Your hard drives won't bottleneck you unless it's a simple render, it which case it'll be real-time anyways. You may do some stuff where you need to do simple renders a lot... but usually not.

There's a few threads on what things affect performance...
the short story is that it depends mainly on your CPU, although some other things are worth doing to squeeze a little extra performance out of your system (not using PIO mode, getting RAM to run dual channel, eliminating other possible bottlenecks).

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37831
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18784

There are also a bunch of threads on rendertest.veg, which allows you to bench your system. Check out the Sony forums for lots of threads on that.

okay, referred back to this again and will give some suggestions there a shot...

begs the question: if cf24 etc. is using different pulldown schemes, could not Sony software team tweak the 2-3-3-2 pulldown scheme used for handling 24pA from DVX to now handle whatever the Sony FX1/Z1 is doing...?

gosh, wish I took that weekend course in C++...

Edward Troxel has a newsletter that contains a wealth of basic (and not so basic) Vegas features. it's a great place to start.

http://www.jetdv.com/vegas

Go to the Newsletter Archive section.

Good luck.

Dennis

Well, I am finally finished with my Oak Ridge Reservation DVD. It is 36 minutes in length and in three parts (menues). I must say, this was my first one done on Vegas 5 and I LOVE IT. Vegas is smooth, easy to use and the sound is beautiful. Thanks to all of you that helped to convince me that Vegas is the way to go. Bob

Has anyone done any quantitative price/performance analysis comparing 2 CPU workstation performance vs. 2 networked desktop platform performance for rendering large projects in Vegas?

Using the very latest CPUs, i.e. Opterons vs. Athlons or 2P Xeon (800 MT FSB) vs. similar HT P4s?

Some of the potential tradeoffs:

Xeons are usually more expensive than the Desktop parts
Workstation system requires more expensive chassis/power supply
2x Desktops means 2x chassis/hard disks/etc.
Network latency for 2x desktop config
Workstation CPUs/chipsets usually lag desktops in terms of high frequency FSB/memory support

i downloaded Divx player and installed the codec. i can play Divx, which i think means that the codec has been successfully installed, but for some reason, rendereing to Divx in vegas is not an option.
i found a thread saying that once the Divx codec is installed, it should be available as one of the .avi templates. did i misunderstand something? what am i doing wrong?

To have avalible output in divx format you also need instal divx encoder.
http://www.divx.com/divx/drdivx/

It is not available as a template; you have to create one yourself. First install the encoder; xvid or divx should be fine.

it might be my ignorance to the whole deal with file types and compression. but i'm still not clear on what i should be doing to render a piece of video on vegas to Dvix.

i just downloaded the codec and encoder (or whatever) from the site vovka listed. installed it. now what?

sorry for being so helpless. i wish i could understand more. searching google on the subject just gave me lots of techy info which gets me dizzy just looking at.

thanks...

1-make sure you deselect "Ignore 3rd party codecs" in PREFERENCES
2-go to file/render as/avi
3-select CUSTOM button
4-select VIDEO tab
5-slect DiVX in the dropdown list

this example for avi
File->Render As->Select Avi output->Custom button(this will open custom template)->select Video tab->Video format (drop down selector) chose DiVX.
Recomendation if you downloaded drdivx, best preformance, render non compressed and use dr divx encoder for best result.

Hehe, Bill Ravens outpost me, in time i submitet, fill like lost bid in ebay :))))

I prepared my project with DVDA-2 and save the audio and video file in a specific place. Then I use nero to burn, I locate my audio and video file for nero. this is because DVDA don't recognize my external dvd burner. I go and burn, 1/10 of the way through the burning process it stops and displayed the error message and it dont tell me why. Can anyone help? This is frustrating me! Thank you. Anyone uses Nero 6?

Kevin,
Of all the Vegas5 training books and DVDs that I have I like Douglas Spotted Eagle's V5 Editing Workshop book and Gary Kleiner's V5 and DVDA2 training DVDs best (I don't have Edward Troxel's DVD although I have pasted his newsletters into the back of Spot's book and use them as supplement chapters). They are all excellent to get you up and going, although the DVDs are faster because you don't have to read; just watch, listen and do. But as far as content, it's hard to beat Spot's Vegas5 book (and it has a bonus DVD that includes mucho ACID loops, video files, stock stills, motion backgrounds, sample veg files, and more). I only wish there was a Vegas users group in the Houston area.

First of all, I'm assuming you mean the Video_TS and Audio_TS FOLDERS (not "file")? If yes, then they should contain the proper files for the DVD prepared by DVDA.

You then open Nero, start a new DVD project, add these two folders, and tell it to burn. If Nero can't burn to the blank DVD, you'll probably have to ask Ahead Software for help.

CF24 in Z1 uses plain 2:3 pulldown. The problem is it's upper field first and Vegas can't handle it.

If you flip your footage vertically you get lower field first. Then you can take out the 24p by taking out the 2:3 pulldown.

But it's not really worth it. The FX1 doesn't shoot with a clean 24p timing. It's just some fake 30 fr/sec to 24fr/sec by skipping frames. Very stuttery. I had an example a while back online, but I took it out and can't find it anymore. It showed a constant moving bike, After getting the clean raw 24p footage, it was very stuttery.

Barry Green saw it to and can confirm this also.

Frank

Not very many people have either setup so it's hard to get data on them. However...
A- There are rendertest.veg results for dual processor systems. At rendertest.veg, the second processor does very little.
B- There are also data on network rendering... there are a few caveats to network rendering:
Your project is split into chunks, which doesn't always end up with the rendering load distributed. One computer might get the first portion of the project where all the complex rendering is, while the second computer gets the easy stuff. The overall render will have to wait on the first computer. Also, both computers should be roughly balanced in terms of processing power.

There's a "stitching" process where the rendered (.avi) file has to be assembled on a host computer. This is an additional step in the end.


There are some cases where a single processor computer can outperform 2 computers network rendering. For Vegas, a single processor system (the faster the CPU the better) is by far the best bang for your buck.

After that, cost effectiveness drops dramatically (EE/FX version processors are quite overpriced, duals are expensive and not much faster, and network rendering is sometimes faster and sometimes slower).

An overclocked single processor system is definitely the best bang for your buck, but you need to make sure it's stable. It's a tossup as to which of the following is fastest (depends on what you do and how you test):
An overclocked single processor system
A dual processor system
2 systems network rendering

(Obviously 2 overclocked systems network rendering is even better)

2- For MPEG2 encoding (for DVD), a dual processor system is fastest. There are also hardware cards available to speed up DVD encoding (those don't go with Vegas).

Sorry if this is a FAQ or is well documented somewhere, but I've run several google searches and a few searches here and can't seem to find an answer to this.

I'm a long time user of Premiere and since much of my content is destined for web distribution I have to use a fairly arduous and time consuming process to get the results I want.

Once I edit all of my footage and am happy with the final results, I render it in full NTSC res using HuffYUV to try to keep a lid on disk usage.

Then, since the resizing algorithms in Premiere and pretty much everything else sucks, I use avisynth or virtual dub to scale the video to my target size, also using one of these to deinterlace if necessary (now that I have an XL2, not so much...). So i have a 2nd intermediate file that I then use to feed into Microsoft's Windows media encoder. One good thing about Windows Media Encoder utility is that I can tell it that I want the distribution format to be set such that the files can be played almost as soon as you start downloading them, assuming you have a fast enough connection to keep the buffer full. This is not the same as streaming, but close. The beauty of this is that i don't have to set up a farm of streaming servers to maintain - i simply use standard web servers and it works great.

With Vegas I was hoping to streamline this process, and have rendered several clips directly to WMV, skipping all the intermediate rendering, with pretty good results (though I'm not sure the scaling is as good as avisynth/vdub). But I can't find a way to tell it to encode the clips such that they can be downloaded and played progressively. Please tell me I'm overlooking something, and if I'm not, please tell me there's a way I can convert the streams to this format after they've been rendered.

I sure hope I can dump my old workflow because it's agonizingly slow.

thank you.
kp

it's been awhile since i used the microsoft wm encoder, so i'm having a hard time visualizing how you told it to start playing the files as soon as they start downloading.

what you could be referring to is the wm9 fast streaming technologies, which include fast start, fast cache, and fast reconnect... but i think that those only work if you are using true streaming from a microsoft streaming video server(??)... they essentially allow you to do things like initally buffer the video stream much quicker than the bitrate of the video itself, before it actually starts playing.

if you have seen delays in the way that http streaming functions because of settings in the wm9 encoder, please let us know the exact details.

also, be aware that every user has the ability to change the cache settings in their individual windows media player.

I found out what the problem is, for some reason It messes up if I burn in 4x speed but it does fine if its 2x. My dvd's and the burner states 4x but i guess I'll have to burn in 2x speed. Thanks.

I've been exporting from Premiere Pro directly to WMV 9 to put on my web site, and it plays fine via http. Windows Media Player will buffer a few seconds and then start playing the video as the rest downloads in the background. I've never had a problem, and haven't changed any buffer settings in Windows Media Player.

Well, I was just testing some older WMV videos on another site I did, and they didn't stream. But I think I know why; those videos aren't referenced via a WVX file (a WVX file is a text file that references your video and lets Windows Media Player know that it should be streamed).

To learn more about how to make a WVX file see http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/howto/articles/webserver.aspx#webserver_topic4e. Scroll down a little more than halfway to the section "To create a Windows Media metafile."

By the way, there is a graph on that page comparing a Windows Media server to a normal HTTP server, and it says a normal server can't stream a WMV file, but like I said, it works fine for me.

Thanks.

I'll look into the wvx file. The only thing I know is that with the windows media encoder utility, using the New Session Wizard (pops up automatically when you launch it) you get to choose "how you want to distribute your content"

the choices are:
File download (computer playback)
Hardware devices (CD, DVD, portable)
Windows Media server (streaming)
Web server (progressive download)
Windows Media hardware profiles
Pocket PC
File archive

when you select the "Web server (progressive download)" option, all you have to do is drop the files on your webserver. Then when a user clicks a link, it automatically launches windows media player and starts playing the file as soon as it has downloaded a "stub" of it, and downloads the rest in the background, but you're able to view it as it downloads (assuming there is sufficient bandwidth for delivery). If you choose the first "File download" option, you get the same simple format that Vegas seems to spit out. Which means when you link to it on your website, and a user clicks that link, the browser will download the file in its entirety, and THEN it passes it to Windows Media Player. Not only does this make the end user wait that much longer to start viewing, but a lot of times the player can't play the file, for whatever reason. So then you have to right click the link, downloading it in its entirety again while saving it to disk locally, and then go find it and play it with the media player. I was hoping there would be a simple way to instruct Vegas to build the "progressive download" version instead.

But to avoid all the other headaches, the .wvx file may be less painful than reverting to the old multi-step process.

Sounds normal, especially glow is a very slow process. I assume
you want good quality? Good quality is expensive in terms of time.
That's just the way it is.

From what I understand you are rendering out to AVI format when
you have that problem? To what codec are you rendering (AVI is
not a codec!)?

Which version of Vegas are you running? Latest update? What
Operating System? Are you running any background software like
anti-virus etc.? It could be your PC is getting too hot (cooling is
in sufficient).

Rendering multiple sections is definitely possible.

Is it better to render out 24p in Vegas before I color correct, add effects, etc instead of just converting to 24p during final render with all the other effects?

Better in what way? Vegas does the 24p pulldown on the fly if
you set it all up correctly. You can't output to 24p DV AVI either
since that will produce the exact same file as you already have
(30p with pulldown flag) so you would need to use another
format like uncompressed AVI. In the end I don't really see what
the point would be.

<<<-- Originally posted by Rob Lohman : Better in what way? Vegas does the 24p pulldown on the fly if
you set it all up correctly. You can't output to 24p DV AVI either
since that will produce the exact same file as you already have
(30p with pulldown flag) so you would need to use another
format like uncompressed AVI. In the end I don't really see what
the point would be. -->>>

The AVI I have made after converting to 24p certainly looks like 24p.

Okay, I have a project (first one) that required 16:9 (shot on XL2). When I attempt to capture, I get dropped frames (never had that happen with 4:3).

When I saw dropped frames being counted, I stopped the capture. The following message appeared:

"Refer to the Video Capture online Help for tips on how to optimize performance." I did and it suggested:

"Defrag capture hard disk." I did.

"Do not run other programs." I wasn't.

"Turn off audio preview." I did.

"Completely turn off preview." I did...

... and I still got dropped frames.

The capture card is an (ADS) Texas Instruments OHCI compliant IEEE 1394 host controller. Windows XP Pro, Vegas 5.0, project set for "NTSC DV Widescreen (720x480, 29.970 fps), pixel aspect ratio 1.2121." What have I missed?

Oh, I'm capturing from a Sony DSR-30.

What can I do to correct the problem. Any help is greatly appreciated!

Jay

It appears to be an issue with the DSR-30. When I tried a capture using the XL2, as suggested by Douglas Spotted Eagle, it worked just fine--no dropped frames.

Anyone else using the DSR-30 experiencing this same problem? If so, were you able to resolve it? If so, how'd you do it?

Thanks!

Jay

Was it dropping frames because of the capture program or because of Windows? For example, the other day I was capturing using Scenalyzer Live and about 30 minutes in the hard drive would suddenly come on SOLID and resulted in dropped frames (20 minutes the next time, 50 minutes the next time). I believe Windows was doing something during that time.

I have captured subsequently and not experienced that problem. One thing I DID do afterward was turn of the "indexing" on that drive.

Good question, Edward. Truth is, I don't know. I was using Vegas and its capture program.

How is "indexing" turned off on a hard drive?

Jay

Open "My Computer", right-click the drive, choose Properties, at the bottom is a checkbox for:

Allow Indexing Service to index this disk for fast file searching

Also there is: Compress drive to save disk space.

I have BOTH unchecked now.

Edward, I tried that and for a few seconds I thought it was going to work... but it didn't.

Thanks anyway.

Jay

Ok, I found the tutorial by Douglas Spotted Eagle where he says to render clips to 24p before doing any effects, color, etc.

The result does look smoother. Vegas does a good job in my opinion.

I've done some testing, and here are the results.

Video exported directly from Vegas (in my case I used the Vegas 5 trial) can be streamed fine via http. There is a caveat, however. The video will start streaming okay if launched from Internet Explorer 6, but surfers like me who use an alternative browser will not get the video streamed if the wmv format is not included in the mime settings on the server.

Mime settings let a browser know how to handle file types. In the case of a wmv file the server would let the browser know that the video should be passed off to Windows Media player, thus avoiding downloading the file. Windows Media player would then take care of streaming the file itself.

A wvx file is not needed.

The mime settings for different web servers are at http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnwmt/html/mime.asp.

If your web host allows you to configure an .htaccess file you can add the wmv extension yourself. Otherwise you will have to ask them to configure it for you.

What he meant in the tutorial is for non 24p footage that is being converted to 24p in Vegas - he's recommending that you first render it to 24p, then worry about correcting, etc. For example, I have a DVX100A which already creates 24p footage, so no rendering would be necessary for me when working with 24p in Vegas.

<<<-- Originally posted by Imran Zaidi : What he meant in the tutorial is for non 24p footage that is being converted to 24p in Vegas - he's recommending that you first render it to 24p, then worry about correcting, etc. For example, I have a DVX100A which already creates 24p footage, so no rendering would be necessary for me when working with 24p in Vegas. -->>>\

Yes, I was not clean enough in my original post.

I was converting from 60i to 24p and it looks good inside Vegas. :)

It's not because it's upper first, it's because it's not DV, and Vegas 5 only does pulldown removal on DV. You can downconvert HDV CineFrame 24 to DV and remove the pulldown if you wish.

///d@
Sony Media Software

Hi all,


Just upgraded from 512 ram to 1 go , dual channel and I can see a big difference on the overall performance of my computer but when I am in Vegas and want to set the preview screen to "best full" it is still jittery.


Am i setting something wrong here or this is just the way it is because the footage hasn't been rendered yet. One could wonder that with 700-750 meg of free ram the previews would look good even at full but obviously that is not the case.

Thanks for your input


Philippe

I edit and output an widescreen AVI. Later I load the AVI into Vegas and output a MOV file and no matter what settings I pick I always end up with 4:3. I don't even see any "widescreen" settings. When I make a wmv I see options for both 4:3 and widscreen output.

Any advice?

More RAM isn't really a big aid when previewing UNLESS you RAM Render. Then the more RAM you have, the longer the smooth playback you can get.

BTW, "Best" isn't usually needed. Instead, stick with "Good". You really only need "Best" when using photos.

I haven't used Quicktime on a PC, only the Mac. But assuming that it's basically the same... Quicktime doesn't understand non-square pixels it seems. Your widescreen DV is still 720x480, but your NLE software or a 16:9 monitor knows that it has to stretch the pixels horizontally into the correct proportion.

But on a computer monitor (or any other square pixel device) Quicktime will just display 720x480 pixels. In fact, it isn't even 4:3 - that would be 640x480. AFAIK, if you want to create a widescreen Quicktime file you will need to render it in the proper aspect ratio for square pixels, and that would be 854x480. I can't tell you how to do this in Vegas, but I assume it would be somewhere in the Quicktime export options.

This is a frequent occurrence. When you have trouble burning at a high speed dropping down often fixes the problem. It could also be a media problem. Some DVD blanks just don't work at higher speeds even though they are rated as such.

Good luck.

Dennis

Thanks, I tried puting 854/480 into my project settings as well as making sure that ratio was in the render settings and still I cannot make a widescreen MOV file.

Any ideas from anyone else?

Good stuff Ed

Thanks

Also make sure that if you have "Microsoft Search" in your services
(under administrative tools) that is disabled as well.

Ah, that makes more sense. Heh.

I may sound naive but depending on my limited trials on vegas rpojects, if your original file is a 16:9, the pixel aspect ratio at the project properties should be 1.0926 for PAL and 0.90 for NTSC.

Greg: the project settings should be widescreen 16:9 in PAL or
NTSC. Don't change that!

When exporting QuickTime go to custom and then video tab.
Make sure frame size is set to custom frame size and set the
vertical to normal (which will be 480 pixels for NTSC or 576 for
PAL) or a lower value (which you usually want if you want to
put it up on the web!), usually 50%.

Then use then multiply the horizontal resolution (720 for both
PAL & NTSC) with the pixel aspect ratio number in the project
settings (which is 1.2121 for NTSC and 1.4568 for PAL 16:9).

This should be either 872 (NTSC) or 1048 (PAL). If you are using
a lower resolution take the same percentage out of the horizontal
resolution as well (usually again 50%).

Make sure the pixel aspect ratio on this screen is set to 1.0

This should get you a widescreen movie.

CPU speed is the primary thing behind the preview window speed
(if you are using DV)

hi.

i have a 2:30 minute clip which i edited on vegas and rendered to a 575MB PAL DV avi file.

i want to compress this file to a video file of no more than 8MB. so that it can be more or less easily e-mailed.

what would be the compression method and/or file format which produces the best video and audio quality and that can be viewed on the standered windows media player?


thanks.