happen? I just did a straight copy to the HD.

Editing my first widescreen wedding with Vegas 6 and even though I've got the stills I'm using at 720X480, and it all looks fine when I preview the project in Vegas, when I render out to wmv for my site the stills don't conform to the same letterboxing that all the video does. I've checked and unchecked 'maintain aspect ratio' and am unable to figure this one out. Is it just because I'm rendering into wmv format, or will I have the same problem with the final render to widescreen mpg?
I'm clueless here...

Yes, totally. Just animate in the traditional way...

Work up all of the cells that you need in photoshop. Just the chic on transparency (Vegas works with Photoshop transparency with no problem), then save them as sequentially numbered images.

Imposrt them as a sequence, then use track motion to move the chick across the screen.

Legs move, chick moves, that's it. It's traditional animation!

DJ

ok, sounds great.

I have never done an animation before. Any comments on how I can learn to do this if I have all of the parts?

Jeff

This won't help in the traditional way, but I just want to say that photos have always given me fits. I've resized photos again and again in Photoshop, changed pixel aspect ratio, and it's always a case of accidentally stumbling across the right settings. Suddenly it works and I leave it alone.

Matching pictures to video has always been a major problem for me.

Looking forward to a straight answer on picel aspect ratios and size.

DJ

Glad I'm not the only one, DJ. I achieved some success by changing the template in pan/crop on the photos, but I still get a pic slightly taller than the video when outputting to a wmv. I also think part of my problem is that I'm using 3d on the track. I'll let you know if I stumble on the right solution here.

windows media is square pixel, you're starting with non-square pixel.
you can tick the "stretch to fill" at render, and you won't see those borders, or you can preview it at square by right clicking the Preview Window and turning OFF "simulate display device etc"

Hi all

I've put this in the Vegas forum because thats what I use and I want to refer to some Vegas menu options.

I need a bit of help getting my head round aspect ratios and compression. Aspect ratios first...

I live in PAL-ville by the way....

OK - I know that a PAL picture size is 720x576 - which is a ratio of 1.25:1. I also know that pixels aren't square. For a 16:9 project you have to multiply by 1.4568 = 1048/576 = 1.82 - er which is just over 16:9 - but I think this is something to do with hidden pixels - so not too bothered about that.
When I render in Vegas in as either PAL DV or PAL DV widescreen I get exactly the same result when viewed back in Windows Media Player - a correct proportion picture. How does Media Player know that this is a 16:9 file - does the render process put a flag in the file. Because my under standing is that computer pixels are square - therefore I would have expected to see a picture 1.25:1 format. I guess Media player simulates the 16:9 by using more horizontal pictures? Which takes me onto compression....

If I render as n uncompressed avi I DO get a picture in media player with a ratio of 1.25:1 (I measured it!!!) and it looks vertically stretched. Oh and I almost ran out of disk space!!!!

If, after I render, i want to put the output file thorugh another standalone program (to deinterlance for instance), sn't it best to save it as uncompressed so that nothing is lost when taken into the stand alone program? Or would you render as PAL DV in Vegas and then render as uncompressed in the next program in the chain - or am I just losing the plot?

Finally - there is a template for PAL DV and PAL Standard - I can't see the difference.

Sorry it's a long one guys!

Ian

Hi all

I've put this in the Vegas forum because thats what I use and I want to refer to some Vegas menu options.

I need a bit of help getting my head round aspect ratios and compression. Aspect ratios first...

I live in PAL-ville by the way....

OK - I know that a PAL picture size is 720x576 - which is a ratio of 1.25:1. I also know that pixels aren't square. For a 16:9 project you have to multiply by 1.4568 = 1048/576 = 1.82 - er which is just over 16:9 - but I think this is something to do with hidden pixels - so not too bothered about that.
When I render in Vegas in as either PAL DV or PAL DV widescreen I get exactly the same result when viewed back in Windows Media Player - a correct proportion picture. How does Media Player know that this is a 16:9 file - does the render process put a flag in the file. Because my under standing is that computer pixels are square - therefore I would have expected to see a picture 1.25:1 format. I guess Media player simulates the 16:9 by using more horizontal pictures? Which takes me onto compression....

If I render as n uncompressed avi I DO get a picture in media player with a ratio of 1.25:1 (I measured it!!!) and it looks vertically stretched. Oh and I almost ran out of disk space!!!!

If, after I render, i want to put the output file thorugh another standalone program (to deinterlance for instance), sn't it best to save it as uncompressed so that nothing is lost when taken into the stand alone program? Or would you render as PAL DV in Vegas and then render as uncompressed in the next program in the chain - or am I just losing the plot?

Finally - there is a template for PAL DV and PAL Standard - I can't see the difference.

Sorry it's a long one guys!

Ian

Just when I think I'm getting my head around 16:9 technical stuff, you set it spinning again. See recent discusssion here:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?p=476719#post476719

Sorry about that Chris.

I'll have aread of that thread.

Also - just to avoid any confusion (er, any MORE confusion) - I'm shooting using a 16:9 camera.

Ian

Yea, when I say 2D I mean cell animation. Product’s like Bauhaus Mirage will allow you to do onion skinning so you can see the previous frames in the animation and line them up properly. I don’t expect you to spend all that money or time learning an animation package that detailed which is why I said, hire somebody.

~jr

Thanks for the info.

Jeff

As usual you were 'spot' on. Thank you for bailing my sorry butt out once again with your editing expertise, DSE. Being my first widescreen project, I see I have a bit to learn about pixel shapes, eh?

I don't remember the website, you'll have to google it, but Moho allows for bones to be implanted in a 2D vector graphic, and then you can keyframe the bones to move the object, its an excellent piece of software for basic character animation, and you can learn it overnight. Highly reccomend it for this sort of work.

edit: http://www.lostmarble.com/

-raza

LOL,

I just don't know how you market yourself, shoot video, edit, keep up with everything there is to know about Vegas and the wedding industry, and still manage to participate in these forums it seems 24/7.

I'm beginning to think you are an android....

I have had the same burdens especially with broken edges and fast motion. I have worked it out though with a cool guy from Sony. My m2t files have to be loaded onto timeline and rendered to intermediate codec. Work with those files and render to NTSC DV stock or 720p 2,3. Those are the only two that work for me. Every other combination, and i mean hundreds of "custom" combinations are horrible. Interlacing issues and bottom field first wiped me out for weeks. I rendered a 10 second motion clip 51 diff times and saved the output to compare the only two options were as listed. Sony has stated they have some .exe conflicts with xp background files that can play havoc with renders. I have the email if its needed identifying the conflicting exe's

Anyone know how to recreate that 16-18 fps look to mimic the old 8 or super8 mm choppy filmlook in Vegas? A script or filter maybe?


Have you tried Vegas own "Film Effects" Fx?

You get : Jitter; Dust; Scratches; HAIR!; Flicker and Dust .!!

Plus there are Templates for "very Old Film"; "Low Quality Colour"; Circa 1908 and 1980.

Try 'em

Grazie

Did you try the VLC player?

Previous versions of Blackmagics Decklink HD Pro were compatible with Vegas for both capture and preview - the new Decklink HD Extreme is not.

The HD Extreme needs the 5.1.1 drivers - Vegas can only operate with the 4.8.1 drivers. We learned the hard way - and I think Blackmagic could be a little more clear on this issue on their site...

It seems to me that Vegas has no native SD uncompressed 4:2:2 support - Premiere Pro has and works perfect with this card.

/Magnus

hey Grazie, what would be good would be to have all those standard ol film fx AND maybe a script interface to access teh sample rate.. all in the one filter... now THAT would be good...

as for me being an android... well i can tell u one thing, i dont dream of electric sheep... lol

Oh another not so bad film look is the Magic Bullet MisFire.. awesome quality, BUT, not cheap (render and cash wise) BUT, for the same money, u can grab Edius Pro3 and do virtually the same film filters all in realtime... I actually use Edius as an FX box simply due to its performance.. edius as an NLE.. well.. i wont comment.. but neither of these will emaulte that frame skipping youre wanting :)
Again, vegas is king..

I wonder if we can put 50fps XDCam HD footage and undercrank to 0.50 to get full realtime slowmo... hmm...

Just got my FX1e and shoting in 1080-50i now. The playback on the FX1e looks great when I tested it on a CRT TV. (I cant imagine the beauty on a HDTV yet!) However, the workflow below gives gives an average one drop frame, why?

1. Import to Vegas6d via Firewire, internal HD capture.
2. Render to cineform intermediate 1080-50i.avi
3. Import avi on timeline, edit and render.

I notice the drop frame in the avi. I am checking on the m2t now. I used a new Panasonic Pro tape (it isnt HD). I thought if there are drop frames I should notice it during my playback on the TV? If yes this means it occured during the capture. I'm capturing direct to my internal 300GB HDD enabled with DMA. My PC is 3.0GHz single core, 2GB Ram. Please advise, I have a wedding in 2 weeks!!

Whilst learning Vegas and doing various projects, I have saved various set-ups as (1) render templates, (2) video track fx presets and (3) event pan/crop presets.

Now that I'm through with many of those user-saved templates/presets, I would like to clean up those menus and delete the ones I no longer need. Unfortunately, despite searching this forum and the Vegas instruction manual, I have been unable to discover how to do that.

Suggestions?

Thanks in advance.

Open the Effects dialog or Render As - Custom dialog. Now select the preset you no longer wish to have. Click on the "X" to the right of the preset name. Repeat until all unwanted presets are gone.

Thanks very much Edward (I never even saw that "X" before).

I am an idiot.

ive done a heap of RnD for flash into PP2, best export is SWF from
flash then do a conversion to Uncompressed AVI. using a third party prog
(AE, or free ware tools) Then import.

If you do a Flash export to UNcompressed AVI any animations in MC's will
not show up.

I am having problems with programs edited in Vegas 6d and burned through DVDA3.

Default PAL settings to render the program to mpeg2 eventuate with a washed out image, sharpness of image is lost [expesially when compared to the original] and the black levels are to high [ie not black].

With the help of a friend on another group I tried setting to CBR 8,000,000 and Best setting 31.[this is in PAL]
Analyzing it, I see the black levels are still too high, ie not black, the image lacks contrast [possibly because of the reduced black level] and saturation is down.
Also I notice the pans and tilts are not smooth, a slight jitter in pans, even slow ones, and on a static shot with objects moving across screen.

Also an interlace flicker. The type you get when doing an NTSC / PAL conversion- you can actually notice the interlace lines on moving the top and sides of objects. Yet all this has been done in the what seems to be correct PAL settings in Vegas and DVDA 3.

All scenes were colour corrected using Vegas 6d CC, Secondary CC, vectorscope and waveform. We see that the scopes are set to Studio 16-235. Our DVD's are for screening on a TV, not computer screens so should we uncheck that box? I just did so and notice the blacks are now upped about 10%, from 0% when checked for 16-235 setting. After all we did do the CC for 16-235.[7.5 IRE is not checked as that's for NTSC right?].

Another test. Rendered the same CC'd timeline to avi then to tape. The scenes fed to the same monitor [same as used for DVD to screen] shows better contrast [better blacks] and better colour saturation. So peeling back the layers, it appears i have a problem in the transfer from Vegas timeline to mpeg2 render or in the actual burn.

BTW, how valuable do you find the Colour Curves Fx plugin? I've just used it and it looks like a very efficient way of getting good results quickly.

I'd appreciate your thoughts.

Try adding the color corrector, with the "studioRGB to computerRGB" preset. Burn a DVD and view it on the same monitor. Do the levels look right then?

2- Wrong field order may explain why you have interlace artifacts? Try the other field order in that case.

Thx Glenn

We are already in PAL land where I have set the fields to Lower first. I haven't done the test yet [reversing the field]. Why would changing it help when the PAL default is lower?

When changing the CC to "studioRGB to computerRGB"...wouldn't that change the colour/contract to look its best on a copmuter moniotr...which is what i don't want. I need these programs to be seen on a Tv screen.
hx very much anyway.

Hi. I have had issues that sound similar to yours, when burning DVDs from MPEG2s rendered in Vegas. I'm using Roxio DVD builder to burn the DVDs, but I also get the super washed out blacks. So far, still have not solved that problem. My blacks also tend to go noticably green.

Seems like everything looks right if I watch the MPEG 2 on my computer monitor, but once I have a burned DVD, that's where the problem is, I guess. I haven't tried watching a burned DVD on my computer, I don't think. I've just been living with it, so far.

For we are the music makers, and we are the Dreamers of Dreams

Sorry Peter - This was quoted by Willy (genius that he was) - It is the first two lines of "Ode" by Arthur O'Shaugnessy. Another is "movers and shakers" - Dont know if that was original at the time but it's this first place I saw it. It's one of my favorite pieces.

Yeah I've been getting pretty fed up with Vegas lately. It's beginning to feel like a child's NLE. The video in the preview looks beautiful then when I render it to 24p (2-3pulldown) or various other templates I get a slew of visual problems like creases, flickering lines, wavy interlace artifacts, over saturation, bad motion, loss of sharpness, changed aspect ratio, flipped upside down footage, etc.
I've used VLC and Windows Media Players.
I'm about ready to give up on this. Can anyone suggest a Windows NLE that can handle HDV better?

Hi

I need to create a PIP effect - the Vegas manual suggests using track motion - which is easy enough - but this means the entire track has that motion property which I realise isn't a problem if there's nothing on the track but it seems a bit of a waste of a track.

Is there somthing I'm missing?

Thanx

Ian

if the picture inset doesn't need to follow something on the screen, just scale down a second video layer and let it buck...maybe a border under it or something to separate.

You can always keyframe track motion to only affect that area. Or you can use Pan/Crop to create the PIP.

It may be that the DVD encoder wants to see computerRGB color space instead of studioRGB. If that is the case, feeding it studioRGB will make the image look washed out / lacking in saturation (blacks too grey, white too grey).


We are already in PAL land where I have set the fields to Lower first. I haven't done the test yet [reversing the field]. Why would changing it help when the PAL default is lower?
You might want to see what the setting is on the encoder side. Maybe it's thinking the footage is upper field first?

Just a shot in the dark there.

Hi. I have had issues that sound similar to yours, when burning DVDs from MPEG2s rendered in Vegas. I'm using Roxio DVD builder to burn the DVDs, but I also get the super washed out blacks. So far, still have not solved that problem. My blacks also tend to go noticably green.
How are you viewing the burned DVDs? How was the monitor calibrated? (If it was calibrated.)
Sometimes DVD players will have incorrect levels.
Their video levels can also differ from your DV camera/device... so if you calibrated the monitor to your DV camera, the DVD player images may look wrong.

Maybe, but I've watched my stuff on multiple plain old TVs, and it's always those same issues.

Another small update (now at version 5.0.1) has just been released. It fixes a couple of minor issues that were recently discovered. You can get the update from http://www.jetdv.com/excalibur and clicking on the "Download" button. 5.0.1 can be safely installed over 5.0.0.

The only thing that I can see would be the capture to an internal drive that is also running your Windows OS. I capture everything directly to an external 160 Gig 7200 rpm firewire drive and the only time I am have a dropped frame issue is when other programs are running. Be sure that only the capture utility is running and everything else is closed.

Hello all,

I've been a long time Premiere user (over 5 years) and I've recently switched to Vegas 6.0d. There are many little things about the software that I'm having trouble finding in the manual and help files that I can EASILY do it Premiere and other quirks that Vegas does that makes no sense...here goes:

Trimming and playback:
When I playback my video on the trimmer or my timeline, I'm accustomed to the playback marker to stop at the same spot I hit STOP. For example, I'm playing back 2 minutes of a 10 minute video. Once I've seen enough and I hit the spacebar to stop the playback at 2 minutes, the marker goes back to where I started playback, it doesn't jump to the moment I stoped it in!

WHY?! It's annoying. Is there a setting I can change to adjust that?

I also wish there was a RAZOR tool. That's a very handy tool and makes cutting SO much easier.

I also dislike how a lot of the easily accesible tools such as audio fading and video fading are a little more hidden than they need to be.

My biggest gripe is the the playback thing.

Other than these minor issues, the program is AWESOME. I don't regret the switch. It's definately going to take some time to get use to, but it's a great prog. Overall, I'm very happy with it.

First of all, welcome to the great world of Vegas.
Now to deal with your minor issues.

I'm accustomed to the playback marker to stop at the same spot I hit STOP.

Options - Preferences - General
Make Spacebar and F12 Play/Pause instead of Play/Stop

I also wish there was a RAZOR tool.

There is. It's the 'S' key (for Split).

I also dislike how a lot of the easily accesible tools such as audio fading and video fading are a little more hidden than they need to be.

What could be easier than moving the cursor up to the top left or right corner of the clip (till it changes to a 1/4 circle shape) and dragging it?

BTW, I highly recommend downloading Edward Troxel's excellent series of newsletters (pdf format) at http://www.jetdv.com/vegas/forum/viewforum.php?f=5&sid=24cc28a817d65cbb93623c02dabff541

Mike

***edit: HAH! Mike K. types faster...***

...When I playback my video on the trimmer or my timeline, I'm accustomed to the playback marker to stop at the same spot I hit STOP. For example, I'm playing back 2 minutes of a 10 minute video. Once I've seen enough and I hit the spacebar to stop the playback at 2 minutes, the marker goes back to where I started playback, it doesn't jump to the moment I stoped it in!


Use the "enter" key instead of the space bar for that behaviour. Not sure if you can flip the space bar to "pause" instead of "stop", but I seem to remember a pref for this?

I also wish there was a RAZOR tool. That's a very handy tool and makes cutting SO much easier.


Position the cursor appropriately and hit the "s" key (for "split"). I do a lot of timeline editing, it's very handy and largely equivalent to a razor tool. There are various interactions having to do with which tracks or events/clips have focus (are highlighted).

I also wish there was a RAZOR tool. That's a very handy tool and makes cutting SO much easier.

I also dislike how a lot of the easily accesible tools such as audio fading and video fading are a little more hidden than they need to be.

In addition to opacity and volume envelopes, which I assume you're using, there are *very* handy tools available for fadeups and fadedowns of audio and video. Access them by hovering over the upper-right corner of a clip on the timeline. Look for your cursor to display a little quarter-circle, when it does, click and drag to the left. Voila, a fadeout of audio or video. Same same for a fade-in at the other end of the event. Look closely at the teeny yellow window that appears while you click and drag, it will display the frames and seconds of your fade.

Other than these minor issues, the program is AWESOME. I don't regret the switch. It's definately going to take some time to get use to, but it's a great prog. Overall, I'm very happy with it.

Me too! Enjoy...

I found the shortcuts sticky in this forum very helpful.

In particular:
CRTL + ALT over a fade/transition will do roll editing.
ALT over stuff does slip editing.

Thanks guys!

Options - Preferences - General
Make Spacebar and F12 Play/Pause instead of Play/Stop

It's funny 'cause I looked over that option so many times and never bothered to check it.

Position the cursor appropriately and hit the "s" key (for "split"). I do a lot of timeline editing, it's very handy and largely equivalent to a razor tool. There are various interactions having to do with which tracks or events/clips have focus (are highlighted).

This is great! It's definately better than a Razor tool. Saves the trouble of having to activate it first then cut with your mouse. Just position and S!

As for the opacity and volume controls, I was talking about Automation, rather than just clicking and dragging the edge of an event. Yes, the click and drag tool is VERY useful for fade in/outs, but NOT for fades in between the even (without having to split). Took me a while to figure out I had to select "Show Automation Controls" in order to do fades in between the beginning and end of the same event.

Thanks again for the clarification guys, this definately makes the experience a WHOLE lot funner AND easier.

::thumbs up to vegas::

I'm interested in vegas for use with an HD100.

1) which version works? 5.0?

2) can hdv be edited natively in vegas with success? (I don't do a lot of fx)

3) which intermediary codecs work in vegas? What's the advantage to an intermediary codec?

4) why do they call it vegas anyway?

Ok, I've searched the forum and read all the network rendering threads so as not to be redundant, but I can't seem to figure out my little problem. I've used the NRS before, and successfully, but after reinstalling Win XP and Vegas on my second machine, I can't seem to get it working again. I've set up file mappings, machine number two is listed as ready in the renderer tab window, I start the render (to wmv, btw), it says it's starting, the project file appears in my final output folder, machine two's hdd light starts flickering, NRS on machine two says it's starting, machine one says it's queued and ready, but it doesn't go past that point. No error messages or anything.
Any ideas?
Vin

It may be that WMV can't be network rendered? Have you tried rendering to something else (i.e. DV, Sony YUV) and then rendering a WMV out of that?

yeah, Glenn, simplified it down to a 20 sec avi clip, no fx, directly in one of the shared folders, not even in a subfolder, NRS on both pc's state ready, then starting....but it doesn't go from there. I'm stymied. I'm not even trying to do distributed networking, just to have machine 2 render while I continue to edit. Not too much to ask, right?

hmm..it could be due to other applications. Anyway I tried HDV spilt & it worked perfectly.